Poll: Official 2025 Saudi Arabian Grand Prix Thread - Jeddah Corniche Circuit, Jeddah- Race 5/24

[Scam]

The first corner event was normal wheel to wheel racing that happens in any genre of motor racing.
Yes I recall the Lawson one being shown..

It is normal yes, you’re not wrong. But if a car gains an advantage by going off track it is most often given back immediately, or punished. The leniency Max received for a first lap incident was the fact it was a 5sec penalty as opposed to a 10.

Tell me you didnt watch the F2 without telling me you didnt watch the F2.

Is that a requirement to comment now? Give over. RB played it wrong, they should have given up the place like most teams would have, and fought Piastri on track. But they think they’re above the law, so they didn’t.

But hey, it’s good that RB are being their usual good sportsmen about it.. It’s not like they’re throwing their toys out of the pram by demanding the stewards look at onboard footage today, and Max refusing to ask press questions about it eh

I’m calling it here, I think the way RB are reacting here makes me convinced the car is almost as fast as the McLaren and they think Max is in with a good shout at the WDC.

 

[Mesai]

The leniency Max received for a first lap incident was the fact it was a 5sec penalty as opposed to a 10.

He was punished exactly in line with the current rules, which is exactly what any other driver would have received.

It's not like he doesn't know the rules and they knew they weren't going to be able to overtake Oscar.

 

[Kenai]

He was punished exactly in line with the current rules, which is exactly what any other driver would have received.

It's not like he doesn't know the rules and they knew they weren't going to be able to overtake Oscar.

It would normally be a 10s penalty, as per Lawson later in the race but the stewards chose to reduce the penalty because it was the first corner of the race, so Scam is right, some leniency was applied on the basis of it being the first lap.

Ordinarily, the baseline penalty for leaving the track and gaining a lasting advantage is
10 seconds.
However, given that this was lap one and turn one incident, we considered that to be a mitigating circumstance and imposed a 5 second time penalty instead.

 

[Jono8]

No issues with how Max raced/does race for me, I enjoy the pure aggression, the willingness to go for the tiniest gap and refusal to give an inch - as always this is just my personal opinion. But you have to say, perfectly raced from Oscar, nice race craft - you have to just take your hat off.

Really? It's just cheating at the end of the day. It's not impressive or skillful to just stay ahead by going off the track...

Hell never stop doing it. That's just who he is, but it's the absolute opposite of impressive or praise worthy.

 

[Jono8]

I really don’t know how max got driver of the day he went backwards from his starting position and had penalty for breaking the rules…

Yeh, bizarre.

If anything, Leclerc was the most impressive today. Loads faster than Lewis, went really long on the first stint without losing much pace and only finished 7-8 secs off the lead in the end.

 

[Mesai]

It would normally be a 10s penalty, as per Lawson later in the race but the stewards chose to reduce the penalty because it was the first corner of the race, so Scam is right, some leniency was applied on the basis of it being the first lap.

Yea, that's why I said it was exactly the right penalty that any driver would have received. There's no special treatment so not sure what he was arguing about.

People forget that this is a sport. If you want to drive someone off the road knowing you'll get a slap on the wrist or a minor penalty, and keep an advantage, then they're going to do that. If you aren't exploiting the rules in F1, you're probably not going to win.

 

[Scam]

It's not like he doesn't know the rules and they knew they weren't going to be able to overtake Oscar.

Reading between the lines - it’s pretty obvious RB are peeved because they thought they’d figured out the “correct” way to engineer this, in case what happened happened. Judging by remarks made by Horner (I think), they had discussed the rules of engagement and thought if Max was “pushed “ off track then he’d not be penalised because it was the first lap. But they failed to realise that Oscar got a better start, was ahead at the apex and made a supremely clean pass. So for Max - staying ahead was gaining a lasting, unfair, undeserved advantage which had to be penalised.

 

[Scam]

If you aren't exploiting the rules in F1, you're probably not going to win.

In RB’s head maybe. Plenty of drivers have won WDCs by, you know, being the fastest driver over the course of the season and staying within the rules of the sport.

 

[Mesai]

Reading between the lines - it’s pretty obvious RB are peeved because they thought they’d figured out the “correct” way to engineer this, in case what happened happened. Judging by remarks made by Horner (I think), they had discussed the rules of engagement and thought if Max was “pushed “ off track then he’d not be penalised because it was the first lap. But they failed to realise that Oscar got a better start, was ahead at the apex and made a supremely clean pass. So for Max - staying ahead was gaining a lasting, unfair, undeserved advantage which had to be penalised.

