2nd Interview Attire

[joelk2]

Hello Friendly Folk,

Managed to secure myself a 2nd interview for a job.

First interview i wore trousers, shirt, tie, jacket.

the atmostphere in the office was relaxed and no one was wearing suits or even ties.

would you ditch the tie/jacket for the 2nd interview (to fit in more) or go all smart like the first one?

 

[joelk2]

thanks for the feedback, suit it is.

been told its between me and someone else who is very similar to me in qualifications etc.

already pooping it and havent even been given the date of 2nd interview.

pooping it due to really not liking my current employment and wanting something new and fresh.

less money, more work, more hours, less holiday but better prospects.

its close to home and hours are flexible and its doing a job which is exactly what i want.

it was through an agency but the feedback was good and i really impressed the employer (apparently)

 

[joelk2]

If you were comfortable in a suit the first time around - wear a suit. It's worth being consistent

im never comfortable in a suit but will continue the trend and wear one.

 

[joelk2]

date and time given for 2nd interview.

7:15am monday morning. thats the earliest ive ever had an interview.

 

[joelk2]

What's the general rule of thumb with 2nd interviews. My previous positions have only ever been 1 interview.

All my questions were asked in the first interview. What questions do you ask in 2nd interviews?

 

[joelk2]

2nd interview done and dusted, now the waiting game begins.

they were interviewing myself and another candidate of a similar technical ability.

hopefully ive done enough to secure the position.

 

[joelk2]

last week i was told that they were making a decision by the end of the week.

This week its now by the end of this week as they have 2 more interviews taking place. doesnt bode well i dont think. they were only interviewing 2 people and now another 2.

i hate hunting for jobs.

 

[joelk2]

Don't we all!

Let us know how it goes...

yeah will keep you updated. gutted to be honest, ideal location and seems like a great place to work.

less money and less holidays but id take it for the future oportunity.

will look around again.

feel underqualified for most positions but with 13 years experience i would have hoped that would have counted for something.

would entertain a career switch but then id start at rock bottom again which i couldnt do financially.

 

[joelk2]

I wouldn't worry about the extra interviews, they've probably just had more candidates come in and want to check them all out.

i just hate all the waiting. so my interview was 7:30am last monday morning, and initially was told that id hear back within a few days.

weds evening the recruitment consultant said they still hadnt interviewed the 2nd person but should hear back by the end of the week.

this morning its now the end of the week.

my guts had been turning all last week waiting for that phone call and now its going to be another week.

 

[joelk2]

Don't stop applying for and interviewing at other places until you have an offer in hand that you're going to accept

i havent but at the same time i was kind of pinning my hopes on it tbh.

location is great, hours were very flexible and progression was good.

can only describe it as perfect for what im looking for.

 

[joelk2]

bit of an update on this.

when i went for my interview they were interviewing me and one other person. Was waiting for something back that week but by the end of the week they had 2 others lined up for interviews aswell.

last friday i was told id hear back by weds this week

weds came and went, thursday recruitment bloke called me and said they had a mix up with dates and the 2nd guy from the 2nd bunch of interviews was on holiday. So as of now i have to wait another week. he said im still in the runnings and its basically between me and the person still to be interviews (how true this is i wouldnt know)

in the meantime another agency contacted me, i went for an interview on monday morning. monday afternoon the recruitment woman sent me an email from their director saying the interview went really well and i would fit in great with the team and could i go back later that day for a technical interview.

her words in the interview was "we'll probabily need to get you back for technical interview, Jim (technical director) will ask you to design a building"

(job is designing steel framed buildings)

interview was arranged for last night. and to be honest i was unsure on how complex the technical thing would be. Im still relatievely new to the software used (Revit) but i do pick things up very quickly.

turned up, he sat me at a pc, gave me a drawing, said "there you go" and walked off.

i sat there, modelled the house, deleted it all, modelled it again and then replicated the drawing he gave me but with my model.

he came back, i asked if i had done enough, he said more than enough ,i asked if he wanted to check it and he said he would later.

we went back to the meeting room, he asked if i had any questions (i asked a few but said that all my questions had already been answered in the first interview (unlike tmy current company the director knew the score, she knew exactly the software they used and how they use it) - my company even my manager doesnt know what software we use. i tried to make a bit of light hearted conversation (he lives in the same town as me) - "i hear your from town x" he basically just nodded and smiled.

anyways i think it went well and i should hear back next week.

 

[joelk2]

All this waiting.. when we hire someone we usually let them know the same day as the interview.

i wish it was like that, i hate waiting.

this week will drag on so much just waiting for some news

 

[joelk2]

Good luck. I would not read into any of it. The way I deal with interviews - even if it's interview number 3 for the same job - is to go there and do your best, then move on to the next one/forget it.

That's if...you are actively and fairly aggressively looking. If it's a one off job where you are already fairly happy or it's a dream job, then obviously it's hard not to keep thinking about it. It's all out of your control. Sometimes it can just be that you were more liked on a personal level than some of the other candidates... sometimes you might be more qualified... Waiting (and waiting) is pretty standard.

cheers. I have done my best, hopefully thats enough to secure something.

 

[joelk2]

the first one could be anything really, I'd not necessarily believe much a recruiter tells you regarding waiting for an offer - could be that you're the second choice guy and they've offered it to someone else. They're not going to tell you you've not got it but if he bails at the last minute then you'll get a call with some nonsense about 'sorry for the delay we had to get the headcount signed off by the blah director in NYC etc..etc..' Then again it might not be...

if you do get an offer for the second job don't accept immediately - call the recruiter for the first job and let him know right away - if you're genuinely still in the running for that one then that can speed up an offer pretty quickly and potentially a good one that at least matches if not exceeds the one you've just had for the second job. Once you've got that then call back the second job - bit of fluff about how you'd love to work for them - then explain the other offer you've got and ask if they can move a bit higher.

