AMD Zen 3 (5000 Series), rumored 17% IPC gain.

Panos · 19 Apr 2020 at 10:48

GregI said:
The only person that did 60.9 was a psychopath running a 1920 FCLK with CAS 11 RAM. Yes... CAS 11. 1.75v IIRC... aka he's killing his PC for a benchmark.

It's luck of the draw to get 1900 so 3600Mhz RAM at CAS14 should be 65ns but no way a normal user who cares about longevity of hardware can do anywhere close to 60ns.

62.4 is easily viable at 3802C 14-16-14-28 with 1901 IF, since I am using it since Asrock released the 2.73 bios for the X570 Taichi in December. Power is 1.42v

And can be achieved with £130 kit also, that 4400Mhz Patriot OCUK was selling up to few days ago. I use a 3600C16 5y old kit

Panos · 19 Apr 2020 at 10:53

Troezar said:
So you're saying there's potential for a 24 core AM4 CPU? That could be interesting. It does seem like AMD aren't finished pushing up core counts. I wonder what their end game is?

It could leave existing software developers exposed by newcomers with alternative muticore optimised software. Intel look to have nowhere to go with frequency increases. The future appears to be more parallel processing, larger cache sizes, faster RAM and storage to feed those cores more quickly.

Physically there is space on the package with the shrinking of the I/O to the size of the chiplet and also the new 7nm+ chiplets are smaller.
I believe the wiring and willing would be an issue. Though I do believe it will sell like hotcakes at £1000 pricetag. Hell people bought binned 7700K & 7740X @ £900 less than 3 years ago....

Jimmy Weirdarms · 19 Apr 2020 at 11:10

Troezar said:
The future appears to be more parallel processing, larger cache sizes, faster RAM and storage to feed those cores more quickly.

This has been "the future" for a good 20 years now, but games have resisted the general trend because it can make things less easy to coordinate in a very rapid loop, AFAICT (even though GPUs are massively parallel...)

Silent_Scone · 19 Apr 2020 at 11:30

GregI said:
The only person that did 60.9 was a psychopath running a 1920 FCLK with CAS 11 RAM. Yes... CAS 11. 1.75v IIRC... aka he's killing his PC for a benchmark.

It's luck of the draw to get 1900 so 3600Mhz RAM at CAS14 should be 65ns but no way a normal user who cares about longevity of hardware can do anywhere close to 60ns.

Panos said:
62.4 is easily viable at 3802C 14-16-14-28 with 1901 IF, since I am using it since Asrock released the 2.73 bios for the X570 Taichi in December. Power is 1.42v

And can be achieved with £130 kit also, that 4400Mhz Patriot OCUK was selling up to few days ago. I use a 3600C16 5y old kit

With limited skew control most of the gains can be found on this platform in terts. This is my daily driver with 4 modules. With two, latency would improve further.

Troezar · 19 Apr 2020 at 14:03

Silent_Scone said:
With limited skew control most of the gains can be found on this platform in terts. This is my daily driver with 4 modules. With two, latency would improve further.

Isn't that running out of sync? I thought that was detrimental to performance?

Panos · 19 Apr 2020 at 14:20

Troezar said:
Isn't that running out of sync? I thought that was detrimental to performance?

No. As long as IF runs faster by 1mhz is OK.

kitfit1 · 19 Apr 2020 at 18:23

Panos said:
No. As long as IF runs faster by 1mhz is OK.

So, pray tell tell what Bios allows you to run IF 1mhz above normal ?

Panos · 19 Apr 2020 at 20:11

kitfit1 said:
So, pray tell tell what Bios allows you to run IF 1mhz above normal ?

The one that you can overclock your Bus. (base clock)

Yaayuh! · 19 Apr 2020 at 22:56

no idea what said:
Anyone else find it weird how this time last year there were tons of 3xxx series leaks and rumours and predictions going on, this year absolutely nothing really has surfaced at all.

