Donald Trump

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Soldato
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Trump is terrified of mail in ballots or people voting who might not if they have to attend a voting booth in swing states. Again threatening to withhold funds from Michigan and Nevada (so it isn't just Ukraine that gets threatened with withholding Congressional appropriated funds) although he's more than happy for Nebraska, West Virginia and Georgia to send out requests for mail in voting.

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/499269-trump-escalates-fight-against-mail-in-voting
 
Soldato
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The problem, as always with Trump, is he himself made golfing a specific issue and made specific promises he hasn't kept.

As you say the issue could be classed as minor, the context just confirms his many faults.

Yes Trump made a big deal about Obama playing golf, promised that if elected he would be working too hard as President to have time to play golf, and then proceeded to play an awful lot of golf at an almost unfeasible cost (current estimate $134,000,000). However, what if that's because he's found that you don't need to work long hours to Make America Great Again? That you can knock it out of the park and still have time to watch trash TV and rant on social media. This is 2020 - do we want to encourage a culture of presidential presenteeism?
 
Soldato
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The fact that exculpatory evidence that was withheld proving Flynns innocence, ‘missing’ 302 and Kislyak transcript to come, resulting in the DOJ dropping the case might be the reason why we keep ‘pushing it’

Why do you want an innocent man go to prison so bad? Just so you can stick it to Trump?

You’re literally calling us nutjobs for going along with the government
Innocent of what? You still don't get it do you, the missing 302 (it's not missing, it's right here BTW (PDF)) and Kislyak transcript are immaterial to the case, like i said if he told the truth he probably would not have been charged over collusion with the Russia's, all he had to say is yes he contacted Kislyak, tell the FBI that was part of his job and that they discussed something, anything, other than the election, and they'd have nothing to charge him with.

How many time does it need saying before it sinks in, he was charged with making false statement to law enforcement officers not anything to do with Russia, it could've been phone calls he made to his god damn dentist it doesn't matter because he said he didn't make those phone calls when there's logs of him making those calls, it could've been phone calls he made to QVC, it doesn't matter because it's not about who he made the calls to or what he said on those calls it's that he said he never made those calls despite there being evidence that he did, is it starting to sink in yet?

And i don't want an innocent man sent to prison, however Flynn is not innocent, the guy has literally confessed to making false statements, twice.

Also I'm not calling you a nutjob for going along with the government, not that the Trump administration is the government but whatever, in fact IIRC I've never used the term "nutjob" on these forums, I'm saying that I get the feeling people like you are following click-bait articles from right-wing source (TBH I've never come across a hard right article that wasn't click-bait but that's a topic for another thread), that are pushing the Russia narrative because they know it helps them sell advertising space, because they know it attracts the attention of a certain demographic.

Look I'll try to make it as *simple as i can in one last hope that you'll understand: If you're called in for an interview with the police, doesn't matter what it's over, and they ask you if you phoned your mum on Sunday at such and such a time, if you tell them you did not speak to your mum at anytime on Sunday and they've got call logs to show that you did then you've just broken the law, you've broken the law because the police know you just made a false statement.

*I'm going to leave out a load of caveats due to over simplification.

I hate that this is what people want to latch on to. I despise trump but focusing on him playing golf is just pathetic.

Everyone needs exercise and it's a bit silly how we care so much about him golfing. (I appreciate how often he's done it is ridiculous mind.)

Just seems lazy that some media outlets want to bitch about the trivial stuff. It gives them less weight when they have real issues to report.
The reason they do it is because it shows the hypocrisy of Trump and the extent of his double standards, it's because before he became the POTUS he'd often moan about Obama playing golf to much, for example...
And at least another 27 times.

If you're going to throw rocks at someone you'd best be damn sure you don't go and do exactly the same thing yourself because if you do people will throw it back in your face.
 
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Soldato
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Maybe the strangest thing about all this is that the USA is doing relatively well in its response to the pandemic. Better than many countries have done. Better than the UK has done. The USA government's response has been pretty good. No doubt much of that is due to state government rather than federal government, but federal government has done at least a competent job. Yet the public face of the leader of the country is, to be very polite, not one that causes the word "competent" to come to mind.

How much power does the president of the USA actually have? They're pretty keen on checks and balances over there, so the position certainly has much less power within the country than that of PM here.



I agree. It's like someone has dropped their trousers and is shuffling around town with everything on display shouting "Bark Bark" and peeing on lamp posts...and some media outlets choose to focus on the fact that their socks don't match.

