[BleepingComputer] UK Passes the Most Extreme Surveillance Law in the History of Western Democracy

D3K · 21 Nov 2016 at 12:14

Armageus said:
That's a far leap to go from being logged to being publicly available to all though?

I didn't mention publically available. But you can bet if you ever want to work for the MoD or other gov agency, it will be used in the vetting process.
Even private companies will be able to make use of private detectives with inside contacts to "research" data on your habits. Replied with a "rolleyes" smiley? Clearly you're an arrogant individual and we don't want that kind of person working for us.

Armadillo · 21 Nov 2016 at 15:17

Probably a dumb question, but isn't this going to be a huge amount of data?

If it's suppose to log the address/ip of the site you connected to and store for a year, isn't it going to be a huge amount even for just one user? Going to a single website seems to quite often make connection to 4-5 other places (ad servers etc) and then there's other things that are constantly making connections (like steam for example).

Won't it add to an absurd amount of storage when you want to do that for millions of users? Who is suppose to pay for it?

edscdk · 21 Nov 2016 at 15:22

more data for large companies to sell and have stolen, great

I predict mass hacks and more people getting caught out by fake amazon / bank / ISP / what ever calls because the caller knows everything about the mark thanks to all the data these big companies will have stolen

Rroff · 21 Nov 2016 at 15:22

Armadillo said:
Probably a dumb question, but isn't this going to be a huge amount of data?

If it's suppose to log the address/ip of the site you connected to and store for a year, isn't it going to be a huge amount even for just one user? Going to a single website seems to quite often make connection to 4-5 other places (ad servers etc) and then there's other things that are constantly making connections (like steam for example).

Won't it add to an absurd amount of storage when you want to do that for millions of users? Who is suppose to pay for it?

Just based on the average URL length and my 3 most used systems they'd need around 20MB (uncompressed) a month just for me just for my browsing history - as there is a fair bit of repeated data in that its probably compressible down to around 1-3MB - so I'd guess somewhere around 1000-1500TB for everyone in the UK for a year - though with the other data they are talking about capturing probably more like 3-4x that.

edscdk said:
more data for large companies to sell and have stolen, great

I predict mass hacks and more people getting caught out by fake amazon / bank / ISP / what ever calls because the caller knows everything about the mark thanks to all the data these big companies will have stolen

Pretty much guaranteed - and largely it is all for nothing as criminals and the like make use of this technology now because they can get away with it - when the rules change so they can't guess what the organised ones move onto other systems and those sloppy enough to be caught - well they are going to be sloppy in other regards and can be caught by good old fashioned detective work. So basically nothing is gained except to give those at the top more power over those not at the top and a much higher risk of data insecurity, etc. for everyone ironically playing into the hands of criminals.

Better just to give the intelligence agencies, etc. a bit more money/resources to work with if you really want to catch criminals and stop terrorists.

DragonQ · 21 Nov 2016 at 15:26

Armadillo said:
Probably a dumb question, but isn't this going to be a huge amount of data?

If it's suppose to log the address/ip of the site you connected to and store for a year, isn't it going to be a huge amount even for just one user? Going to a single website seems to quite often make connection to 4-5 other places (ad servers etc) and then there's other things that are constantly making connections (like steam for example).

Won't it add to an absurd amount of storage when you want to do that for millions of users? Who is suppose to pay for it?

Yes it will be a lot of data. ISPs will likely have to pay for it, which will put up prices.

Doogles · 21 Nov 2016 at 15:43

Armageus said:
I don't agree with it, but realistically what difference does it make to the average person.

Sure someone somewhere may now be able to view my porn habits or see that I spend an unhealthy amount of time on OcUK's forums, but what difference does it make?

Eventually if we get a tyrant in power then it will make all the difference, you'll probably end up in the street being shot by a Hitler lookalike who didn't like your porn preferences as he thought it was distasteful art

Twirlywoos · 21 Nov 2016 at 15:55

I'm not your average person and I value privacy. Won't be long until they force biometric implants in people just to track and monitor them. Accept stuff like this now and they will slowly condition you for more invasion.

gareth170 · 21 Nov 2016 at 17:06

does this mean they doing it at the start of 2017 or now? also are they getting ISP's to send the past months of 2016 to them? if so i can't see how tbh

Tefal · 21 Nov 2016 at 19:03

Armageus said:
I don't agree with it, but realistically what difference does it make to the average person.

