AMD Zen 2 (Ryzen 3000) - *** NO COMPETITOR HINTING ***

[awaybreaktoday]

It is true, i agree and i'm going to ask you the same question, it hasn't been answered yet, if Intel didn't have better gaming performance, or rather 'higher clock speeds' but given gaming performance is the only thing that matters to you, what do they have? this is the point we have got to now, and they may lose the one thing they retain from that dominance very soon indeed, is that not stagnation?




Nice.

To me it means they already know the release date...... Must be releasing very very soon......

 

[humbug]

To me it means they already know the release date...... Must be releasing very very soon......

July 7

 

[Thekwango]

sorry how is that answering the question I posed?! my question as it has been from the start on this debate has been, who has delivered the top cpu's for the past decade?! I don't see any answer to that in the post you just quoted?!

 

[humbug]

sorry how is that answering the question I posed?! my question as it has been from the start on this debate has been, who has delivered the top cpu's for the past decade?! I don't see any answer to that in the post you just quoted?!

I've said this many times, in the original argument....

Sandy Bridge was fantastic, great CPU, that's when they dominated and i'm not taking anything away from that, Intel did a good thing with Sandy Bridge, but, what have they done since then? The same 4 core 8 thread CPU's on smaller and smaller nodes with incremental tiny IPC up lifts.

AMD have been out of it for a Decade, very true, but one cannot deny Ryzen with its multichip Infinity Fabric, number of CPU cores in the mainstream, the performance per watt, and levels of IPC equal to Coffeelake, back in 2016 AMD slapped Intel with a wet kipper and 3 years on they are not catching up on a technology level, AMD have been ahead since Ryzen and now pushing even further ahead, while Intel are stagnating.

Many other times in this thread.

Addressed your confusion here

I'm not going to read that wall of text, no time at this point. I'm not talking about "Intels dominance for the past decade" if you go back to where this argument started i made that point my self, the conversation i've been having is about Intel's stagnation against AMD pushing forward.

Why TF would i be arguing about "Intels dominance for the past decade" ? that's a given. How did you even arrive at this argument? its nothing to do with anything i have said.

What's your phone telling you?

 

[james.miller]

no it's not - not when you follow the debate I've been having. someone was called a troll/biased for saying intel have been delivering the top cpus for about a decade. they can't be a troll for stating a fact unless some in here have different definitions of bias/trolling.

In a thread about Ryzen you absolutely can. There is no need for such a statement, fact or not, in this thread because you know it's only going to go one way. You know it's going to wind people about and that is the very definition of trolling. Dg knows what he is doing - he's been doing it for long enough.

 

[Thekwango]

cheers, I genuinely missed that post - d'oh!
but.....

Many other times in this thread.

I have said multiple times that he may well be a troll but his statement about intel delivering was not worthy of him being called so.

Addressed your confusion here

no no mate no confusion. I have been steadfastly consistent in my posts that I have been questioning those who have tried to 'discredit' his claim that intel have delivered. so, midway (at a guess/approximately) through our debate you decide to ignore what I was talking about and wander off into an totally different debate - one which I couldn't counter in to because I pretty much agree with you. that's on you fella, if you want to ramble on about something different be my guest but can you leabe me out of it and quit quoting my posts then replying to something that's not in them??

What's you phone telling you?

aw come on why you got to keep trying to be a smart ass? what are you getting out of that, you think it'll annoy or wind me up or does it make you feel better? there must be a reason for that second little sly insult. why type out something that wouldn't say in real life mate - and don't reply saying you would. if you and I were sat down having this discussion over a beer or whatever you wouldn't tack a silly, childish little comment like that on at the end. unless of course you're not the age to have a beer - see I can do it too (that was a joke btw) - have a debate without descending into silly attempts at being rude/clever

 

[smilingcrow]

Oh boy, that escalated quickly. It's been so bad in this thread today that it's almost getting a bit like Westminster.
Maybe we should have a vote to see how many people have an "I Love Intel" tattoo and how many have an "Intel sucks tattoo"?
No doubt there will be disagreement after about the terms of the vote and some will demand a second one.
That can have multiple options such as "AMD rules but Intel are okay" etc and will take over 3 years to sort out.
By the time that's done Zen 5 will be out, AMD will be a subsidiary of Hawaii Five-0 (Huawei), Intel will be reduced to making silicon coasters for ironic LA Hipsters called the 14PLUS gang, America will be a dumping ground for Chinese and Russian waste and Teresa May & Nigel Farage will be appearing on Love Island which is being filmed on an active volcanic island; this was the final condition for leaving the EU which by this point had already been disbanded due to a legal technicality in the terms of Eurovision 2023. (Due to the civil war in the UK we hadn't even noticed).
As you were.

