5ms g2g AND 14ms in same monitor

Pixel response time measurements are poorly standardised at best. Maybe provide us with a link to the monitor you're thinking of?


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Thanks. In that case I suspect that the 14ms refers to the true ISO black to black pixel transition time of the panel (which should indeed take longer than B2B, which suggests that the monitor uses Overdrive).

That's just an educated guess though...frankly I'm surprised to learn that some monitor tech specs still list the honest response time instead of just the nicer sounding marketing nonsense. Props, LG.

P.S., If that didn't make sense, the two different response times refer to different color transitions. Some transitions take longer than others, and G2G, often being one of the fastest transitions, tends to always be listed these days.


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Thanks. In that case I suspect that the 14ms refers to the true ISO black to black pixel transition time of the panel (which should indeed take longer than B2B, which suggests that the monitor uses Overdrive).

That's just an educated guess though...frankly I'm surprised to learn that some monitor tech specs still list the honest response time instead of just the nicer sounding marketing nonsense. Props, LG.

P.S., If that didn't make sense, the two different response times refer to different color transitions. Some transitions take longer than others, and G2G, often being one of the fastest transitions, tends to always be listed these days.


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so would u say the 2ms benq monitors are black to black 2ms also or is it just 14ms ?
 
I'm saying it's very hard to trust the manufacturer's declared response time at all. Pretty much every colour transition varies in time, the range is big, and what you see on the tech specs is only an average, often a wildly optimistic one.

Rather than trust in numbers, try to find reviews that have screenshots of the monitor in action using PixPerAn. TFTCentral, PRAD, NCX and pcmonitors.info all do this AFAIK. You're far better basing your decision off these reviewers, even their subjective impressions, than you are spending much time worrying about response time in numerical terms.


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yes all they are doing is quoting both response time specs. So there is the "normal" response time figure, representing the ISO black > white > black response time used for many years before overdrive was introduced. Then there's also the "G2G" (grey to grey) response time as overdrive is being used on the screen.

I would argue that the G2G figure is a more realistic indication of a screens responsiveness nowadays. The ISO response time (for screens without overdrive) was always the best case measurement and all the G2G changes were much slower in practice. With overdrive, the G2G changes generally get boosted quite evenly, and you will normally see a pretty even response time performance across different transitions (if you measure them independently). I personally don't think there's much point in quoting the ISO response time nowadays, as it doesnt really tell you anything useful.

Response time specs explained in more detail here by the way

If you want a better view than relying on manufacturer specs, you need to find an independent review where they measure the response times across varying transitions with an oscilloscope (TFTCentral, Prad etc), and also sites which provide comparative responsiveness tests using PixPerAn (TFTCentral, PCmonitors.info). That will give you a much better view of real life performance than manuf specs. You also need to take into consideration any overshoot problems (caused by aggressive overdrive control) which might be there, and also for gaming consider the display lag as well (aka input lag)
 
^Wouldn't G2G be MORE optimistic than ISO black-white-black? After all, it's a smaller transition and therefore faster, right?


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^Wouldn't G2G be MORE optimistic than ISO black-white-black? After all, it's a smaller transition and therefore faster, right?


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I more meant that quoting a G2G response time gives a better overall view of the panels performance than an ISO response time. Where overdrive is used, and therefore a G2G figure given, the pixel transitions across the whole range tend (normally) to be quite regular, and certainly the overall performance shows a marked improvement compared with screens without overdrive.

For example a typical response time graph from back in the day of panels without overdrive, representing a fairly typical TN Film panel

DRIBnZB.gif


The ISO response time would be represented at the far right hand edge where the fastest measurement is taken. This has not accounting for the fact that all the other transitions are much slower than this point, and the overall performance really varies a lot.

4dR0YKz.gif


response times of other panel technologies were even worse, this is from a typical VA panel without overdrive. The ISO measurement is again the best case, and all G2G transitions are much slower, some massively so

So the ISO response time is fairly meaningless as it gives you no real indication of the panels performance in my opinion. Back then, a TN Film panel would have been rated with a 12ms or 16ms ISO response time commonly, and a VA panel with an ISO response time of ~16ms also. While that ISO measurement might have been similar, it wasn't a true reflection of the real life performance.

On another note, measuring a transition change from a full black > white transition is far less realistic in real life situations than changes between different grey shades and colours.


A panel with overdrive would have had a much flatter graph. for example the ViewSonic VP191B was one of the first VA panels to use overdrive:

nhhfBRW.jpg

(green line)

So the quoted 8ms G2G figure gives a more accurate view of the response time since the performance is fairly consistent across the whole range of transitions. 8ms is still the "best case" measurement admittedly, but since it uses overdrive you can at least assume that more of the common G2G changes have been sped up.

As i say, panels with overdrive commonly have a fairly similar response time across the whole range, whereas panels without have a real variety of response time measurements.
 
Thanks. That's really interesting stuff. However, AFAIK GTG times are sometimes cited even for monitors without overdrive. is it still such a useful measurement in those cases?


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It's pretty rare for a monitor to have a G2G spec when overdrive isn't being used. Maybe on some odd random models from Korea and stuff where they go with the panel spec but then seemingly never add an overdrive circuit

If it's not being used then the g2g specs they list will be pointless and not realistic at all (assuming they quote low figures like 8ms, 6ms etc)
 
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