30/11 Strikes.

[Delvis]

So everyone's striking even though they get a better pension than half the people in the country? Awesome.

Your going with the majority, even though you don't agree.
Why would you do that?

Robot.

 

[Dolph]

Your going with the majority, even though you don't agree.
Why would you do that?

Either mindless sheep or victim of union bullying and intimidation....

 

[Basher]

I voted against it but will still strike..you go with the majority decision or whats the point of being in it?

once it was announced you couldnt book it as a holiday so its a day without pay not really a day off

So, lets clarify, you're striking for something you don't agree with?

 

[meths]

Your going with the majority, even though you don't agree.
Why would you do that?

Either mindless sheep or victim of union bullying and intimidation....

Seriously?

Do you guys really not understand how a vote works?

If you're going to be a member of any body with a democratic voting system it'd be fairly pointless if you just spit the dummy and leave every time a vote doesn't go your way.

 

[CaneyJ]

My gf's dad told me he used to work at a steel works in the 70's and they went on strike for 6-weeks because "the bacon butties they got on Fridays wern't good enough" :/. Any wonder why so many businesses went down the Pan back then?

 

[Glaucus]

Seriously?

Do you guys really not understand how a vote works?

If you're going to be a member of any body with a democratic voting system it'd be fairly pointless if you just spit the dummy and leave every time a vote doesn't go your way.

I understand how it works and I don't agree. I'm a member of RMT and haven't strikes when they have called for one. As I don't agree with it.
Wat is the point of striking when you don't agree with the policies. This isn't the same as politics and democracy. We don't have the influence over governments on every policy. We do with unions. It's absurd going against your own opinions just because the union says.

Combined with the fact most votes aren't even 50% turn out, if people like you, stood up more. It would balance out the madness of unions.

 

[Dolph]

Seriously?

Do you guys really not understand how a vote works?

If you're going to be a member of any body with a democratic voting system it'd be fairly pointless if you just spit the dummy and leave every time a vote doesn't go your way.

gotta love the hypocrisy here, given that spitting the dummy is exactly what the unions and their members are doing about activities of the democratically elected coalition government with the largest vote proportion for generations...

or does that not count the same?

 

[meths]

I understand how it works and I don't agree. I'm a member of RMT and haven't strikes when they have called for one. As I don't agree with it.
Wat is the point of striking when you don't agree with the policies. This isn't the same as politics and democracy. We don't have the influence over governments on every policy. We do with unions. It's absurd going against your own opinions just because the union says.

Combined with the fact most votes aren't even 50% turn out, if people like you, stood up more. It would balance out the madness of unions.

I knew I shouldn't have mentioned democracy there.

Anyway, my point is if you decide to be a member of any body, not just a union, that makes decisions on a course of action based on a vote then you are committing yourself to go along with whatever the result of the vote is.

You can register that you object by voting no but once the course of action is decided then you are obliged to go with the majority. Please let's not get into the fact that if the vote is less than 50% then there is no clear majority as that is a wholly different issue.

If you take part in the vote and then do not abide by the result when it is not in line with the way you voted then perhaps you should just leave the organisation.

Surely your membership of the RMT isn't compulsory?

 

[meths]

gotta love the hypocrisy here, given that spitting the dummy is exactly what the unions and their members are doing about activities of the democratically elected coalition government with the largest vote proportion for generations...

or does that not count the same?

Of course it's not the same.

I see your point but there's a big difference between choosing to be a member of an organisation even though you're not going to abide by it's collective will and pressuring an elected govenment to try and get it to change it's policy on an issue.

 

[Glaucus]

Anyway, my point is if you decide to be a member of any body, not just a union, that makes decisions on a course of action based on a vote then you are committing yourself to go along with whatever the result of the vote is.


Surely your membership of the RMT isn't compulsory?

you going along with what the union says isn't compulsory. At no point do you sign saying its a democracy and you go along with the general feeling.
its a union not a democracy.

Of course not, but I'll put the more level headed vote in and if more people bothered, perhaps it'll break their stupidity of wanting to strike when we were offered 1% above inflatiron in the middle of the melt down.

At no point do I have to go along with their vote, like you are doing. In fact there are laws to make sure you aren't forced into obeying the unions every call. If its stupid I won't strike and haven't in the past. Strikes once and that was a mistake, next two strikes I worked as did most other people. That shows the so called majority wanted action, when we all turned up for work.

 

[platypus]

Yes and no, We (pulic servants) are an easy target so we are having our contracts changed. So yes, as the Tories ar the ones doing this then yes they have provked the strike. However I think that any gov would see us as an easy target and would possibly do the same

Labour would be brave enough to go this far against their major funders and supporters?

 

[shoes]

union bashing - Check - Awful things, no good for the country of economy.
attacks on employment rights - check - Employment rights have become ridiculous - you should be able to sack poorly performing employees if you want to.
destruction of NHS - Check - I disagree with this but reform is needed.
privatisation - check - Excellent - more tax income
Poor bashing - Check - **** the poor, nothing but a blight on society.
etc etc.

 

[wildman]

Affordable = subjective.

Anything is affordable from a State perspective - given the political will.

Thats actually a good point. Statewise everything is affordable providing the government has the stomach to tax the citizens to the hilt to pay for it. I guess the balance is between how much tax burden they can load on to the tax payers untill they all decide to go mental and start a revolution.

On another point I see lots o peopel talking about public pension pots? I was always under the impression there was no pot and public pensions were viewed more as a liability that were underwritten by the government. So if that is right then there is no real argument about sustainability / affordability as AmigaFans point stands and technically current public pensions are theoretically affordable.


No I am not a Guardian Reading moon maiden, nor am I on the payroll of the unions. I am in private sector. I don't particularly support these public sector strikes, but at the same time I am not entirely buying the reasons for the necessary adjustments. I think there is much dishonesty both from the government and the union chiefs

 

[Glaucus]

There is a pension pot, but rather than investing it. Goverment guarantees it at x-rate and spends it.

As for affordability due to hover,ent. Not really the case, governments can go bust, look at Greece and your assuming there's enough money in said pot to pay pensions s well as everything else giver,ent has to spend and can continue to borrow money t an increasing rate.

It is neither affordable or sustainable.

 

[Deleted member 66701]

So everyone's striking even though they get a better pension than half the people in the country? Awesome.

How's this for a novel idea?

How about those that have rubbish pensions get off their back sides and fight for something better?

Or it it just easier to write into the Daily Mail and state how envious you are of all those that have already done just that?

 

[Hatter The Mad]

Thats actually a good point. Statewise everything is affordable

That isn't true.

 

[Hatter The Mad]

There is a pension pot

There isn't, almost all of the pensions are directly funded

 

[Deleted member 66701]

Labour would be brave enough to go this far against their major funders and supporters?

Have you forgotten who stated this review process off?

Labour is no friend to the Unions. Unions back them because it's the lesser of three evils. I can see major funding being switched to the Green party in a few years.

 

[spudbynight]

I fully support the government in this however I think that MPs should also be on the same pension terms.

I strongly believe that all public sector workers, including MPs, should have exactly the same pension arrangements.

 

[Deleted member 66701]

That isn't true.

yes it is - given an appropriate level of taxation.