Yeah, still waiting for that 5GHz chip “leaked”

Panos · 19 Apr 2020 at 23:01

Yaayuh! said:
Yeah, still waiting for that 5GHz chip “leaked”

If AMD had used the TSMC 7NP (7nm enhanced), used on the consoles APU then 5Ghz is viable with Zen 2

Yaayuh! · 20 Apr 2020 at 07:25

Panos said:
If AMD had used the TSMC 7NP (7nm enhanced), used on the consoles APU then 5Ghz is viable with Zen 2

If

Perfect_Chaos · 20 Apr 2020 at 09:16

The latency i mentioned doesn't seem to be memory latency, easy to get mixed up by it though

https://i.ibb.co/gZcvpsv/2019-12-28-image.png

Panos · 20 Apr 2020 at 09:55

Perfect_Chaos said:
The latency i mentioned doesn't seem to be memory latency, easy to get mixed up by it though

https://i.ibb.co/gZcvpsv/2019-12-28-image.png

The latency is down to the communications between the CCXs and also the I/O.
Ryzen 4000 goes away with 4 core CCXs and goes full 8 core CCD/CCX with over 32MB L3 shared between them. Also we will get Infinity Fabric 2, while the I/O is much intelligent and faster. An example how intelligent the I/O can be, is the PS5 presentation.
All these will lower the latency circle with the RAM significantly.

Don't ask to give you sources about IF2, we know current Zen 2 uses IF1 and Zen 4 next year uses IF3 (plenty of sources)...... Simple logic.

opethdisciple · 20 Apr 2020 at 11:27

How is it that all three Ryzens I've owned have had rubbish memory controllers?

1700, 2700x and now 3700x

Grim5 · 20 Apr 2020 at 11:33

opethdisciple said:
How is it that all three Ryzens I've owned have had rubbish memory controllers?

1700, 2700x and now 3700x

mage it's your motherboard

opethdisciple · 20 Apr 2020 at 11:35

Grim5 said:
mage it's your motherboard

Switched that too only recently.

humbug · 20 Apr 2020 at 13:00

You're running 3600Mhz CL16?

Panos · 20 Apr 2020 at 13:18

opethdisciple said:
How is it that all three Ryzens I've owned have had rubbish memory controllers?

1700, 2700x and now 3700x

Is your motherboard, RAM or you.

1800X on the CH6 had a great controller using my 5y old 3600C16 kit out of the box when everyone else was crying couldn't go over 3200 in April 2017!
3900X on the X570 Taichi the board took 3800C16 with 1900IF initially and 3800C14 with the 2.73 bios.

Rule of thumb. When comes to PSU & RAM buy good products. The 3600C16 kit bought it 5y ago for £125 for the 6700K when everyone was saying "nah ram means nothing to performance"

opethdisciple · 20 Apr 2020 at 14:13

It's the CPU. The memory controller is on the CPU not on the mobo.

My 3700x has the same IF limit of 1800MHz on my x570 mobo that it did on my x370 mobo.

The same limitation of dram calc fast timings not working on my x570 board as they did not on my x370.

Yes, I am running my 3200MHz 8 Pack ram at 3600MHz CL16. That is the limits of my CPU.

The limitation is not the mobo. It's silicon lottery of the chip you buy.

Hence why with every iteration of CPU AMD release the memory speeds increase even when using the same mobos with the new chips.

Lolik · 20 Apr 2020 at 17:05

opethdisciple said:
It's the CPU. The memory controller is on the CPU not on the mobo.

My 3700x has the same IF limit of 1800MHz on my x570 mobo that it did on my x370 mobo.

The same limitation of dram calc fast timings not working on my x570 board as they did not on my x370.

Yes, I am running my 3200MHz 8 Pack ram at 3600MHz CL16. That is the limits of my CPU.

The limitation is not the mobo. It's silicon lottery of the chip you buy.

Hence why with every iteration of CPU AMD release the memory speeds increase even when using the same mobos with the new chips.

IF limit you've mentioned is true dependent on the cpu itself, but most of the members were able to get 3600 c14 on the same 8pack 3200 c14 kit, so maybe you haven't pushed yours to the limits?