RB know that it was a fair ruling, but they aren't going to come out and say they were in the wrong. Doubling down on it is the logical thing to do if you're trying to reduce risk and maximise points.

In RB’s head maybe. Plenty of drivers have won WDCs by, you know, being the fastest driver over the course of the season and staying within the rules of the sport.

That's a bit naive.

 

[Nick1881]

Max doing his usual tactic of braking too late to make the corner, then running wide and blaming someone else. Hilarious to see Horner with a picture of it printed out, trying to make out that max was ahead at the apex.

 

[Jono8]

Max doing his usual tactic of braking too late to make the corner, then running wide and blaming someone else. Hilarious to see Horner with a picture of it printed out, trying to make out that max was ahead at the apex.

I honestly think the FIA need to come down hard on him, every time he does it.

However, knowing Max's temperament he will probably still just keep doing it and take the penalty.

As someone mentioned earlier he just tries to play the game and work out if cheating will work out better in the long run. In this instance, it didnt pay off but he was probably no worse off for it in terms of race result in the end. Would have been a different story if it was a 10 second penalty.

 

[Jimbeam3678]

I think Oscar knows how to play Max, don’t respond directly to questions about Max. I really liked his response to the first corner incident - ‘there was no way I was giving that corner up when I was ahead at the apex’ and then very calmly dodged any follow up questions.

 

[Johnz0r]

Really? It's just cheating at the end of the day. It's not impressive or skillful to just stay ahead by going off the track...

Hell never stop doing it. That's just who he is, but it's the absolute opposite of impressive or praise worthy.

Senna drove the same but is the ultimate icon of our beloved sport?

 

[Jimbeam3678]

Senna drove the same but is the ultimate icon of our beloved sport?

People are always remembered better than they were, when they are no longer with us.

 

[Mesai]

Senna drove the same but is the ultimate icon of our beloved sport?

Schumi too. He was incredibly aggressive.

 

[Jono8]

Schumi too. He was incredibly aggressive.

I wouldn't count what Max's party trick is as aggressive though really. He just goes off the track to stay ahead.

It's no different to someone just cutting corners all the time to go faster/stay ahead.

 

[Feek]

Senna drove the same but is the ultimate icon of our beloved sport?

Yes he did and for many people, no he isn't, for exactly the same reason. Schumacher was the same. They both need to be remembered for what they did and how they drove and not martyred.

 

[wildman]

Schumi too. He was incredibly aggressive.

to the point where he tried to ram Hill so he could win the 1994 WDC and succeeded as he knackered Hills front suspension in the process, but people still think he was Jesus of F1. Verstappen isn't any different. Anyoen that also thinks all teams aren't actively looking at how to game the rules is also massivelt naive, The money potentially involved is astronomical and every team will look at how they can pick the rules appart to game an advantage even to the point of going over the line completely. History has shown this to be the case.

e.g Brabham 1981 hydraulic suspension to circumvent the min 6cm ride height rule, the couple of years in the 80's where there was massive rule bending using "water cooled brakes" so they could fit a massive water tank which they then promptly emptied to make the car lighter, the infamous tell your number 2 driver to crash scandal, Ferari using illegal barge boards in Malayasia in 1999, McLarens flexible rear wing, the examples are endless, redbulls endless shennigans, Brawns double deck diffuser which was a massive rule bend to game an advantage. F1 is literally littered with examples of dubious decisions by teams to effectively game / bend / break rules and try to get away with it.

 

[sidimmu]

Is that a requirement to comment now? Give over. RB played it wrong, they should have given up the place like most teams would have, and fought Piastri on track. But they think they’re above the law, so they didn’t.

But hey, it’s good that RB are being their usual good sportsmen about it.. It’s not like they’re throwing their toys out of the pram by demanding the stewards look at onboard footage today, and Max refusing to ask press questions about it eh

Not a requirement, but this whole reply ignores my point.
Everyone ignoring the massive contradiction in ruling from stewards between F1 and F2.

RB are reacting here makes me convinced the car is almost as fast as the McLaren and they think Max is in with a good shout at the WDC.

Oh, they're acting like defending champions?

 

[Kenai]

Everyone ignoring the massive contradiction in ruling from stewards between F1 and F2.

If F2 is permitting people to defend position by driving off the track to gain a lasting advantage, that's not the precedent we want F1 to be following.

Having not watched the F2, perhaps penalties were not dished out because the offending drivers still lost the place relatively quickly afterwards and so the 'lasting advantage' wasn't there.