AMD to unveil Zen 4 CPUs at CES 2022

[Ikana]

I'm doubtful there will be any IPC improvement with Raptor Lake, especially since they only said there would only be an improvement to multithreaded performance.

Both Intel and AMD are pushing for the highest frequency clocks now. AMD can apparently reach 5.2-5.5ghz with a maximum CPU power consumption of just 170w.

No reason to doubt RPL's IPC improvements yet. The P-core in RPL is now called Raptor Cove and there's also more caches (L2 and L3), the L2 of E-Core which is the same 'Gracemeont' used in ADL- was also doubled. More multithreaded performance is expected because of more 'Gracemont' E-cores, but that doesn't mean we can stop there.

 

[g67575]

I'd really limit your expectations. Intel aren't exactly wowing people by promising higher multithreaded performance (to be expected if more E-cores are added). Also, like Alderlake, the E-Cores use the Gracemont architecture. If they can improve the memory controller, that would give Golden Cove (on DDR5) a nice little performance boost, vs DDR4.

The main thing is that Intel discussed improvements to each architecture (e.g. coves). Beyond Golden Gove, they've said nothing, and that is because they did not plan to still be on 10nm in 2022. So, now, they have to just go with what they've got, and increase the cache amounts. Presumably, this wasn't done before, before cache is costly relative to other parts of CPUs.

Coves roadmap here:

https://en.wikichip.org/w/images/thumb/1/15/sunny_cove_roadmap.png/1600px-sunny_cove_roadmap.png

 

[g67575]

I wonder if Intel's 'Sapphire Rapids-X' platform, might be a better competitor to AM5/Zen 4? Especially considering that all cores will be Golden Cove only, and these boards will offer quad channel DDR5.

 

[Perfect_Chaos]

If Raptor Lake is that good, i might be tempted to pick up a cheap but decent board and a 13700 chip, the fact i could just drop in my DDR4 without having to buy a lot more expensive DDR5 might sway it too.
A board for one chip is not so bad if the price & performance is good. Would have to be decently above a Zen 4 chip to be worth it though.

 

[Troezar]

If Raptor Lake is that good, i might be tempted to pick up a cheap but decent board and a 13700 chip, the fact i could just drop in my DDR4 without having to buy a lot more expensive DDR5 might sway it too.
A board for one chip is not so bad if the price & performance is good. Would have to be decently above a Zen 4 chip to be worth it though.

Won't some of the advantages of RL be lost if you only use DDR4 with it?

 

[Perfect_Chaos]

Won't some of the advantages of RL be lost if you only use DDR4 with it?

Would have to wait for testing to see, maybe by a bit.

 

[Joxeon]

Raptor lake will be on a dead platform, AM5 is engineered to have lasting longevity drop in CPU upgrades . I know which I would prefer

I thought Intel said they were going increase socket longevity. LGA 1700 has 1800 pins so if raptorlake only uses the 1700 then it's very likely meteorlake and possibly what comes after will use the same socket with the likely caveat that only DDR5 boards will offer support beyond raptorlake.

 

[Vulture]

I thought Intel said they were going increase socket longevity. LGA 1700 has 1800 pins so if raptorlake only uses the 1700 then it's very likely meteorlake and possibly what comes after will use the same socket with the likely caveat that only DDR5 boards will offer support beyond raptorlake.

They increased socket longevity, you got 2 generations. Even Intel graphs shows which generation belongs together, Meteor Lake and Lunar Lake or whatever is called will be same platform just like ADL and RPL.

 

[Robert896r1]

Back to the discussion point of the thread, curious to see which 2 dimm boards are available at launch. Mainly interested to see what daily max (post tune) will be for mem on the platform.

 

[Joxeon]

They increased socket longevity, you got 2 generations. Even Intel graphs shows which generation belongs together, Meteor Lake and Lunar Lake or whatever is called will be same platform just like ADL and RPL.

We'll know for sure once RPL is released and whether the pin count is 1700 or 1800.

 

[Journey]

I thought Intel said they were going increase socket longevity. LGA 1700 has 1800 pins so if raptorlake only uses the 1700 then it's very likely meteorlake and possibly what comes after will use the same socket with the likely caveat that only DDR5 boards will offer support beyond raptorlake.

They've used the same socket for ages with 1150/1151 they just chose to cripple them from having the new parts put in. The 1700/1800 socket will no doubt stay, but the CPU's from Meteor will not drop into a ADL/RPL board, Intel make too much chipset revenue to lose that, don't forget they care about OEM volume not pathetic enthusiast quantities.

