Tate Brothers - Round 2

Ayahuasca said:
It's hard to tell if it's an excuse unless you know they've been diagnosed and how it presents in them. It affects people in different ways.

It's a neurodivergence and while it's usually not as severe as autism in terms of the impact it has on social communication, it can still impact their ability to communicate appropriately.

Kids do all sorts of things they shouldn't do and giving them a good smack, as I assume you meant by "and a joy good," is not the answer. Boomers, Gen Xers, and even many Millennials were raised with this kind of discipline and it still produced a lot of potty-mouthed miscreants who don't know right from wrong.

In my primary and secondary schools, there were numerous kids who swore at and even hit teachers in the 90s and 2000s.
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He said been diagnosed by the doctors but everyone knows he plays on it. His teachers admit but hey, he's been diagnosed so they are powerless.

Yes, we still have potty-mouthed miscreants who don't know right from wrong. But nowhere near as many you see now in school.

And those same people, life let's them know real fast when they step out of line in adult life.

You don't hear adult say "oh, I have ADHD that's why I said X and peed someone off."

Then don't expect to have a bloody nose or loose teeth.
 
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Nigel Kingdon said:
"Kids do all sorts of things they shouldn't do and giving them a good smack, as I assume you meant by "and a joy good," is not the answer."

Citation?

Discipline is essential in children. Done early enough a slap on the wrist (literally) is all thats needed. Children have a built in survival instinct that means they should not want to 'bite the hand that feeds' in a stable secure environment. I suspect it's last part that is missing.
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I think they meant to say "jolly good," i.e., a jolly good smack that would go beyond a slap on the wrist.

I didn't say discipline wasn't essential, but the method of discipline is important.

malachi said:
He said been diagnosed by the doctors but everyone knows he plays on it. His teachers admit but hey, he's been diagnosed so they are powerless.

Yes, we still have potty-mouthed miscreants who don't know right from wrong. But nowhere near as many you see now in school.

And those same people, life let's them know real fast when they step out of line in adult life.
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Unless you know the details and how it's affecting him, you have no idea if he's playing on it. Teachers are pretty powerless even when it comes to neurotypical kids.

It's hard to say if there are more of them these days, or if it's just the minority of kids with these behaviors who can get away with it more easily or for longer, and it's also spreading through social media.

Does it? There are plenty of adults in the workplace, etc. who still act like school kids, being overly aggressive, bullying, etc. who don't face any real consequences. Research overwhelmingly shows that physical punishment, such as smacking, has negative consequences, such as the externalisation of behaviour.
 
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THis kind of talk is as old as greek philosophers...

So that's it then? Seeing as the adult generation has effectively given up attempts at discipline this is just the future....
Kids connected to the internet 24/7 from 9 years old, being brainwashed by YouTube celebs and pimps and human trafficking aholes....

Nothing you can do.

Physical Punishment doesn't work apparently, says research, seemed to work for 2000 years or more. No point risking that a few kids react violently, better they all just act violently and carry on into the work world too.

When are we as a society gonna wake up and revert to an older less enlightened form of steering the younger generation?

Obviously I don't have kids so I can play devil's advocate and say this.

Do we have to just start issuing breeding licences and keep Nuclear families by law.

Ban children from the internet until age 13. Ban them owning mobile phones?

Are we just progressively progressing our entire civilization into oblivion to hold the moral high ground?

There's a bit of a brain dump in no particular order. Slightly off topic from Tate too. I just watched adolescence so I'm all fired up from that too. :p

Castrate kids at birth that will solve future problems

Or... Just accept there is wastage in every generation and hope they joing the infantry.
 
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Efour said:
Physical Punishment doesn't work apparently, says research, seemed to work for 2000 years or more. No point risking that a few kids react violently, better they all just act violently and carry on into the work world too.
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Excalty, one of the key things people responsed to is fear of physical pain. This is why we have wars through violence.

You can't reason with everyone with just using words. That includes kids.
 
Efour said:
Kids connected to the internet 24/7 from 9 years old, being brainwashed by YouTube celebs and pimps and human trafficking aholes....
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Onlyfans etc should be banned from any advertising, any mention of them on news sites etc..

It's grooming people for a future life of selling their bodies, look these women make millions a month, any idiot teenager can to.
95% of them probably make nothing, but now have nude photos all over the net..
Imagine back 15 years ago how shocked 99% of people would be if they knew someone local had nudes of them..

It's almost like nude photos mean nothing these days, has the stigma attached disappeared completely?


So much damage has been done by cam sites and only fans.


most these female "influencers" going to dubai etc.. people do realise its just sex trafficking right and they are prostitutes degrading themselves for rich guys? they aren';t going on the glamourous holidays they show....

