AIO's Why they should only be considered a short term product.
- Thread starter Mayhems
- Start date
I still have an H100 which has been running practically 24/7 since OcUK did the cheap Corsair refurb units for £38 or whatever it was!
It must have clocked up well over 25,000 hours.
Yep mine was one of those
It was even sat in the loft for about a year doing nothing. Plugged it in a couple of months ago and its been perfect, no complaints whatsoever.Had my h50 since 2010ish , run 24/7 as a rule still going fine. I do wonder maybe if it was left sitting unused at times it would be worse but i can say it has been ultra reliable.
I have looked at going to a custom loop a few times but costs/benefits dont seem to add up .
I have looked at going to a custom loop a few times but costs/benefits dont seem to add up .
The problem with forums is that it is really easy for someone's intentions and meaning to be misinterpreted. Pretty soon you can end up with a ****-storm like this seems to have turned into. For what it's worth I think Mike (from Mayhems) has done the right thing and not replied - once this sort of thing kicks off, there just isn't anything you can say that will fix it.
Mike does own (as far as I'm aware) the Mayhems company. This is what he meant when he said he was "no rep" - he does represent the company but he's also the owner.
As far as "unprofessional" goes I think that, like the rest of us, Mike is entitled to an opinion and, given his potential for bias, you are free to take or leave it as you see fit. Unprofessional would have been if Mike had said that all Corsair/Antec/Asetek/Other (delete as appropriate) brand AIOs are rubbish - something he did not say. Mike is known to be fairly blunt in what he says and I think that does catch people out if they aren't used to his posts. However, his experience, knowledge and willingness to help are something that I appreciate - you don't often get such communication from companies these days so the reps on these forums are immensely valuable.
I strongly suspect that what we have here is a 'moan' with which a lot of us here should sympathise. Let me explain: "Oh, you do computers? I've got this laptop/typewriter/DVD/washing machine that doesn't work.....". Sound familiar? I've even had my mum say to me "You know about plumbing, don't you?!" No mum, I work in IT. I would hazard a guess that Mike has had this problem and had a run of dodgy AIO's interrupting what little down time he probably gets and is somewhat irritated by it. If you can't have a moan amongst friends, what hope is there?!
AIOs are a compromise, we all know this. They are produced to a price point that you cannot match with bespoke components and that is their appeal - I have one myself for this reason. They are great for their price but compromises have been made in their design partly as a result of the price point and partly as a result of the technical ability of their target market - they have to be maintenance free. Can you imagine what would happen if they told the average computer user to pour coolant in their computer to top it up?!
All this is fine as long as you don't expect the moon on a stick for your money.
I really don't think any deception or harm was meant so can we put away the torches and the pitchforks now please?
Mike does own (as far as I'm aware) the Mayhems company. This is what he meant when he said he was "no rep" - he does represent the company but he's also the owner.
As far as "unprofessional" goes I think that, like the rest of us, Mike is entitled to an opinion and, given his potential for bias, you are free to take or leave it as you see fit. Unprofessional would have been if Mike had said that all Corsair/Antec/Asetek/Other (delete as appropriate) brand AIOs are rubbish - something he did not say. Mike is known to be fairly blunt in what he says and I think that does catch people out if they aren't used to his posts. However, his experience, knowledge and willingness to help are something that I appreciate - you don't often get such communication from companies these days so the reps on these forums are immensely valuable.
I strongly suspect that what we have here is a 'moan' with which a lot of us here should sympathise. Let me explain: "Oh, you do computers? I've got this laptop/typewriter/DVD/washing machine that doesn't work.....". Sound familiar? I've even had my mum say to me "You know about plumbing, don't you?!" No mum, I work in IT. I would hazard a guess that Mike has had this problem and had a run of dodgy AIO's interrupting what little down time he probably gets and is somewhat irritated by it. If you can't have a moan amongst friends, what hope is there?!
AIOs are a compromise, we all know this. They are produced to a price point that you cannot match with bespoke components and that is their appeal - I have one myself for this reason. They are great for their price but compromises have been made in their design partly as a result of the price point and partly as a result of the technical ability of their target market - they have to be maintenance free. Can you imagine what would happen if they told the average computer user to pour coolant in their computer to top it up?!