 

[alec]

Back to the discussion point of the thread, curious to see which 2 dimm boards are available at launch. Mainly interested to see what daily max (post tune) will be for mem on the platform.

It looks like they had no problem running 6400 CL32 in the current pre-production state.
Whats the current fastest ddr5 kit? 6600 CL34?

 

[Robert896r1]

It looks like they had no problem running 6400 CL32 in the current pre-production state.
Whats the current fastest ddr5 kit? 6600 CL34?

6600 with 7k kits coming out in a bit. So far adl good 2dimm boards max out around 7000 daily with all timings tightened. 7200 is doable but need a strong imc and mem kit.

 

[Journey]

Says a lot for overclocking when the best thing you've got to look forward to these days is messing around with RAM tuning endlessly. Bring back proper OC's! I miss my Celeron 300A.

 

[Grim5]

I thought Intel said they were going increase socket longevity. LGA 1700 has 1800 pins so if raptorlake only uses the 1700 then it's very likely meteorlake and possibly what comes after will use the same socket with the likely caveat that only DDR5 boards will offer support beyond raptorlake.

Intel is doing tick tock cycles, 2 generations per motherboard

 

[Joxeon]

They've used the same socket for ages with 1150/1151 they just chose to cripple them from having the new parts put in. The 1700/1800 socket will no doubt stay, but the CPU's from Meteor will not drop into a ADL/RPL board, Intel make too much chipset revenue to lose that, don't forget they care about OEM volume not pathetic enthusiast quantities.

This was before Intel had real competition in the market though and I'm sure they would have taken note with how a large AM4 base has helped drive latter ryzen cpu sales despite the high chip prices and besides if meteor lake onwards is DDR5 only then it already cuts off those who bought DDR4 boards which would include most OEMs as the costs were considerably lower.

 

[Journey]

This was before Intel had real competition in the market though and I'm sure they would have taken note with how a large AM4 base has helped drive latter ryzen cpu sales despite the high chip prices and besides if meteor lake onwards is DDR5 only then it already cuts off those who bought DDR4 boards which would include most OEMs as the costs were considerably lower.

Which is exactly why they'd cut off ADL/RPL buyers who bought DDR4, they sell another chipset. Also by the time Meteor is avialble DDR5 pricing is going to be much more like DDR4 was in its prime, unless there is some other global catastrophe, so buying a new platform is hardly that big of a deal, and those who are on ADL/RPL aren't the target market for the most part, its people coming from LGA1200 and prior. Maybe if they had a 5 year chipset/CPU range that is compatible then it would matter,but there is no way they are going to be doing a 15700K with a DDR4 controller, so it would only work for people who bought Z690 DDR5, and Intel just don't work like that, never have, and never will. Were not on Socket 7 days anymore.

 

[Armageus]

170W TDP and 230W "Peak Power" confirmed:

AMD Corrects Socket AM5 for Ryzen 7000 Power Specs: 230W Peak Power, 170W TDP (Updated)

Pump up the power

www.tomshardware.com

Also - X670 boards are dual chipset?

MSI shows off AMD X670 motherboard dual-chipset design - VideoCardz.com

Two chipsets yet no active cooling MSI tries to share as much information on AMD AM5 platform as possible. The company already confirmed AMD EXPO technology for DDR5 memory overclocking profiles, as well as published an installation guide AMD Ryzen 7000 engineering sample CPU. AMD was clearly...

videocardz.com

 

[LePhuronn]

Also - X670 boards are dual chipset?

X670E uses two of the chipset chips to get all the IO around the board without using a boat load of PCIe retimers and things to meet the exacting standards AMD set out for an X670E motherboard.

X670 will only use a single chipset chip and AMD's directives on what comprises an X670 motherboard are a lot looser. B650 looser again.

 

[Gerard]

Interview with Robert hallock.

AMD Answers Our Zen 4 Tech Questions, with Robert Hallock

AMD just announced their new Zen 4-based Ryzen 7000 desktop processors. We sat down with AMD's Robert Hallock and asked him a load of technical questions to learn more about what to expect from the new platform, its highlights, and capabilities.

www.techpowerup.com

At Computex, you showed a 15% single-thread performance gain over the Ryzen 9 5950X. Wouldn't that only put the gaming performance on par with 5800X3D?
I think it's too early to say actually. We were deliberately conservative with our number on single-thread performance. We do intend to publish the exact breakdown of IPC vs. frequency contribution later in the summer, also including performance, power, and area on the new process. As far as what stacks up against what, I think it's too early to say, we're still in silicon bring-up.