Sure someone somewhere may now be able to view my porn habits or see that I spend an unhealthy amount of time on OcUK's forums, but what difference does it make?

well combined with the very restrictive "extreme porn bill" potentially ending up on sex offenders register depending on your tastes.

Dave2150 · 21 Nov 2016 at 19:09

The majority of the lambs will not care about this or understand it.

Sad times indeed.

For those who do understand what it means, time to setup a quality VPN (which will cost money) and go on like nothing happened

SKILL · 21 Nov 2016 at 20:29

The issue with a VPN surely is depending where it's hosted whether GCHQ or the NSA have their backdoor into it and can reveal all your info anyway surely

But yeah, this is ridiculous, guessing even though it's passed it'll take a while for the ISP's to even be able to start collecting the data so no rush...

shamus21 · 21 Nov 2016 at 20:38

Doogles said:
Eventually if we get a tyrant in power then it will make all the difference, you'll probably end up in the street being shot by a Hitler lookalike who didn't like your porn preferences as he thought it was distasteful art

"A Tyrant in power" we already have a control freak in power and she was not elected by the people but by the establishment.

Armadillo · 21 Nov 2016 at 20:55

So on the subject of VPNs, any recommendations?

I was looking at purevpn for the split tunneling feature, so I can use it for web browsing, while leaving steam traffic untouched (online games, so meh and you're not suppose to use a vpn with steam).

parityboy · 21 Nov 2016 at 21:13

@Armadillo

AirVPN and Private Internet Access are quite popular. I use Cryptostorm.

Minstadave · 21 Nov 2016 at 21:56

That split VPN feature sounds excellent.

Armageus · 21 Nov 2016 at 22:05

Surely at some point vpns will just be banned? I mean if you have nothing to hide, why would you need a VPN?

D3K · 21 Nov 2016 at 22:31

Armageus said:
Surely at some point vpns will just be banned? I mean if you have nothing to hide, why would you need a VPN?

We get it, you're a saint and care nought for the principle of privacy.

Leave your door unlocked tonight, I'd like to poke around your cupboards for a bit.

Cuchulain · 21 Nov 2016 at 22:42

Armageus said:
Surely at some point vpns will just be banned? I mean if you have nothing to hide, why would you need a VPN?

You couldn't possibly ban VPN's, you can set up one in a matter of minutes on your own server anywhere in the world.

As for the tedious "But if you've got nothing to hide.." line, would you be happy for me to sit outside your bedroom window with a camera 24/7? How about if I intercept your post and read all of your letters? How about I do the same to your mother or grandmother? Are you understanding the concept of personal privacy yet?

Armageus · 21 Nov 2016 at 23:16

Cuchulain said:
You couldn't possibly ban VPN's, you can set up one in a matter of minutes on your own server anywhere in the world.

No probably not, but I'm sure they can remove access to websites providing them, and remove the commercial side of it - stopping Bob from down the pub using one, because it lets him watch region locked streaming TV channels or download his "Linux isos".

Don't get me wrong I do understand the privacy implications, but a lot of it surely has been brought on by people who haven't a genuine need for privacy, and instead are using tech like VPNs for activities that are going to draw attention.

Armadillo · 22 Nov 2016 at 00:36

A lot of the providers are not based in the UK though.

Assuming we are talking torrents etc, it won't curb that. From what I understand, the logs will just be ip address/url, so while it might log you have gone to X torrent site, it won't log the page/content or even what you downloaded, if anything and going to a torrent site is not a crime (at least not yet).

Even if they somehow banned them, people up to even more unsavory activities, can just use tor.

Would be better to put the money into actually doing some proper work, rather than just throwing a net over everything and hope you get what you want.

Also on the nothing to hide, no need for vpn. Why did the mps opt out then? What are they hiding?

If there's no need to worry if you have nothing to hide, the amendment to let mps opt out shouldn't have been made. They should lead by example and be logged into the database as well.