AMD warns of tesselation pitfalls

Final8y · 3 Dec 2010 at 10:31

Alpherah said:
I think you miss-understood what i was saying
I realise what AMD are saying will be valid even without competing products.
All im saying is, this forum slates AMD and praises Nvidia and their TWIMTBP line, because they speak to Developers to make sure it runs as well as it should.
But when AMD do the same, even if its for the good of both card owners, its all because AMD are fail etc etc.

Double standards.

Well that is not true at all to say that the only time AMD speaks to or works with developers is when AMD are fail.

It really seems to me that people really don't know what's going on & AMD is involved in more things with developers than people know.

wolvers · 3 Dec 2010 at 10:33

Final8y said:
Well that is not true at all to say that the only time AMD speaks to or works with developers is when AMD are fail.

He's saying that's what peeps around here say and that it's wrong to look at it like that. He's right and you appear to agree with him, although you don't seem to realise.........unless I'm the one that is totally confused by what he's saying!

Final8y · 3 Dec 2010 at 10:38

wolvers69 said:
He's saying that's what peeps around here say and that it's wrong to look at it like that. He's right and you appear to agree with him, although you don't seem to realise.........unless I'm the one that is totally confused by what he's saying!

I do realise it but i'm just saying it wrong for people to assume that AMD do not get involved to because they dont add features that hinder the competing products.

Kribby2006 · 3 Dec 2010 at 10:39

Final8y said:
Don't speak on drunkenmaster's behalf as you haven't got a clue to why he has not commented.

Lol lighten up, he can say what he wants surely? I must admit, scrolling through each post in this thread I was surprised not to see one of DM's classics.

Phoenixdancer said:
Considering nothing changes with me i dont care

I agree with the AMD comments, I think too much emphasis is placed on throwing a shed load of hardware at stuff that just isn't very well coded from the start. It stands to reason that software (games/drivesr etc) should be well designed and further optimized.

As we've seen time and time again, lots of PC games are released these days that just aren't up to scratch.

Final8y · 3 Dec 2010 at 10:40

About AMD Gaming Evolved

http://sites.amd.com/us/game/community/Pages/aboutgamingevolved.aspx

And that logo if appearing more & more often on games.

Kribby2006 · 3 Dec 2010 at 10:48

Out of curiousity, I am curious to know to what extent Nvidia will have worked with a given game developer in order for them to put TWIMTBP logo within the game?

Do they really work closely with them to ensure it works well from the start? Is there a set of standards or objectives that need to be achieved or met?

555BUK · 3 Dec 2010 at 10:51

At 1920x1200 I see no real benifit using 16xAA vs 8xAA vs 4xAA. I still like to use the top settings because I can. I hate having to turn settings down after spending my hard-earned on a top-end graphics card. The same applies for Tesselation and any other setting that provides "better" IQ.

Baboonanza · 3 Dec 2010 at 10:57

Rroff said:
I'm not a great fan of tessellation myself - moderns PCs aren't challenged on storeage space, system bus speed, GPU memory and tris throughput to such a degree that it prohibits using original high quality well designed assets producing superior and more pleasing results than tessellation which tends to look a bit "upscaled". Theres a place for tessellation tho i.e. it can be used quite effectively on terrain.

I disagree. The main advantage of tesselation is not that is saves VRAM, PCI bus or GPU->VRAM bandwidth (though it helps in all of these areas and specific uses could actually be bottlenecked by one or more of them), it's that it allows triangle budgets to be used more efficiently by increasing triangle density only in areas that provide visual benefit in that particular frame.

That's at the root of what AMD are saying, if you simply tesselate everything without any adaptive process there is 0 benefit over using a very high-poly model. Use it intelligently to increase triangle density where it matters most and you can get the appearance of very high-poly models at a fraction of the performance cost.

wolvers · 3 Dec 2010 at 11:01

Final8y said:
I do realise it but i'm just saying it wrong for people to assume that AMD do not get involved to because they dont add features that hinder the competing products.

