Beyerdynamic DT770 Pro Which Ones ?

Demon · 24 Nov 2012 at 12:21

I just picked up a set of DT770's 250ohm from the MM on here, and I can offer a little experience..

I came from the cheap, but good Panasonic HTF600's which have volume/presence but lack obvious refinement.

Plugging the 250Ohm DT770's into the FiiO E7, the volume level was very underwhelming, no real bass, sounded pretty rubbish tbh..
Using an iPhone 4s/5 it was a little better, but still pretty underwhelming..
The only thing that can drive them just about acceptably for desk listening is my Xonar DX.. but it still lacks a bit of 'oomph' in the bass department..

However, I've been waiting for an excuse to get a desktop headphone amp, so went for a FiiO E09K, which is rated at >150mW @ 300Ohm's which sounded just about up to the job..

It's just arrived, and WOW.. yes sirree, that's more like it.. insane levels of oomph and superb clarity (Line in from the Xonar DX at the moment)..

However, that £100 on it's own!! worth it if you like your music as I do, but if the aim is to get a £120 set of headphones and want 'oomph' from normal audio sources, you may be a little disappointed with not being able to really max them out..

With an good AMP, I'd say that the bass is the most pronounced improvement alongside plenty of volume.. I could live with just using the Xonar DX, but for real head pumping stuff, an AMP (minimum of something like the E09) can really get the bass levels where you expect them..

joeyjojo · 24 Nov 2012 at 12:37

Demon said:
Plugging the 250Ohm DT770's into the same sources (Xonar DX or FiiO E7), they just where so quiet, no real oomph or volume.. very underwhelming..

However, that £100 on it's own!! worth it if you like your music as I do, but if the aim is to get a £120 set of headphones and want 'oomph' from normal audio sources, you may be quite disappointed..

With an good AMP, I'd say that the bass is the most pronounced improvement alongside plenty of volume, I don't think I could live with them otherwise..

The DX should be able to get them loud, at least 100 dB. Still it has (apparently) a very high output impedance (100 ohms) so the amp will definitely improve things there. This is probably why the bass sounds better from the amp.

Most "normal audio sources" have line level outputs. This means ~2 V output and often high output impedances, as they're expected to connect to the input of another stage which will have a huge input impedance (megaohm) so plenty of damping. They're not designed to drive headphones directly. You wouldn't connect hi-fi speakers directly to them, so headphones shouldn't be any different.

Also general comment: the choice of impedance only changes the amount of voltage/current needed from the amp (soundcard, whatever). A high impedance will require more voltage/less current, and vice versa. Most digital kit are better current sources than voltage, so usually the low impedance model is more appropriate.

humax · 24 Nov 2012 at 18:38

Do you think i would be better off getting a E09 or would my NAD 320BEE Amplifier be better at driving the Headphones

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Kei · 24 Nov 2012 at 20:11

Have you used the nad amp to drive them yet? Imo, the amp should be just as good as a separate headphone amp.

humax · 24 Nov 2012 at 20:38

Hi

The NAD drives my other headphones with no problem,but there only 32 ohms The Beyerdynamic will be 250 ohms

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joeyjojo · 24 Nov 2012 at 22:11

http://www.head-fi.org/t/627799/hig...mp-to-sound-good-please-can-we-kill-this-myth

250 ohm headphones will require more voltage and less current than 32 ohm hedphones to get equally loud, all else equal. That integrated amp will have plenty of voltage swing for either (and current for that matter).

Whether it sounds good, that depends on the circuit. Kei is more knowledgeable on that than me.

Demon · 26 Nov 2012 at 20:49

joeyjojo said:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/627799/hig...mp-to-sound-good-please-can-we-kill-this-myth

250 ohm headphones will require more voltage and less current than 32 ohm hedphones to get equally loud, all else equal. That integrated amp will have plenty of voltage swing for either (and current for that matter).