Almost every hiring manager budgets for their initial offer to be rejected and expects the possibility of being asked for more money (it is something like >90% of them according to a few HR articles IIRC) so having multiple interviews, offers concurrently is ideal and being able to ask for more, with possibly the best reason you can (someone else wants you too!) is a good situation.

thats a good shout actually, you have some leverage which you can use for your advantage.

is it worth mentioning job 2 to recruitment agency 1? even if to just push him to get off his arse? obviously its in their interest to try and get me a job as its money in their pocket too.

 

[joelk2]

well, 2nd company offered me job, have emailed first recruitment agency.

 

[joelk2]

Congrats

thanks, feel pretty sick at the moment to be honest.

less pay (1k), less holiday and longer commute (25mins drive opposed to 10 min walk). but its more for the future prospects. I have none where I am and my money will never increase and there is 0 chance for progression.

only here due to location and the fact im comfortable due to being here a long time.

 

[joelk2]

If he has 0 prospects where he is, and would have prospects in this new job, then your advice is incredibly short-sighted.

OP, if you genuinely think this job will lead to a better life i a few years then you should take it. Think of the long game.

exactly,

starting wage is £700 less a year (but my childcare costs are being cut by £140 a month due to the mother in law stopping working)

i have 0% chance of getting a rise in current position, 2% anually is the max.

i have 0% chance of any extra training or progression.

new role im starting out relatively low in the food chain so the only way is up with that which was confirmed in the interview.

less holidays is annoying but currently i think i get a hell of a lot. 28 days + bank hols (seems more than any friends/family)

new job is 28 with bank holidays but im going to ask if this is negotiable

 

[joelk2]

Accepting all the negatives on the first job the OP has been offered where the only positive is "prospects" is extremely short sighted...

Prospects are worth nothing if they don't come to fruition and if you take a minute to look through some of the other threads in here it happens all to often that XY and Z are promised and never arrive.



OP while I respect what you are saying, I am advising that this seems like a very poor choice for you to be making.

While you say you will take a £700 per year drop but will save money on child care you still have the £700 loss as you will still be saving the child care money.

The saving in child care is effectively a net rise of £1680 (or equivalent of £2150 gross) staying where you are or moving so to mention it is a bit of a moot point (based on the information you have provided so far).

Losing 8 days holiday is big. You are losing over 20% of your current holiday. If your current work place allow you to sell them back holiday allowance then you can do this and reduce holiday to the same as the new place and be even better off. If you cant, you have 8 days more holiday that you can use more freely then fixed to bank holidays.

A 25 minute drive I will deduce a 15 mile commute (30mph average factors in town and b roads, not motorway, if this commute is motor way this cost just goes up). 30 miles per day 5 days per week giving a fair mpg of 35 works out to £90 in petrol per month, another cost of £1080 from your net, or effectively £1380 gross raise.

Overall you are looking at a new job at the bottom of the food chain with "prospects" for a net cost of £1780 and this doesn't factor in the value of the 8 days extra holiday (at £20k per year this is £600).

To get you back to the position you are in now you would need a gross raise of £2280, so even with prospects this might take a while.

I feel my feedback is not short sighted in the least here as I have factored in all the apparent negatives, while the positives are intangible.

thankyou for your feedback, I do understand what you are saying. I guess without knowing all the facts you are purely basing your comment on the numbers.

You say prospects arent gauranteed but I have them written in the contract, You will start as this and progress to this so i feel as this is concrete.

I havent tried any salary negotiations so far but know the position im going into within the company im not sure how i approach this?

put it this way, ive never been one to haggle.

im a design engineer by title, i design stuff. since my new manager has come into our department he's less concered with the work we do and more worried about the reports we produce and how we log how much we do. so from a career of designing stuff im now just a glorified admin/excel guru. i spend 90% of my day looking at excel spreadsheets rather than the job I want to be doing.

he micro manages and scrutinising everything we do.
if something goes wrong we get the blame before giving our side of the story even if the issue isnt our fault.
our thoughts and views are never conveyed or even taken into consideration.

to paraphrase something i said recently "i just want out of this place now, its living hell. i feel sad that i have to come here every day, im grumpy at home because of work. i stay up late every single night just so it seems longer until i have to come back in here. its depressing."

 

[joelk2]

I will add, for the qualifications and job i do currently I feel as ive im overpaid. (that only going on job adverts that ive seen)

other similar positions (for less money) ask for a lot higher qualifications/experience more than i have (my experience is within a very niche sector to which there are limited competitors and none local to myself) the new position is closer to a role i did 9 years ago.

 

[joelk2]

I see no harm in you going back to the recruiter and saying you cant take a pay cut and leaving with them to go back to the employer.

They have offered you the job and clearly want you on board so going back and saying you were really looking for £1500-£2000 more and seeing what they say.

If you don't ask you don't get, and offers often come in below budget to leave room for negotiation.

It is difficult to quantify things fully without knowing salary ranges. asking for £1500 on a £15k per year job is very different to asking for an extra £1500 on a £30k per year job. Care to share this information? Understandable if not.

It was through an agency so have gone back to them with my concerns to get their opinion, they have said they would speak to the company on my behalf.

I'll keep you all up to date.