1930s Semi Refurb - Part 11 of ... (Summer House)

[dlockers]

Hi folks,

Whilst the bathroom job ticks over I want to start planning the summer house. A few things I want to consider is whether this'll ding me later on, if I ever do get the funds to build a side extension.

Current plot:

Proposed plot:

Plot mesaurements:

The first job will be to empty the garden shed and knock it down, visible here when I replaced the fence. As you can see there is so weak as **** concrete there, but the shed itself was laid on the leftover concrete from the garage pad pour (I imagine!) so is pretty chunky. I can the kango though....

Anyone have any experience or thoughts to share? I was considering the Oakwood Garden Room rod method to avoid having to do a mega concrete pour, but I think that is TBC based on rod pricing versus concrete! The pad that is partially there at the moment needs to go.

An alternative is just putting it on brick pillars/concrete pads.

Anyway, more of a build log..........watch this space.

 

[dlockers]

Wow you really are a workaholic.

All i can help with is i believe you can build on a maximum of 50% of your plot so you still have a good chunk left.
That's not saying you would get permission to do that but that's the total that could be allowed

I can't decipher whether the 50% is total plot or 50% of existing dwelling (curtilage?). I need to do some research. The workshop had planning permission; I am hoping to keep the garden room under 30sqm and 1m from boundary to avoid planning.

I used ground screws for a cabin I had built at the bottom of my garden. They were put in by a team. I think they were no cheaper than a concrete base, but I liked the idea of having less concrete in the garden, and it saved getting a massive pump or barrowing the stuff up the garden!

I love the idea of them. Did they go through clay? The cost is what puts me off as rods/concrete pillars I can do myself.

 

[dlockers]

They were just over 3k fitted. They are every 1.5m, 75mm x 1200mm sized screws. I had to dig out and level the ground but they can cope with a slope; I think they could cope with max of 150mm between lowest and highest, but it may have been more.

The cabin is about 5.7m x 4.3m and is pitched roof, 4m to the ridge. It sits 2m from any boundary so could be built without PP.

Oof. I'm going for 3kish to be water tight if I can. That excluded doors and windows but hoping I can get lucky on eBay/marketplace with a misorder.


What's your interior layout like? I want to maximize space but anything over what I'm proposing needs a flitch beam, although my.plan means I may still need a garden shed...

I think both 50% of plot relating to other buildings and 50% of original dwelling when built relating to attached extensions might be the case.

You can buy those ground screws and the thing to screw them in. I have seen them on ebay before

Ah that's probably what I'm missing.

Not considering DIY?

100% DIY.

 

[dlockers]

Legend thank you sir!

 

[dlockers]

Started to put a dent in the borders and thought I'd just reflect on the space for a minute. There is about 10m from the hedge to the fence, so even with a 4m span I have tonnes of space. I think job one is to make a fire pit top right so I can clear the waste easier than the incinerator - and then start to throw the shed on there.

I think 4m is starting to push it for spans so I may want to fitch beam it...

Is burning legit the shed legit? Lol

I wonder if that pad is any good, too...

 

[dlockers]

Had a quick think on layout. The profound thought given I can afford the space is to bring it forwards from the rear fence by about 2m instead of the mandatory 1M. I can then put the shed door on the rear, freeing up the front to be a bit more of a feature and giving me a nook with a window for my desk that faces the decking. It also means I'm not restricted in the future on an additional structure e.g. pergola for a hot tub or something.

I think I'll need to start clearing space now otherwise I'll be exhausted by the time the good weather comes lol.

 

[dlockers]

Nice size, what's your plans for use of the main space?

Tbc. I have the 13mx3m workshop which may become a proper workshop/garage once the junk is relocated to the attic. So this could be a separate living space/TV/playroom. It could also be a gym itself. No real plan! The main objective is the office itself tbh.

 

[dlockers]

Build pack arrived today -- I have the 7x4 and the 6x3.5m to work from. I just need to cost up the effort (basically the rods count) and see if the extra 500mm is worth it lol.

 

[dlockers]

Here's one I DIY'ed around 5 years ago:

Screenshot-20240415-211649 hosted at ImgBB

Image Screenshot-20240415-211649 hosted in ImgBB

ibb.co

Mega --- did you buy "all new"? I am hoping to score a deal on the doors/windows...

 

[dlockers]

I designed it myself around the aluminium bi-folds I managed to get cheap.
6m x 3.5m size. Floor and roof 6x2, lintel twin 8x3 bolted together (back to back) reinforced by unequal angle above the 4.5m bi-folds.
Everything was sourced new and I mounted on grounds screws to help prevent and rot. Cladding is all composite (Hyperion) & EPDM roof with some of my solar panels mounted on here East-West system.