Whether it sounds good, that depends on the circuit. Kei is more knowledgeable on that than me.

The 320 BEE has 220ohm output impedence, so it's not the best output in terms of damping factor, but I'm sure it'll still do the job.

My Xonar DX and E7 are both 2V rms (16mW @ 300ohms = 108db SPL for the 250 ohm DT770's).. if the 320BEE has a higher voltage, then volume should be adequate.

I would say that if you just want good SQ and listen at normal levels, then I think plenty of sources can handle them just fine, providing you don't want to indulge yourself in OTT levels of bass and volume..

If you do want to 'max' them out so to speak, you really will need an AMP with reasonably low output impedence, and 5- 6V RMS (110db SPL), something that is much harder to come by..

However, I have to say that after demoing the DT770's with the E09K amp to the guys in work for the first time ever, they where amazed at the quantity and quality.. especially when back to backing with my old work phones, the HTF600s which have decent if slightly bloated bass, but fall apart everywhere else in comparison.... it's quite nice to have spent money on a set of phones that actually sound like they are truly worth the money!

humax · 26 Nov 2012 at 21:17

Thanks for that,do you think i might be better off going with some 80ohm ones instead if my Amps not up to the job

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Demon · 26 Nov 2012 at 22:15

I think I'd be tempted to go with the 80 ohms, just as you know everything will drive it really well. The 250 ohms in theory might give that little bit tighter control, but unless you have a good amp in your source, you won't be able to eq insane levels of bass or volume, which is a personal thing, as all headphones are.

humax · 27 Nov 2012 at 17:24

Thanks Demon I'm going with the 80 ohms. All i have to decide now is do i buy now or wait till January and see if they come down in price in the sales

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joeyjojo · 27 Nov 2012 at 18:15

humax said:
Thanks Demon I'm going with the 80 ohms. All i have to decide now is do i buy now or wait till January and see if they come down in price in the sales

I'd buy them now if I were you http://uk.camelcamelcamel.com/Beyerdynamic-DT770-PRO-Headset-OHM/product/B0016MNAAI

humax · 27 Nov 2012 at 18:30

Thanks for the link joeyjojo

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humax · 27 Nov 2012 at 19:07

Looks like i will now have to rule out the DT 990 as they don't come in 80 ohms

Phal · 28 Nov 2012 at 08:27

Just get the 250s

Kei · 28 Nov 2012 at 09:28

As said, that nad would be more than sufficient to drive headphones with an impedance far higher than 250 ohms. (my integrated has more than enough power to damage my 1.7k headphones quite easily, though i'd damage my hearing first if i were wearing them) Just stick with the 250's.

melmac · 28 Nov 2012 at 11:42

Another vote for just getting the 250 Ohm DT990 pro headphones!!

humax · 28 Nov 2012 at 19:08

If i did find that the Nad was not good enough,is there anything i could add to it to make it sound better with the DT990s

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Kei · 28 Nov 2012 at 20:02

Not easily, as it would involve taking the amp apart and tinkering with the headphone circuit. I seriously doubt it would sound poor though.

fendR · 29 Nov 2012 at 10:05

Coming from a complete sound noob.

I'm also interested in the DT770's or the 990's. Primarily for gaming and music.

Would they work well with an onboard sound card and what's the difference in 80 and 250 ohms?

Kei · 29 Nov 2012 at 11:07

To answer your other question, 80ohms would be best, but even that is too high for a standard line out from onboard. (it'll work, but you won't get loud from it) You'd need either a sound card with an amp built in or a separate amp to get the best from the headphones.

With regard to impedance, in simple terms, an amplifier has a fixed maximum output voltage. The load impedance determines the current that flows and the overall power. That's why lower impedances force an amplifier to produce more power and also why amplifiers have minimum impedance limitations. (too low an impedance will result in too much current being drawn, you can calculate theoretical maximum current draw if you know the amplifiers voltage swing using I=V/R)

For a more in depth description look at this article.