The FIA DID notice, and RBR were warned after quali as well (hmmm, everything I have read indicated there was a warning between qualifying and the race, but I suppose it could have referred to the practice sessions but imo it sounded like it was a warning about quali itself)
Australian Grand Prix 2014, Melbourne - Race 1/19
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The FIA DID notice, and RBR were warned after quali as well (hmmm, everything I have read indicated there was a warning between qualifying and the race, but I suppose it could have referred to the practice sessions but imo it sounded like it was a warning about quali itself)
so is it safe to assume that if this is an FIA part that
1-all the other teams either obeyed the FIA rules/guidance
2-other teams didnt run over the limit and used that reading as absolute and correct
and iff you assume that all the sensors are erroneous to the same degree (is this true?) then RBR did indeed probably run a higher performance setup over the rivals?
was this just on DRs car? he is the only one under investigation. ?
did SB run the same over use as well and this is just not debated as he DNFed?
1-all the other teams either obeyed the FIA rules/guidance
2-other teams didnt run over the limit and used that reading as absolute and correct
and iff you assume that all the sensors are erroneous to the same degree (is this true?) then RBR did indeed probably run a higher performance setup over the rivals?
was this just on DRs car? he is the only one under investigation. ?
did SB run the same over use as well and this is just not debated as he DNFed?
The FIA probably havent bothered to do anything about SV because of the retirement but I would suspect it was equally at fault (had it finished)
Other teams DID go over and pulled back under the flow rate when warned by the FIA.
I don't understand why so many people think the driver shouldn't be punished. Its a team sport, you can't separate the two. one braking the rule, gives advantages to the other. thru guy on the f1 show was an idiot. Especially when he said if it was vet he would have a different opinion.
Was interesting that although Marrusia didn't say it explicitly. they turned down the power to comply with fiat.
Was interesting that although Marrusia didn't say it explicitly. they turned down the power to comply with fiat.
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You guys are talking as if Ricciardo had a second a lap advantage through fuel usage. The interference was causing the sensor to peak above 100kg/h, he wasn't running at 120kg/h or anything silly, the reading was just spiking above 100kg/h. He very likely wasn't even running at over 100kg/h. Even if he was above the limit (not just the dodgy sensor reading) he probably would have gained a fraction of a tenth if any time at all. Certainly not enough to just pull away from another driver at will.
Granted, other teams did turn the mixture down to compensate for the inaccuracies in the sensor reading, but we're highly unlikely to be talking more than 2 or 3bhp. It wasn't exactly going down from a qualifying fuel usage to "must-save-fuel" mode.
Granted, other teams did turn the mixture down to compensate for the inaccuracies in the sensor reading, but we're highly unlikely to be talking more than 2 or 3bhp. It wasn't exactly going down from a qualifying fuel usage to "must-save-fuel" mode.
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Thats not the point though, the point is the FIA make the rules and the teams obey them. Other teams listened and took action even if they didn't agree RB waved to fingers at the FIA and have been rightly punished as every parent knows you can't let an unruly childs bad behaviour go or next time they just push you further.
My opinion is that it must have been making a significant difference to the cars performance otherwise RB would have just tuned it down and avoid incuring the wrath of the FIA if not they just blew a podium finish for the sake of 2-3bhp and thats bonkers!
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I'm not defending RBR at all, just stating that from what I understand, some people's interpretation of the issues and potential advantages gained are way off the mark.
As I remember, the FIA stated before the sessions that there would be a zero-tolerance approach (or words to that effect) to the new fuel-usage rules. They had a small advantage over the opposition - that much is indisputable - their argument seems likely to centre around them not using more than 100kg/h (I still struggle to see how they can argue successfully when not adhering the to the FIA-approved measurements, but if they're appealing they must think they've got a good case, as they're risking a heavier punishment).
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I guess you haven't read the previous page then, because the FIA said that Ricciardo would have finished 5th if red bull had obeyed the FIA's fuel sensor readings, and Skeeter worked out that would mean a performance reduction of 0.175s per lap. So, a bit more than "a fraction of a tenth"
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I guess you haven't read the previous page then, because the FIA said that Ricciardo would have finished 5th if red bull had obeyed the FIA's fuel sensor readings, and Skeeter worked out that would mean a performance reduction of 0.175s per lap. So, a bit more than "a fraction of a tenth"
Potentially, yet people are arguing the same amount of variation exists within the actual variance of the sensor that th fia has chosn to use.
Its a very strange situation, that variance up and down and how much advantage the fia claim it would hav given in a spiking system is still within th maximum variance of 8% of the sensors made.
I completely agree.
the driver wouldnt get those points if he didnt have the car and the car wouldnt get the points without the driver
the driver and team gained so both should be stripped
its a shame for DR but it is what it is.
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I guess you haven't read the previous page then, because the FIA said that Ricciardo would have finished 5th if red bull had obeyed the FIA's fuel sensor readings, and Skeeter worked out that would mean a performance reduction of 0.175s per lap. So, a bit more than "a fraction of a tenth"
Well I read that the F1 Show said it, and I've not seen it so they may have had an official on it, but they're not the FIA.
Hopefully the appeal findings are made public.
I think this whole saga shows that the FIA simply need to be more transparent with the fan base. Almost everything being discussed is based on speculation, or interpretation of vauge details.
The FIA need to publish the full details of things like this. Leaving us in the dark just alienates the fan base. The difference between 100.1kg/h or 120kg/h is important.
The FIA need to publish the full details of things like this. Leaving us in the dark just alienates the fan base. The difference between 100.1kg/h or 120kg/h is important.
I dont think it is important, a limit is set and over is over.
However agree on your first point.
Its also stupid that they knew throughout the race, and was allowed in the podium. The sporting regulations needs an overhaul. He should have been black flagged. Or at the minimum disqualified 0.1sevonds after crossing the finish line. VIA have telemetry. The whole need to talk to trams/drivers is stupid. You can see if they have turned the steering wheel that caused a crash or whatever there is virtually never a need to take 5hrs + after a race.
Cameras should also be mandated, rather than just the pods, then they would have even more data to look at during the race.
However agree on your first point.
Its also stupid that they knew throughout the race, and was allowed in the podium. The sporting regulations needs an overhaul. He should have been black flagged. Or at the minimum disqualified 0.1sevonds after crossing the finish line. VIA have telemetry. The whole need to talk to trams/drivers is stupid. You can see if they have turned the steering wheel that caused a crash or whatever there is virtually never a need to take 5hrs + after a race.
Cameras should also be mandated, rather than just the pods, then they would have even more data to look at during the race.
Its important because the lack of information fuels theories. We have suggestions that the RBR is so slow that they need to cheat to be competitive, suggestions that RBR are unbelievably arrogant and think the rules don't apply to them, and suggestions that Ricciardo was cheating through qualifying and the race to an extent that meant he had a massive advantage.
All of that could be true, but we just don't know. It's not good for the sport to let things like this fester simply because they won't release the full details.
And 5 hours after the race to decide something they knew on Friday is absolutely stupid, as you said. Again, the fans deserve the right to be confident in the final results.
All of that could be true, but we just don't know. It's not good for the sport to let things like this fester simply because they won't release the full details.
And 5 hours after the race to decide something they knew on Friday is absolutely stupid, as you said. Again, the fans deserve the right to be confident in the final results.
That is just so shocking after the last few years to come out with that.
It may well be an idle threat but that doesnt excuse it.
What a complete *******
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Good, F1 doesn't need cheats. Get out, take your finger waggling douchebag and the team you bought so you could give your real drivers an unfair advantage with you.