Yeah I'm definitely going to float it by using the rod method.

I'm just pricing up doors and at 1950 height it's pretty costly. Looking at 3.1k for ones with integrated blinds :I

I think I've decided on 6x3.5 as the material costs jump substantially for 6x4.

 

[dlockers]

Right.........things starting to "move" albeit digitally.

1. Rods - I have sourced a supplier for rods, shoes, nuts - £423
2. Glass - 3m bifold with integrated blind - £3034
3. Fixings/bits - Tool Station - £473
4. Joist Hangers - Wickes - £96

I've requested a quote from the timber place............

 

[dlockers]

Have a look at Materials Market for the Timber prices, I've just renewed two flat roof areas into one and they were the cheapest online at the time.

Thanks --- I have a "dodgy" local merchant who has beat them by £330 without trying but doesn't have finished 2x4 (the small 3.5" stuff) so they've come in handy for that bit! Extending the quotes from earlier:

1. Rods - I have sourced a supplier for rods, shoes, nuts - £423
2. Glass - 3m bifold with integrated blind - £3034
3. Fixings/bits - Tool Station - £473
4. Joist Hangers - Wickes - £96
5. Wood/cement/ballast/insulation - £2535
6. Other wood (MM stuff) - £250
7. Just trying to source 4x3 C24 4.8m! - TBC
8. Rubber roof - TBC

So £6811.................without a base

 

[dlockers]

To be fair - the bulk of your cost is the bifold! Doesn’t seem too bad a price really! Just use OSB for the roof and super duper glue and EDPM stuff.

Have a look at the home improvement channel uk on t’interweb.

Yeah and a grand of that is integrated blinds.....so some cost savings to be had.

I have priced up the roof at ~£900 which is more than I expected but within tolerance.

I have zero external wood in that cost so need to add some featheredge.

 

[dlockers]

Would you consider a cladding?? I’ve not got any photos - but when I did a mates - we did cedral cladding. Looked very good.

On the upside - darn sight cheaper doing it DIY! Will look forward to the build!

I am going to clad the sides and rear in cheap featheredge, but the front will probably be a later job in cedar (minimal, thank god).

How much more for materials was 7x4 compared to the 6 x 3.5 based on the build pack. I will buy one of Liam's build pack when I start but ideally only one!

I was never planning the 7m but the 4m depth was interesting, as it is just a fraction more space in a meaningful way. Unfortunately the roof span becomes slightly more complicated because it exceeds standard material sizes etc. I only straight faced tested the difference.........TBH I didn't want to be bothered calculating my own materials as I actually wanted a 6x4.

Add on the cost of driving to toolstation 500 times as well during the build.

lol luckily build pack includes a BoM specifically for TS so I am hoping not

Make sure you don't forget breathable wrap for after the OSB boards but before the external cladding bits.

Yeah have that in the TS order.

 

[dlockers]

Wood is ordered (y). Costs so far:

1. Rods and nuts - £423
2. Wood - £365 + £2075 (MM + my local guy)

Things to order imminently:
* Roof - 739.64
* Door lintel - TBC
* Doors - £3k

* Plasterboard - 220
* Internal insulation - 270

So far I am coming in at ~£7k excluding any wiring/interior fittings (lights, plugs etc) and decorating gear.

Edit: Lintel was 305.68.

 

[dlockers]

First truck arrived...

 

[dlockers]

How much of that is stolen goods

None of it is stolen --- some just don't take CC.

 

[dlockers]

Day 1 ---
* Shifted the wood from the drive into the workshop (thank god I cleared it out).
* Cleared the space of my rubble piles. I definitely need to find some boys to lug all this crap out, I just don't have it in me anymore

* Dewired and removed the old shed:

* Cleared the space and did some initial measurements

* Removed a couple meters off of the shed pads and started to dig my holes:

* Turned my daughter into 6 giant pixels and got another bunch of holes dug:

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10 holes to go in the middle but I have dropped a very minor clanger if I follow the build pack. I was meant to bunch the middle 2 holes of the 4 that support left and right, so I could then equally space out the middle.

This what I may have to do (probably worse IRL than the photo because I really can't dig the reds as close as they appear to these greens)

Build pack looks more like this:

I understand most of the weight is coming straight down though, so the centers are really to stop the floor flopping. The benefit of the build pack method is you get plenty of room to drive in 2x 250mm screws; how I have ended up, means I will foul the rod. I'm probably just knackered and overthinking it tho

 

[dlockers]

Day 2 (half day):

Got my days wrong so ended up digging in the wet. Thank god it was easy going and clay is only 500mm down. 10 middle holes knocked out in a couple of hours.

