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AMD warns of tesselation pitfalls

RavenXXX2 said:
There are other GFX options in metro that kill performace way more than tessellation, DOF being one of them.
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A lot of people i know usually switch dof off anyhow as they hate the blurry effects. In metro for me tesselation would be the only hog as i automatically switch dof of in every game i have that uses it.
 
civ 5 uses tesselation also.

tesselation has to be done from the start, ground up in the game, NOT done as a fix it later smack a sticker on the game, its dx11.

if done right, the eyecandy will be better than crysis 1 and 2.
and run faster.
 
As for as I'm concerned, the difference between low tessellation and no tessellation can be dramatic and well worth it.

However, higher tessellation doesn't really add much unless you look long and hard at the differences - but it can kill performance in a huge way.

I'd imagine games will simply have different tessellation levels to suit both cards going forward. nVidia will probably have the advantage, but nothing you will notice without freeze frame if implemented correctly on both cards.
 
TheRealDeal said:
I do recall a thread where the person moved over to gtx480 sli and still could not max out metro as his fps was dipping into the 20's to much. Tesselation along with dof was having to big a hit. Had they used tesselation properly this probably would not have been the case. Theres not to many games out atm that use tesselation that amd fall drastically behind nvidia. It only seems to be extreme benchmarks.
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It does with my gtx470's overclocked in SLI. At 1920 x 1200 with AA and everything maxxed out, switching on tesselation can make the framerates drop to 9fps at some points in the benchmark.

It would even bring two overclocked gtx580's to their knees. And to be honest, it;s not even that noticable the gain from having it switched on.

So I reckon you would need two gtx680's in SLI to run metro2033 at a constant decent framerate.
 
Greebo said:
It does with my gtx470's overclocked in SLI. At 1920 x 1200 with AA and everything maxxed out, switching on tesselation can make the framerates drop to 9fps at some points in the benchmark.

It would even bring two overclocked gtx580's to their knees. And to be honest, it;s not even that noticable the gain from having it switched on.

So I reckon you would need two gtx680's in SLI to run metro2033 at a constant decent framerate.
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This is what AMD means with proper implementation.
 
RavenXXX2 said:
Let's face it metro is a horribly optimized game on all counts, it's not even that good.
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The point being.
Poor optimization and implementation can and will bring the latest and greatest to their knees.
Would you call a GTX470 SLI bad because of Metro? Although statistically it would look so.

As good as AMD and Nvidia are at bringing out these monster GPU's. If the Developers are sloppy, it's all a moot point how fast a GTX580 or 6970 are.
 
Hmm let me guess ATI DX11 is going to suck FPS wise on their newer cards due later this month & beyond so they are trying to lower expectations as Nvidia are ahead & have superior developer relations/resources ;)

Lost Planet 2 & Metro 2033 are the best looking DX11 games right now (both TWIMTBP titles as well ;))
 
This thread stinks of Nvidia fanboys.
AMD is quite right. Good programming is key.
Let's examine past programming flops such as crysis and more recently metro.

It's Not just adding Tesselation for Tesselation sake.
Tesselation was intended to be the holy Grail for programmers and gamers. Deliver smooth detailed meshes WITHOUT sacrificing performance. Unfortunatley the Developers have gone silly adding unnecessary high Tesselation to models that don't need it. Let's tessellate a perfectly round sphere.
Good programming it's what its all about.
 
AWPC said:
Hmm let me guess ATI DX11 is going to suck FPS wise on their newer cards due later this month & beyond so they are trying to lower expectations as Nvidia are ahead & have superior developer relations/resources ;)

Lost Planet 2 & Metro 2033 are the best looking DX11 games right now (both TWIMTBP titles as well ;))
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Yeah and £800 of Nvidia's best cards sucks at Metro2033 as well.

It's a poorly coded and badly implementation of tesselation.
 
AWPC said:
Hmm let me guess ATI DX11 is going to suck FPS wise on their newer cards due later this month & beyond so they are trying to lower expectations as Nvidia are ahead & have superior developer relations/resources ;)

Lost Planet 2 & Metro 2033 are the best looking DX11 games right now (both TWIMTBP titles as well ;))
Click to expand...

Quick pass me that bucket...
 
AWPC said:
Hmm let me guess ATI DX11 is going to suck FPS wise on their newer cards due later this month & beyond so they are trying to lower expectations as Nvidia are ahead & have superior developer relations/resources ;)

Lost Planet 2 & Metro 2033 are the best looking DX11 games right now (both TWIMTBP titles as well ;))
Click to expand...

Lost planet 2 is nowhere near in the best looking Dx11 games lists & in fact most of the best looking games are still DX9.

And neither ATI or NV cards suck fps wise even now so i don't know where that comment has any validity.
 
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Skyrocket said:
This thread stinks of Nvidia fanboys.
AMD is quite right. Good programming is key.
Let's examine past programming flops such as crysis and more recently metro.

It's Not just adding Tesselation for Tesselation sake.
Tesselation was intended to be the holy Grail for programmers and gamers. Deliver smooth detailed meshes WITHOUT sacrificing performance. Unfortunatley the Developers have gone silly adding unnecessary high Tesselation to models that don't need it. Let's tessellate a perfectly round sphere.
Good programming it's what its all about.
Click to expand...

Agreed.
 
Skyrocket said:
This thread stinks of Nvidia fanboys.
AMD is quite right. Good programming is key.
Let's examine past programming flops such as crysis and more recently metro.

It's Not just adding Tesselation for Tesselation sake.
Tesselation was intended to be the holy Grail for programmers and gamers. Deliver smooth detailed meshes WITHOUT sacrificing performance. Unfortunatley the Developers have gone silly adding unnecessary high Tesselation to models that don't need it. Let's tessellate a perfectly round sphere.
Good programming it's what its all about.
Click to expand...

Indeed.
 
I guess ATI have identified a few areas where Tesselation hurts their GPU's much more than NVida products. I doubt that it will be 6900 specific, but it could have something to do with the iminent release of 3DMark11.

It seems very strange to be announcing this now. Smoke and fire....
 
Well, I tend to agree. AMD are simply saying what everybody should have been doing all along instead of just tesselating everything to get the DX 11 checkbox (I'm looking at YOU AvP!)

OTOH:
Skyrocket said:
Tesselation to models that don't need it. Let's tessellate a perfectly round sphere.
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Surely a sphere is actually an almost perfect case for tesselation? A geometric equation can be used to generate the additional vertices, a simple surface normal - eye vector dot product can be used to determine how close a polygon is to the silhouette edge and tesselation of that edge will provide visual benefit benefit down to triangles 1 pixel (and maybe even less) big.
 
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