It's basically grooming on a mass scale... like that woman was accused of for Epstein, except now they don't need to go to clubs and target people.


There's loads of willing idiots all over the internet putting their applications online and claiming to be influencers.
 
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Efour said:
Physical Punishment doesn't work apparently, says research,
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Well, it's better to have evidence based on reasearch than just feels I suppose

Efour said:
seemed to work for 2000 years or more.
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Your evidence that smacking "worked" for 2000 years or more?

I suppose you would also need to define "worked" in the case of what benefits you are aiming to achieve with reference to short and long term effects.

Ie: If smacking stops the Child being naughty at that point in time but led to impaired cognative, behavioural, social and emotional development in the long term - is that still working?
 
mid_gen said:
You were beaten as a child, weren't you?
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I tell you this, I was punished as a kid when I did something wrong. I also didn't disrupt my class, swear or lash out at my parents.

I come from a ethic background if you disrespected your elders. You know not to do it again. No ADHD to hide behind.

Thekwango said:
i hope you do not have children.
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Here we go :rolleyes:
 
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Freakbro said:
Ie: If smacking stops the Child being naughty at that point in time but led to impaired cognative, behavioural, social and emotional development in the long term - is that still working?
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Its a numbers game. If it works on 99% of kids then it's a net gain. There's always gonna be no hopers that respond to nothing.

This is going to be the most cliché thing ever but depending on what generation we are all from it's likely we got a smack or worse as kids and cliché alert, I think we all grew up fine right?

Most kids don't need any intervention. We can spends millions of pounds working out that little Johnnie's dad was a dead beat who left the family,
 
I got smacked as a kid, I don't think my dad ever hit me but my mum did usually with a slipper.

It gives you a bit of fear of being naughty knowing you might get a clip around the ears and sees you respect adults a bit more. ( I was around 13-15 and deserved it for getting arrested etc)

Obviously it doesn't work with everyone and some parents are just abusive, so it's probably for the best it got banned.


What mostly stopped me from doing illegal things was knowing I wouldn't enjoy prison at all and it was a real possibility back then.
I knew multiple people who had been to prison or young offenders institutes, now days it seems like a mythic rarity event.

people can do 100 crimes and still be outside having barely ever spent any time in prison.

the systems no deterrent at all, getting arrested is like bringing a book back late to the library on the scale of deterrents..



you can literally sell drugs and not even get a prison sentence... just a suspended
 
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malachi said:
I tell you this, I was punished as a kid when I did something wrong. I also didn't disrupt my class, swear or lash out at my parents.

I come from a ethic background if you disrespected your elders. You know not to do it again. No ADHD to hide behind.



Here we go :rolleyes:
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Have you considered that the fact your parents had to resort to violence to raise you is actually a failure on their part, rather than a virtue?

I didn't need to be beaten to know right from wrong, my parents were capable of communicating to me like...well...adults, with words.
 
arknor said:
Onlyfans etc should be banned from any advertising, any mention of them on news sites etc..

It's grooming people for a future life of selling their bodies, look these women make millions a month, any idiot teenager can to.
95% of them probably make nothing, but now have nude photos all over the net..
Imagine back 15 years ago how shocked 99% of people would be if they knew someone local had nudes of them..

It's almost like nude photos mean nothing these days, has the stigma attached disappeared completely?


So much damage has been done by cam sites and only fans.


most these female "influencers" going to dubai etc.. people do realise its just sex trafficking right and they are prostitutes degrading themselves for rich guys? they aren';t going on the glamourous holidays they show....

It's basically grooming on a mass scale... like that woman was accused of for Epstein, except now they don't need to go to clubs and target people.


There's loads of willing idiots all over the internet putting their applications online and claiming to be influencers.
Click to expand...

What nonsense is this?

If woman want to sell their bodies for cash, more power to them. It's their choice. They aren't being "sex trafficked" if it's of their own volition.

I've never even looked at Onlyfans, if there's men who are happy to pay for images and videos, more fool them.
 
mid_gen said:
Have you considered that the fact your parents had to resort to violence to raise you is actually a failure on their part, rather than a virtue?
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No because I turned out fine. Same with my brothers and many of my friends.

People these days think smacking and beating are the same. They are not.

Big difference between smacking someone and beating someone black and blue which is abusive. That's what people get wrong and go all :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek: When you mentioned physical disciplining your child for wrong doing.
 
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malachi said:
Excalty, one of the key things people responsed to is fear of physical pain. This is why we have wars through violence.

You can't reason with everyone with just using words. That includes kids.
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So when you can't get a child to do something using physical violence is an acceptable solution? Let me guess your parents hit you and 'it didn't do me no harm!'? All you teach a kid that way is that the strongest person always wins the argument which is a sad way to live life, is it ok to beat my wife if she is being unreasonable?
 
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