biometric clocking in/out systems?

thanks for all the info chaps - I've got a few call backs coming my way so hopefully get something sorted over the next few days
 
Diagro said:
Have the staff been informed that they will be required to "sign in" and possibility of their finger print being recorded?

I don't think they will take to kindly to having that forced down upon them.

My work tried it, but because people don't want to have to filter through the main office to get places, and would much rather go directly to their workplace they just don't do it. And no one checks.
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They tried to implement a finger print in and out system at our place a few years ago. While I never objected, the dullards I work with argued against it on that basis, and they scraped it for key fobs.

They'd have a point, but they give it up in so many other obvious ways.
 
There used to be a hand/palm print scanner type thing serco used for clocking in in our place.

That used to work for hundreds of employees
 
benhaha85 said:
Also, with regards to storing fingerprints, it is a one way process, you can't get the fingerprint back from the DB record. Well that's at least the case with the sagem sdk.
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Pure interest how is that possible? Surely if you can query the db you can get its data back?
 
Clocking in systems are a pain, great idea in theory but in practise they always fail due to your staff. I swear staff leave there thumbs at home! In the end we back to pen and paper as anything else was just taking too long to process the payroll.
 
Mynight said:
Pure interest how is that possible? Surely if you can query the db you can get its data back?
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If they store the raw image then yes
Most systems create a template based on a particular algorithm which is only compatible with that software - and ditch the photo, you cant get the image back from the template, its an encoded log of minutia points
 
Maybe I'm overthinking it but surely all fingerprint comparison uses an algorithm similar to each other as such if you could work out how it compares prints you could create a fingerprint that contains the relevant comparison points.

Obviously this is far above your average employee to log their buddy into work but I was just curious about the one way claim.
 
I'm not sticking my thumb onto anything, when the last person probably used their thumb* to wipe their arse.

RFID all the way.




*theoretically possible, if a little non optimal.
 
What's the point in a non mission critical secure workplace, people will immediately know if you haven't shown up for work?

I'm assuming here it's being used for payroll purposes and not access control.
 
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Mynight said:
Maybe I'm overthinking it but surely all fingerprint comparison uses an algorithm similar to each other as such if you could work out how it compares prints you could create a fingerprint that contains the relevant comparison points.

Obviously this is far above your average employee to log their buddy into work but I was just curious about the one way claim.
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only a certain number of minutiae points are recorded, its nowhere near enough points to recreate a full fingerprint image

(imagine picking 100 pixels out of a 800x600 image, you are never going to have enough pixels to recreate the full picture again later)

different fingerprint algorythms will be functionally similar in the way that they work, but the resulting template file will be completely different from different software products (the template could be a string, or letters, or encoded in some way)

if you took a template created from a particular program, bought a copy of the same software and set it up in the same way, you could make matches against that fingerprint successfully, an expert who had access to that system could extract the data, work out what software was used, buy a copy and then match against that template, but you wouldnt be able to get back that image from the template (assuming they didnt keep the raw image in the DB as well)
 
Can't you just implant an RFID chip in to each member of staff? That solves the problem of people clocking in for each other, unless they start cutting off their own limbs and handing them around.
Actually best fit it in the head.
 
Strife212 said:
What's the point in a non mission critical secure workplace, people will immediately know if you haven't shown up for work?

I'm assuming here it's being used for payroll purposes and not access control.
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there is a high degree of trust placed on staff in our work place to keep to their working hours and record their over time legitimately. unfortunately 2 or 3 staff members appear to not be playing fair.

the hope is that the implementation of a clocking system will act as a 'polite' reminder to be a bit more honest regards breaks and time keeping in general - rather than having to go straight into the whole issuing warnings/disciplinary etc
 
Thekwango said:
there is a high degree of trust placed on staff in our work place to keep to their working hours and record their over time legitimately. unfortunately 2 or 3 staff members appear to not be playing fair.

the hope is that the implementation of a clocking system will act as a 'polite' reminder to be a bit more honest regards breaks and time keeping in general - rather than having to go straight into the whole issuing warnings/disciplinary etc
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For 2 or 3 staff surely it just makes sense to tell them you known they're being cheeky willys and to behave themselves before you start handing out warnings and things rather than dropping a large amount of time and money on this.
 
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