Another Rape Accusation Outrage

[phonemonkey]

I think that while we need to be careful and not do anything to deter victims of sexual assaults from coming forward in cases like this where it has been proved that the accuser has deliberately falsely accused another person of sexual violence then the punishment should be sterner then this.

False accusations ruin the lives of those who have been falsely accused and their families. It also creates doubt in societies mind about the truthfulness of all those who come forward with their allegations. It makes it harder for victims to be taken seriously and allows for victim blaming. I imagine it also, as a result, makes victims less likely to come forward and report a crime that historically has gone massively under reported. It perhaps also influences juries subconsciously, making those sitting on juries more sceptical about the validity of the evidence presented by victims, making convictions harder to come. Convictions in sexual assault cases are already so woefully low that it put victims off reporting their assaults for fear of not being believed. Cases like this do no favours to anyone. The repercussions are serious and the penalty should reflect the damage done.

 

[XeNoN89]

I still don't understand why identities of the accused aren't protected just like the accuser, until they are found guilty. It would help prevent massive damage to the life of falsely accused.

 

[Hotwired]

I still don't understand why identities of the accused aren't protected just like the accuser, until they are found guilty. It would help prevent massive damage to the life of falsely accused.

Justice is meant to be seen to be done. The aberration is actually that grown adults can make claims and have their identity protected while the other party gets all the negative social effects of the accusation.

Convictions in sexual assault cases are already so woefully low that it put victims off reporting their assaults for fear of not being believed.

Well, convictions are low because the evidence is generally two unreliable witnesses. Is this really any worse than any other claims of crime where the evidence is similarly flawed.

 

[phonemonkey]

Justice is meant to be seen to be done. The aberration is actually that grown adults can make claims and have their identity protected while the other party gets all the negative social effects of the accusation.



Well, convictions are low because the evidence is generally two unreliable witnesses. Is this really any worse than any other claims of crime where the evidence is similarly flawed.

I make no judgements on why its low, and I certainly don't suggest that its deliberate. You're right, in many cases the (understandably) high threshold of beyond reasonable doubt is hard to meet when the evidence is largely the stories of the involved parties. This is particularly true because few sexual assaults are reported immediately thus removing the option for forensic/medical evidence. My point was, that whatever the reasons for the low conviction rates, they do put victims off reporting sexual assaults. The behaviour of the woman in this case undermines societies trust in the word of victims of sexual assault, which will not only lower conviction rates in itself, but also reduce reporting rates as victims have to both work harder to convince juries they're telling the truth, and have to work harder to believe they'll be believed. And that doesn't even mention the impact the case has had on the accused, which will also be huge and should not be ignore. Thus crimes like this are serious, and should be treated as such

 

[VincentHanna]

I agree, there should be harsh sentences for false accusations, but only when it gets to the point that the person being falsely accused is charged by the CPS and has to go through the rigmarole of a trial, before it all unfolding on the accuser.

In this case the sentence seems fair to me.

If the guy had been in court, with his name plastered over the papers then it's a different story and the girl should be dealt with more severely.

 

[Caracus2k]

I can find any mention of it in the reporting but there's a reasonable chance the defendant in this case was (legally) a child at the time of commiting the offence and the sentencing reflects this?

(Although she was dealt with in the adult court as she was 18 at the time of being charged?)

Practitioners should also be aware that “….with respect to an offender who has crossed a relevant age threshold between the date of the offence and the date of conviction culpability is generally to be judged by reference to the offender’s age at the time of committing the offence…

 

[mmj_uk]

There needs to be more punishment than simply "wasting police time", falsely accusing a man of rape is an attempt to frame them for a crime they did not commit. If that's not conspiracy to attack/imprison somebody then I don't know what is.

 

[Mason-]

I think this is the crucial point.

She lied to her mate to make her ex boyfriend seem like a horrible *******, her mate told the police and she kinda went along with the lie until it all unravelled a few days later.

She's 18 as well. She might be an adult but she's still a silly immature teenager.

Putting her in prison for 5 years, which is the CPS sentencing guideline for a single rape offence with no aggravating factors, would be ridiculous

If the lie stuck, should he be given a 4 month suspended sentence and a £200 fine? Because, you know he’s only 18 after all. (I assume but let’s say he was)

 

[VincentHanna]

No, because he would have been found guilty by a jury?

Completely different scenarios.

 

[Steampunk]

These sorts of things really need to get elevated to perverting the course of justice and punished accordingly, especially with the many recent cases that ended up with men's lives wrecked for years before going to trial. In some cases with men serving time for crimes they didn't commit and branded as sex offenders, or even in a few committing suicide because of the stress and the loss of their jobs/relationships/families.

 

[VincentHanna]

These sorts of things really need to get elevated to perverting the course of justice and punished accordingly, especially with the many recent cases that ended up with men's lives wrecked for years before going to trial. In some cases with men serving time for crimes they didn't commit and branded as sex offenders, or even in a few committing suicide because of the stress and the loss of their jobs/relationships/families.

Yes

A completely different scenario to the one in this thread that never got passed a day of questions in custody.