All this is fine as long as you don't expect the moon on a stick for your money.I really don't think any deception or harm was meant so can we put away the torches and the pitchforks now please?
The op has not endorsed any mayhems products, either way they make money. If he said that air cooling was ***** then it would be in his own interest.
I bought a full 240mm custom loop with high-quality components, that were branded and a laing pump for £65, yes it was used but hell it performed like a beast, and I have since re-used the fittings, pump and radiator in many builds!
why do you all assume that a custom loop has to be made with a d5, 1080mm of radiator space, bitspower fittings and tubes made of pure diamonds!
Lets compare like to like, and in that case clc's are considered are short term solution compared to their open-loop counterparts
I bought a full 240mm custom loop with high-quality components, that were branded and a laing pump for £65, yes it was used but hell it performed like a beast, and I have since re-used the fittings, pump and radiator in many builds!
why do you all assume that a custom loop has to be made with a d5, 1080mm of radiator space, bitspower fittings and tubes made of pure diamonds!
Lets compare like to like, and in that case clc's are considered are short term solution compared to their open-loop counterparts
AIOs are a compromise, we all know this. They are produced to a price point that you cannot match with bespoke components and that is their appeal - I have one myself for this reason. They are great for their price but compromises have been made in their design partly as a result of the price point and partly as a result of the technical ability of their target market - they have to be maintenance free. Can you imagine what would happen if they told the average computer user to pour coolant in their computer to top it up?!
By saying they're a compromise you seem to be implying they are inferior in some way. Are they? I don't see it that way. They appeal to different people. The cost, maintenance and risk associated with a custom loop is something that a lot of people won't even entertain. The risk associated with an AIO is not the same as a loop... it just isn't, and you're 100% covered if something goes wrong (assuming you haven't gone and messed with the unit in some way). How is that a compromise? It's BETTER! A custom loop can offer better performance sure (but the practical real world difference that makes in terms of what your PC can do is negligible), and undoubtedly look a million times better, but that's it. Everything else swings in favour of an AIO, so at best they are even. Different strokes for different folks though.
Caporegime
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Yeah I don't buy it. He's scaremongering essentially and trying to push people towards a more expensive product that he happens to sell coolant for. In reality the failure rate of SAIOs doesn't seem to be as apocalyptic as the OP would suggest.
Certainly been my experience that the stuff he is talking about is a problem in the minority case rather than the rule albeit my experience is somewhere in the region of 10-12 AIOs.
Not implying that at all. The performance wouldn't be comparable to a decent custom loop so in that way you could say they are inferior. If you compare the price, they are undoubtedly cheaper and I would suspect that performance per pound (money) would be superior too. For their target market I think they're good....I just don't think that target market is the kind of person that has to have the best because knowing it isn't will irritate them even though it's perfectly adequate (my 980Ti when I knew the cheaper 980 was plenty good enough, for example).
I have a 120mm AIO on an under stairs server that runs in 35 degree ambient heat. Bought it to get the heat out the case and cope a bit better. Nothing to push it overly hard (no extreme processor or OC) and it works fine.
Second hand prices aren't really a fair comparison either and you can build a custom loop out of a fish tank pump and some old hose. It used to be the only way. It's cheap but it doesn't look pretty. That's really not the point though.
Agreed. Nothing constructive is going to come out of this.
TBF, Mike is being completely transparent about who he is and what company he works for/owns, so everyone can make a judgement on what he says as they see fit. Nothing wrong with a company rep saying what they think as long as we know where they are coming from and can make our own decisions to believe him or not.
Soldato
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As he said in his post he supplies them the fluid rofl
Exactly, any comment coming from someone who is clearly marked as a vendor rep has to be assumed to contain some bias as with the best will in the world if you have a vested interest in something you will always be biased that way however much you try not to.
I see nothing wrong with his post at all, I also think it's less biased than a large number of the posts on here from people with no clear affiliation.