 

[humbug]

cheers, I genuinely missed that post - d'oh!
but.....

I have said multiple times that he may well be a troll but his statement about intel delivering was not worthy of him being called so.

no no mate no confusion. I have been steadfastly consistent in my posts that I have been questioning those who have tried to 'discredit' his claim that intel have delivered. so, midway (at a guess/approximately) through our debate you decide to ignore what I was talking about and wander off into an totally different debate - one which I couldn't counter in to because I pretty much agree with you. that's on you fella, if you want to ramble on about something different be my guest but can you leabe me out of it and quit quoting my posts then replying to something that's not in them??

aw come on why you got to keep trying to be a smart ass? what are you getting out of that, you think it'll annoy or wind me up or does it make you feel better? there must be a reason for that second little sly insult. why type out something that wouldn't say in real life mate - and don't reply saying you would. if you and I were sat down having this discussion over a beer or whatever you wouldn't tack a silly, childish little comment like that on at the end. unless of course you're not the age to have a beer - see I can do it too (that was a joke btw) - have a debate without descending into silly attempts at being rude/clever

My debate has not changed, its just not possible to deny Intel with the 9900K now and in the previous decade have had the performance dominance, they've had to sing along to AMD's tune to keep that lead in the last three years but i think we agree there too, i have made recommendations, several times in this room for people to get the Intel CPU's because they have or are getting a GPU that only the Intel CPU's would get the most out of.

My problem with Dg was not that i disagreed with with anything he said, i don't, at least not in a broad sense, he has a habit of exaggerating and he does that deliberately to get a rise out of people, my problem with that specific post was his crying at "AMD Fandom" i was pointing out the hypocrisy of it, he is the worst for fandom in this thread.

 

[Thekwango]

In a thread about Ryzen you absolutely can. There is no need for such a statement, fact or not, in this thread because you know it's only going to go one way. You know it's going to wind people about and that is the very definition of trolling. Dg knows what he is doing - he's been doing it for long enough.

that may be true of his other posts but this one didn't read like that to me.

just in case you haven't seen them i'll quote his original post and the post he was replying to. if someone in this thread is going to get all wound up about a post like that then, let's be honest. they've no business being in the thread - they anger management classes!! it was hardly trollish, baiting or such like. it's like what I said earlier, people decided to argue against the poster rather than the actual post. as someone else said earlier it's almost as if there's a cult like nature to this thread and for some reason it's been allowed to fester and grow. you dare not say anything even remotely negative towards amd. i'm quite sure he and others from both camps have said plenty of trolling/baiting posts but the below is hardly one of them.

Intel can release turd like the Pentium D and people will still buy them over superior AMD chips. ~50% oem market share is a loooong way off

the thing is intel deliver. they dont overhype they just give you what you need. this place will melt if amd screw this up.

 

[FoxEye]

Yeah I'm continually amazed people take sides. Intel vs AMD vs nVidia.

It's a chunk of silicon and other crap. It plays games and some other crap.

It's hard to get excited about let alone indoctrinated enough with either side's PR that you start waving banners around.

Crazy times we live in.

 

[smilingcrow]

They've had to sing along to AMD's tune to keep that lead in the last three years.

3 years!

 

[Scougar]

The only thing they dominated was the top end and specific gaming scenarios. AMD still have massive value in many segments, and that is blatantly being ignored for the sake of "perf king" status claims being thrown around. Yes, well done, Intel took the title if you had the money. That's it.

Intel have had some outstanding chips, and you should have swung that way if you had the money. If not, you needed to look at AMD. When Ryzen came, it completely decimated Intel's value in most scenarios. Again.. the perf king claim is attempting a trump here because it completely ignores value.