People don't care about the legal issues, the corruption, the collusion, it's complicated. Too much hard work to figure out what is true and what isn't.

Him being a workshy slacker poncing around on the golf course during a national emergency is simple and easy for everyone to understand. Hurts him more than the far more serious legal issues.
 
Caporegime
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It’s like beating a dead horse in the vain hope it gets up and starts running...this is exactly why this whole Flynn scandal is in the news yet again.
It’s also another way to deflect from the sheer ineptness of the Trump Presidency.

Thankfully majority of people aren’t falling for this nonsense, just the right whingers and CT lunatics.
 
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Thankfully majority of people aren’t falling for this nonsense, just the right whingers and CT lunatics

Which just isn't enough to get them a victory. What they don't seem to grasp is that all they do it turn people off trump. No one is being convinced that wasn't already, however anyone on the fence that just sees this endless garbage that they post will not be sold and be put off ever thinking of aligning their views with these guys enough to vote for trump. I don't know how monumental of a loss it'll be, I'm hoping for a big one, but am at least expecting a loss for trump. He has reached out to no one new. Just pushed people away while trying to keep a few core forever trumpers
 
Soldato
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It’s like beating a dead horse in the vain hope it gets up and starts running...this is exactly why this whole Flynn scandal is in the news yet again.
It’s also another way to deflect from the sheer ineptness of the Trump Presidency.

Thankfully majority of people aren’t falling for this nonsense, just the right whingers and CT lunatics.
I'm not a fan of Trump, and neither are those guys in the video I posted, but I'd say that if you aren't a little worried about how they went about this, and the years wasted on this false narrative, you're just as bad as the Trump supporters.
 
Caporegime
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I'm not a fan of Trump, and neither are those guys in the video I posted, but I'd say that if you aren't a little worried about how they went about this, and the years wasted on this false narrative, you're just as bad as the Trump supporters.
Lol sure whatever you say.

As for being worried?? Not at all, he lied and got caught for which he is being punished for.

Not really sure why you can’t grasp that simple concept.
 
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Soldato
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The ones that saw members of Trump's team get convicted maybe.

Show me the people that got convicted with conspiring with the Russian government to help the Trump campaign..

Wait you can’t, the people that got handed charges were process crimes that were handed out because of an investigation that shouldn’t have started in the first place. They knew/faked the pretext, created illusion of criminality by inserting their own informants (Misfud, Downer, Halper etc) to trap Trumps people talking about Russians and dirt. Only reason why Mueller investigation started because a paid informant of the FBI who they claimed is a Russian agent, suggested to Papadopulos that Russians have dirt on Hillary and he then relayed that back to Downer. So a suggestion of a suggestion.
 
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The ones that saw members of Trump's team get convicted maybe.

Who got convicted?

Lol sure whatever you say.

As for being worried?? Not at all, he lied and got caught for which he is being punished for.

Not really sure why you can’t grasp that simple concept.

Who lied on whom? Flynn was forced to admit that was lying because the FBI was threatening his family and himself. When he retracted the plea and asked to go to court, everyone backed off and tried to bury the case? Why they did so if they had proof that he lied and was guilty?

Do you understand how the US legal system works? Or any other system.
Until you are tried and found guilty with evidence you are innocent. And you need to get your head around this, because Boris is trying to pass the ability for the government to imprisonment, house arrests and liberty restrictions without any evidence, without any court, just their own opinion, with the new changes on the anti-terror legislation.

If tomorrow the police decided doesn't like the way you got up from the bed, they will go to a judge, say you are a terrorist and you will be locked up in your home (to avoid trial). No further evidence is required nor even a case be brought to a court. And you cannot challenge those decisions.

That is the difference of the legal system on those countries. Don't extrapolate from Britain authoritarian legal system of crap justice.
 
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Soldato
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Show me the people that got convicted with conspiring with the Russian government to help the Trump campaign..

Wait you can’t, the people that got handed charges were process crimes that were handed out because of an investigation that shouldn’t have started in the first place. They knew/faked the pretext, created illusion of criminality by inserting their own informants (Misfud, Downer, Halper etc) to trap Trumps people talking about Russians and dirt. Only reason why Mueller investigation started because a paid informant of the FBI who they claimed is a Russian agent, suggested to Papadopulos that Russians have dirt on Hillary and he then relayed that back to Downer. So a suggestion of a suggestion.