Then why are you saying that he doesn't know what's going on? :confused:

Seems to me that he's making the same point as you.

wolvers · 3 Dec 2010 at 11:03

Kribby2006 said:
Out of curiousity, I am curious to know to what extent Nvidia will have worked with a given game developer in order for them to put TWIMTBP logo within the game?

Do they really work closely with them to ensure it works well from the start? Is there a set of standards or objectives that need to be achieved or met?

It's not about how much they work with them but how much dosh they give the devs to endorse their hardware. That's why when their poster games, like Batman and MafiaII don't sell that well, they give them away with hardware as sweeteners. The same could be said for AMD and Dirt2.

Kribby2006 · 3 Dec 2010 at 11:10

^^^ I see

Final8y · 3 Dec 2010 at 11:18

Kribby2006 said:
Lol lighten up, he can say what he wants surely? I must admit, scrolling through each post in this thread I was surprised not to see one of DM's classics.

It is very unwise to say that someone is doing something & or not in a way that gives the impression of first hand knowledge from such a person which can easily lead to people believing that there is truth in it.

The simple truth that sometimes you just cant be bothered & i have been here long enough to see many good members stop posting here & move elsewhere & the last thing we need is for people to go around making up false reasons.

Final8y · 3 Dec 2010 at 11:25

wolvers69 said:
Then why are you saying that he doesn't know what's going on? Seems to me that he's making the same point as you.

Corrected.

Blame EVE-Online

Final8y · 3 Dec 2010 at 11:46

wolvers69 said:
It's not about how much they work with them but how much dosh they give the devs to endorse their hardware. That's why when their poster games, like Batman and MafiaII don't sell that well, they give them away with hardware as sweeteners. The same could be said for AMD and Dirt2.

I think those games sold very well besides MafiaII.
The cost of duplication of software is tiny as sweeteners & many of them are simply codes for download.

Dutch Guy · 3 Dec 2010 at 11:50

First AMD sets an IQ setting lower at default and now they tell developers to not use new tech as they suck at it.

Isn't it AMD business strategy to be competitive on pricing and midrange and not on the high end?

wolvers · 3 Dec 2010 at 12:16

Final8y said:
Corrected.

Blame EVE-Online

Hehe, furry muff

Final8y said:
I think those games sold very well besides MafiaII.
The cost of duplication of software is tiny as sweeteners & many of them are simply codes for download.

I doubt it if any of those games are in the top 20 best selling games of the year they came out in. Happy to be proved wrong though.

Final8y · 3 Dec 2010 at 12:46

wolvers69 said:
1)Hehe, furry muff

2)I doubt it if any of those games are in the top 20 best selling games of the year they came out in. Happy to be proved wrong though.

1) LOL i was doing the hardest plex in EVE which killed 3 of our 4 ships in the last room in under 2 minutes on our prior attempt & Pandemic Legion was only 5 jumps out fighting & i was typing in here.

Using this setup now that i built on the date showing in the pic.

2) I would not know but i thought Dirt2 was quite good.

Kribby2006 · 3 Dec 2010 at 12:53

Final8y said:
It is very unwise to say that someone is doing something & or not in a way that gives the impression of first hand knowledge from such a person which can easily lead to people believing that there is truth in it.

The simple truth that sometimes you just cant be bothered & i have been here long enough to see many good members stop posting here & move elsewhere & the last thing we need is for people to go around making up false reasons.

Im not sure there was that much in his comment, but I understand...

wolvers · 3 Dec 2010 at 13:20

Final8y, if you're not a female I don't think you should be trying to multi task like that!

Gerard · 3 Dec 2010 at 13:36

Dutch Guy said:
First AMD sets an IQ setting lower at default and now they tell developers to not use new tech as they suck at it.

Might want to show me where exactly theyre telling devs not to use tesselation, i must be reading a different article from you...

Dutch Guy said:
Isn't it AMD business strategy to be competitive on pricing and midrange and not on the high end?.

They still compete on the high end with the x2 gpu cards.