It seems Zen 2 will remove the vast majority of that crown and obviously we hope AMD won't try to be greedy. Lisa has already said time after that they want to up their prices my so I have my doubts.

 

[Thekwango]

My debate has not changed, its just not possible to deny Intel with the 9900K now and in the previous decade have had the performance dominance, they've had to sing along to AMD's tune to keep that lead in the last three years but i think we agree there too, i have made recommendations, several times in this room for people to get the Intel CPU's because they have or are getting a GPU that only the Intel CPU's would get the most out of.

My problem with Dg was not that i disagreed with with anything he said, i don't, at least not in a broad sense, he has a habit of exaggerating and he does that deliberately to get a rise out of people, my problem with that specific post was his crying at "AMD Fandom" i was pointing out the hypocrisy of it, he is the worst for fandom in this thread.

and that fella should have been about your second reply originally and we could have avoided all this silliness . pretty agree with everything you've said - I was just trying to point out that his statement that intel deliver is not one that anyone should or can argue against so there's no reason or point for that matter for people to be calling out troll etc (and not you specifically) glad we finally got that all sorted.....i'm knackered now, trying to keep up with you (plus a couple of others wanting to jump without having followed the trail) & 2 damn kids has left me ready for bed!

p.s. we all better hope to **** amd smash it out the ball park on Monday or dg is going to have a field day

 

[humbug]

and that fella should have been about your second reply originally and we could have avoided all this silliness . pretty agree with everything you've said - I was just trying to point out that his statement that intel deliver is not one that anyone should or can argue against so there's no reason or point for that matter for people to be calling out troll etc (and not you specifically) glad we finally got that all sorted.....i'm knackered now, trying to keep up with you (plus a couple of others wanting to jump without having followed the trail) & 2 damn kids has left me ready for bed!

p.s. we all better hope to **** amd smash it out the ball park on Monday or dg is going to have a field day

You did not see my reply to you, i guess that's why your subsequent reply to me didn't make any sense to me, a misunderstanding there and yes maybe i jumped the gun on that.

Peace

 

[Thekwango]

You did not see my reply to you, i guess that's why your reply to me didn't make any sense to me, a misunderstanding there and yes maybe i jumped the gun on that.

Peace

it's all cool mate. bring on R3K!!

 

[humbug]

Yes, Bring it on, I think i'll be getting one

 

[Thekwango]

oh and if any amd marketing dudes are watching this thread I only take bank transfer if you want to use R3K in your advertising - think it's quite catchy myself.

 

[EsaT]

that is irrelevant to the damn fact that intel have still produced the top cpu's for a decade.

Intel having used dirty and illegal tricks to keep AMD small is very relevant fact, if you want to point fingers at AMD for not being always able to compete.

And if Intel still delivered when not having to push performance, then where is that Intel "quality" when Intel CPUs are having constantly growing list of vulnerabilities?
Combined performance penalty from all security fixes must be by now major for some server workload scenarios.
After all those years of "Intel means quality and reliability" public image...

With Intel's resources and time they had it should have been easy to go through design to fix shortcuts taken earlier.
But they clearly didn't care a damn and took same path as Boeing with 737 MAX.

 

[EsaT]

intel have had the most dominant cpus for about 15 years and athlon xp chips where probably the last dominant amd chip.

AMD kept beating Intel many times and long during Netburst/Pentium 4 era. (except in heat output)
Leading Intel to using illegal methods to prevent fair competition.
For some time AMD even had similar market share in supercomputer CPUs to Intel because of better x86-64 CPUs:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Itanium#Competition

It was Core 2 architecture (+their usual node advance) which brought Intel back to top from that fiasco dozen years ago.
While AMD's small resources prevented them having good enough development program, eventually culminating to doing also mistakes in Faildozer.
(at that time AMD was struggling to improve fabs, because of inability to build big enough fab business in previous decade)

 

[Doogles]

AMD being on par with Intel is good for everyone, let's just leave it at that and move on I guess. Never understand people that don't like competitiveness, it's our pockets that sting if we have none.