Why did Trump refuse to give a deposition to Mueller? Why would he only give written answers (written by his lawyers) and even then Mueller said he either evaded or lied. Why did Trump draw a red line at his family and finances? Why did he lie for months about Moscow Trump Tower? Why did he lie about how many times he visited Russia? Why did he lie about meeting Putin? Why did people involved with his campaign destroy messages that could have aided Mueller? Why did Trump campaign have over 100 contacts with Russians? Why was Manafort giving polling data to someone who worked with Russian intelligence? To try and pretend there was no reason to start an investigation is ridiculous. It is accepted by everyone except Trump that Russia interfered and did so to aid Trump getting elected. There can be nothing more serious than when a countries democratic elections are being attacked and possibly subverted.
 
Soldato
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Show me the people that got convicted with conspiring with the Russian government to help the Trump campaign..

Wait you can’t, the people that got handed charges were process crimes that were handed out because of an investigation that shouldn’t have started in the first place. They knew/faked the pretext, created illusion of criminality by inserting their own informants (Misfud, Downer, Halper etc) to trap Trumps people talking about Russians and dirt. Only reason why Mueller investigation started because a paid informant of the FBI who they claimed is a Russian agent, suggested to Papadopulos that Russians have dirt on Hillary and he then relayed that back to Downer. So a suggestion of a suggestion.
So despite it being explained to you it's still not sunk in, what part of Flynn not being convicted of conspiring with the Russian government is it that you don't understand?

I know you're a bit slow but Flynn has been charged with making false statements, he has NOT be charged with conspiring with the Russian government to help the Trump campaign, you maybe thinking of one of the other 5 members of his team that's been sentenced.
  • Paul Manafort: Sentenced to 7.5 years in prison this March for bank and tax fraud and crimes related to his work as a political consultant in Ukraine.
  • Michael Cohen: Received a three-year prison sentence in Dec. 2018 for tax evasion, bank fraud, lying to Congress and campaign finance violations.
  • George Papadopoulos: Convicted of lying to investigators about about Russian contacts. He served 12 days in prison and in October.
  • Rick Gates: Pleaded guilty in Feb. 2018 to conspiracy and lying to the FBI. After cooperating extensively in multiple investigations, Gates was sentenced in December to 45 days in jail, three years of probation and 300 hours of community service.
  • Roger Stone: Sentenced to 40 months in prison for crimes that include obstruction of justice, lying to Congress and witness tampering. A federal jury convicted Stone last year after he lied to Congress about his efforts to learn more about when WikiLeaks would publish damaging emails about Hillary Clinton during the 2016 presidential election.
  • Michael Flynn: The retired three-star general pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI in Dec. 2017, awaiting sentencing.
And those are just the people with known connections to Trump and/or his campaign, we then have a further 30 odd people charged with various misdemeanors ranging from identity fraud, more false statements, conspiracy to defraud the United States, obstruction of justice and conspiracy to obstruct justice, aggravated identity theft, conspiracy to launder money, and witness tampering.

Do you know why there's no charges of conspiring with the Russian government? It's because there's nothing on the statute books that says "conspiring with the Russian government" is illegal, there are however laws against making false statements, tax fraud, lying to Congress or law enforcement officers, campaign finance violations, obstruction of justice, and everything else these people have been convicted of.

And no, these people that got charged with crimes due to an investigation haven't been wrong charged because the investigation shouldn't have taken place, they got charged because law enforcement had reason to believe that crimes were being conducted and so started an investigation, if you get pulled over because the police believe you maybe drunk driving and they find a dead body in your boot they're not going to let you go simply because your not drunk.
Who got convicted?
See above, have you been living under a rock or something?
 
Soldato
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Michael Cohen - Trumps (former) Lawyer

Paul Manafort - Trumps (former) Campaign Manager

Roger Stone - Trumps adviser

George Papadopoulos - Trumps (former) Campaign advisor

https://www.axios.com/trump-associa...ons-206295a1-5abc-4573-be25-4da19d9adcc9.html

See above, have you been living under a rock or something?

You are the ones living under the rocks the last 3 weeks, missing the unfolding of the FBI rogue agents scandal of arm twisting to those people and threatening their families by demanding "Plea guilty or else" hence the sentences without trial. (btw nobody is in prison, they are out on bail as per agreement to plea guilty).

General Flynn retracted his plea demanding to be tried as normal and the whole house of cards start falling down.

That is the Obama-gate scandal that is unfolding in USA the last 3 weeks. Keep up with the news from this month and not February 2020. Times moving.
 
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