The ballast and cement comes tomorrow. I think I will be a bit short but I am hoping to get the lot concreted, so I can start the base by Wednesday. I imagine base and joist hangers will take a full day (92 of the things...).

Annoyingly Tool Station is worse than their 3rd party suppliers. So the order I placed Saturday has been fulfilled for the bits they don't flog but not the main stuff I need (twist nails, splice plates etc...).


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Day 3:


Start the clock:

10:39

Stop the clock:

17:04.

Dead.

Almost had a life changing incident with the mixer too. It actually became unbalanced and fell over. Thank god I got the kill switch before it took my arm off. Deadly things

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Day 4:

Slow day today. I barely slept - my carpal tunnel is kicking my ass. I need the operation on both hands but just don't fancy it enough

Lost a chunk of the day "hiding" some of my rubble before covering it with the weed membrane. Then lost an equal part of the day levelling off the nut/rod system. It is very satisfying to be fair.

Also had to put a billion twist nails in the splice plates to make some 6m lengths...

(I don't think you need all nails but I was waiting for help to arrive as it isn't a one man lift )

Got 3 in as the fourth requires the offcut of the 3.5m splicing into the 4.8m and I ran out of brain cells so called it at this point...

My perfect engineering luck saw the rod system fall perfectly though. I don't even need to cut this, as it leaves just enough for a nut.

Tomorrow is going to be tough as my wife is at work and despite her being super pregnant she was critical to the lifting of the 6m+ lengths. I am hoping I can YOLO the last one and the sides are easy (3.5m each).

I can then chill out and spend the day doing joist hangers...


---------------------------------

Day 5 -
Super slow progress today. I had to single lift the 3.5m spans and then the 6m big boy. Everything is bolted down now. Then started to tackle the joist hangers which have become another one of my top-least-favourite-things-ever.

My hands are FUBAR so it is tough going now. The roof arrived as a bit of a tease tho

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Day 6:

Hand balled all the materials into the workshop today, will have to stop progress from tomorrow as I need to recover (my hands are FUBAR). Decent shift today but not as far ahead as I wanted unfortunately.

Joist hangers are a new least favourite job. 14 nails per joist hanger, x84

Got the PIR down... debating what to do now. I can put the 22mm down easily enough but the weather is going to turn next week. I don't own a tarp big enough!

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Day 7 (half day):

Had a super slow casual day today. I guaranteed myself tomorrow "off" so I can be at least partially productive on Monday.

In a cruel twist of events I am short by about 1.5feet of 22mm (the build pack is off by 1 board for the floor [need 16 boards not 15]). Ironically I listed about 30 offcuts of 22mm from the living/dining/kitchen/hall job on Marketplace just 5 days ago and some lad took the lot away

^ having my 3/yo mark out joist centres may have been an error in judgement. She was doing a great job then got distracted and just started drawing lines everywhere lol.

All pause now until May 25th(ish).
----------------------------------------------------

Any recommendations on internal floor? I may go Desert Oak from Floor Street again. I also underestimated the cost of front cladding. And I also need soffits/fascias!

Thanks

 

[dlockers]

Wow that's really impressive work.

Was it easy to level the floor working off all those rods? Do they feel sturdy?

As its raised off the floor due to those rods, what will your finished building height be?

People have hot tubs, gyms etc. on the rod system. With the main bearers having 4 rods on the 3.5m span, and between 5 or 6 on the 6m span, and then the nut "kinked" up, it feels absolutely solid. I was a bit dubious of joist hangers but they seem to be working well too. I've placed them so no span is larger than 110cm, and the joists are at 400 centers. So the 22mm chipboard is very well supported - more than my actual house

Levelling took much longer than expected but only because there were so many. Each nut gets locked off against each other, so you are millimeter perfect.

If you are 1M or more from the boundary, the rule is 2.5m from the highest adjacent land the building "touches", which is the front left corner. The compromise here is that doors are 1950mm, but that's because I opted for a proper steal lintel which cost me 160mm. Roof joists are 125mm. Effectively sum up roof construction height and floor construction height gives you max wall height. Then subtract 75mm and that is your rear wall height (gives you your drop).

In summary though, 2.5m.

Looks good. What's your thoughts on the rod system?

I'm wondering wether it will be good enough around the back in my garden which has some big trees (and big tree routes)

Really great - it was far simpler and less muck shifting than a pad. I actually chose it specifically because of the roots (two big trees back right). You are only digging a 200 cir hole and it is very forgiving to move it around to suit - hit a root, either sawzall it and carry on, or dig the hole a bit bigger and "miss it".