 

[Ahleckz]

Unfortunately the reality is such that the accused may have had some uncomfortable months (I don't think 5 hours in custody is a huge hardship personally) however the culture that women have to put up with and the behaviour they are subjected to throughout their normal day is of a much higher magnitude than being held for 5 hours and temporarily being branded as a rapist.

It is unbelievable what women have to put up with, talk to your female friends/partners about it and it's awful. The constant sexual aggression, comments, leers and frankly inappropriate behaviour women get all day, every day, needs to change. Victim blaming is rife, and the fact is many women won't report sexual assaults (and rapes) due to the stigma and the worry. Plus, the burden of proof is so high that it wouldn't be uncommon for the victim to end up being branded as a liar whilst the perpetrator walks free.

Instead of focusing on getting those who accuse people incorrectly of rape or sexual assault (which is very few), we (as in men) should be focusing our attentions on eradicating the rape culture that is akin to an epidemic of this country and try our best to make sure women can go out and live their life without the constant sexual derived attention.

 

[MooMoo444]

They should stamp down hard on this and make an example. It ruins lives.

£200 quid fine is laughable. Doesn’t even cover the investigation costs.

 

[Caracus2k]

Unfortunately the reality is such that the accused may have had some uncomfortable months (I don't think 5 hours in custody is a huge hardship personally) however the culture that women have to put up with and the behaviour they are subjected to throughout their normal day is of a much higher magnitude than being held for 5 hours and temporarily being branded as a rapist.

It is unbelievable what women have to put up with, talk to your female friends/partners about it and it's awful. The constant sexual aggression, comments, leers and frankly inappropriate behaviour women get all day, every day, needs to change. Victim blaming is rife, and the fact is many women won't report sexual assaults (and rapes) due to the stigma and the worry. Plus, the burden of proof is so high that it wouldn't be uncommon for the victim to end up being branded as a liar whilst the perpetrator walks free.

Instead of focusing on getting those who accuse people incorrectly of rape or sexual assault (which is very few), we (as in men) should be focusing our attentions on eradicating the rape culture that is akin to an epidemic of this country and try our best to make sure women can go out and live their life without the constant sexual derived attention.

Your invite letter to be a guardian columnist is in the post. Please ensure to reference the 'patriarchy' and 'male gaze/entitlement ' in your first submission.

Also don't forget to scream at anyone suggesting that certain types of a mistreatment aren't as bad as other (but only when referring to women) ... Deploying this argument when it comes to men (for example thoose falsely accused and arrested for rape) is part of the patriarchal oppression.

 

[Tefal]

Had she stuck to her story and the young Man ended up with a rape conviction, would he have been treated leniently on account of his age??

More than likley, it's what usually happens

 

[a1ex2001]

Thread seems to be full of massive over reactions and to my mind the punishment handed out seems pretty reasonable given the circumstances. Locking her up for five years as a warning to others is frankly ridiculous.

 

[Tefal]

There needs to be more punishment than simply "wasting police time", falsely accusing a man of rape is an attempt to frame them for a crime they did not commit. If that's not conspiracy to attack/imprison somebody then I don't know what is.

Well had she gone to the police and accused him it would have been perverting the course of justice with a much harsher sentence.

Had she gone to court it would have been perjury too with an even harsher sentence.

However as she told a friend who then I firmed the police without her knowledge after speaking to all involved they decided to go with a lesser sentence and accept that some times hormonal teenagers do stupid things and that therapy is better than jist ruining her life

 

[Tone1979]

Accusing someone of rape should come with the same sentence as that of rape. Both actions can ruin a life.

 

[Hades]

Accusing someone of rape should come with the same sentence as that of rape. Both actions can ruin a life.

It's a tricky line because you don't want a genuine victim to be afraid of reporting it. But I agree where a case is proven to be malicious that the punishment should be much harsher than just wasting police time.

 

[wolfie138]

Unfortunately the reality is such that the accused may have had some uncomfortable months (I don't think 5 hours in custody is a huge hardship personally) however the culture that women have to put up with and the behaviour they are subjected to throughout their normal day is of a much higher magnitude than being held for 5 hours and temporarily being branded as a rapist.

It is unbelievable what women have to put up with, talk to your female friends/partners about it and it's awful. The constant sexual aggression, comments, leers and frankly inappropriate behaviour women get all day, every day, needs to change. Victim blaming is rife, and the fact is many women won't report sexual assaults (and rapes) due to the stigma and the worry. Plus, the burden of proof is so high that it wouldn't be uncommon for the victim to end up being branded as a liar whilst the perpetrator walks free.

Instead of focusing on getting those who accuse people incorrectly of rape or sexual assault (which is very few), we (as in men) should be focusing our attentions on eradicating the rape culture that is akin to an epidemic of this country and try our best to make sure women can go out and live their life without the constant sexual derived attention.

what an absolute pile of steaming **** you talk. so women [in some vague generalness] have a hard time therefore you condone them lying and accusing someone of rape and potentially ruining their/famiy's lives. what a total idiot you are. how about i arrange for someone to accuse you of raping and drugging them, and we'll see if the effects of that just bother you for 5 hours or so?