Or... Just do another Belgium.
Austrian Grand Prix 2015, Spielberg - Race 8/19
- Thread starter Shimmy
- Start date
Or... Just do another Belgium.
Man of Honour
The 4 races since the V6s arrived that were not won by the Mercedes team weren't won by Mercedes engines either. If you remove the Mercedes team from the results you actually have a very close, very varied couple of seasons.
I'd argue that it's the chassis that's the main reason for Mercedes (team) success, and not the engine. 2nd in the WCC last year was a Renault engine and 2nd so far this year is a Ferrari.
The Mercedes PU is obviously pretty good, but its not a guaranteed winner just by having one. It's pace is being exaggerated by being in the back of a Mercedes chassis.
No they're not, they should be making their own engine.
Not only would they likely do a better job than Honda but it would be a far better image to project.
Their road car division is trying to sell supercars and hybrid hypercars. What kind of message does it send when the F1 team uses Honda engines - basically saying "we can't make a decent F1 engine ourselves so had to get someone else to do it". Doesn't lend much kudos to their road cars, unlike Ferrari or Mercedes.
Associate
Do McLaren make their own engines for their supercars though?
I suspect the huge resources needed to develop your own PU (either in-house or contracted out) would make a partnership and investment from Honda look to be the obvious route to take. The 'likely do a better job than Honda' is easy to say with hindsight
Soldato
Yep, though Ricardo did consult on the project and also do the assembly. The engine actually has its roots in the TWR designed Nissan IRL engine (the VRH-35) though pretty much nothing of that exists in the current design!
Associate
Thanks, I knew they outsourced the assembly but didn't know the origins of the design.
Soldato
Back on topic, (and tbh the P1 could have my first car's engine in from my 96 Fiesta Classic and I'd still drive it)..
Both McLaren's starting from the back of the grid, Alonso with a drive through penalty and Button a 10 second stop go.
Great penalty rules.
Both McLaren's starting from the back of the grid, Alonso with a drive through penalty and Button a 10 second stop go.
Great penalty rules.
TBF, no one else had those kinds of corner case penalties either this year or last year, because no one else has had such a terrible engine where development is happening at the races. Even the Renault problems were not so extreme that they were changing engines every five minutes.
Soldato
Instead of driving out of the McLaren garage today Button and Alonso will be coming out of a Cave from the Neolithic age.
Soldato
Dry your eyes mate.
I'm not upset, it's got to the point of being so bad and calamitous that it's actually amusing now.
McLaren don't have ambitions of becoming a specialist engine builder. Neither do I suspect they have the ~£500m lying around to invest in making an F1 PU.
They badge their own engine, but as JRS said its not really designed or built by them. And while they have a road car range that will soon grow to 5 separate lines, plus specials and racers, every single one uses the same core engine. And its not a 1.6 V6.
They breached the rules, they take the penalties. What else do you suggest?
Soldato
Anyway I didn't really take in to the long run pace today, what are Ferrari looking like on the long runs? Hope Seb can give the Mercs a good fight today, would be nice to see them all having a good scrap, and maybe the Williams can mix things up a bit.
Soldato
Amend the rules /penalties.
Soldato
I don't know, they're racing drivers, a 25 place penalty AND a 10 second stop go/drive through is a pretty severe handicap for allowing the fans to see cars racing. Do we want to see cars trundling around all on their own for an entire GP? It's bad enough to see the Manor's doing that when they're given the 5 seconds of air time during a Grand Prix that they get.
Maybe instead of punishing the drivers so much they should punish the team more squarely by deducting Constructor points, thus allowing the drivers to at least have a chance of racing and thereby allowing the fans to see some racing. At least it was fun to see Alonso disregarding the team's wishes in Montreal and actually having a few dogfights with the other cars. That's what the fans want to see, what they pay good money for travelling to a GP to, accommodation, tickets, food, spending money etc. It's expensive stuff for them. They don't want to see the McLarens 2 laps down moving over under blue flags to let Saubers through.
Last edited:
Soldato
^I agree with what smr is saying. It seems unfair and always stacked against the driver. It does no good for the sport.
Soldato
The teams voted the rules in didn't they? Seems silly crying over spilt milk when they all agreed. Mclaren road cars have nothing to do with the f1, don't know why we're going there when the f1 team is in partnership with honda and the engines are specifically designed for the mclarens. Far removed from the customer supplied engine by mercedes that will never beat their own cars...
Soldato
Anyone rain dancing?