Britain's Defences

How ironic, after years and years of people saying why do we continue with the Nimrod, why not buy the P3... As soon as the Nimrod is axed, TWO Russian subs are known to be off the coast of the UK, the American P3 can't track it nearly as well as the Nimrod, and now everyone is saying that the Nimrod was the best of it's kind in the world!!
 
wordy said:
Continue, how manytimes has it happened in the last few years?

Why the hostility towards the armed forces/intelligence services, were you rejected at the recruitment phase or didn't make it through basic/new entry training?
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Three times in ten years?

That is not acceptable.

I have no hostility towards the armed forces or anything else.

I have hostility towards stupidity.

I wouldn't want a life of the services either.

(I passed naval artificers test btw, so go run yourself off a short pier now ;) )

Why do so many people automatically jump to the defence of stupidity just because it is the armed forces?
 
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Over Clocker said:
How ironic, after years and years of people saying why do we continue with the Nimrod, why not buy the P3... As soon as the Nimrod is axed, TWO Russian subs are known to be off the coast of the UK, the American P3 can't track it nearly as well as the Nimrod, and now everyone is saying that the Nimrod was the best of it's kind in the world!!
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The nimrods were pretty much allways the best, and they used to be able to carry various armaments to give those subs a surprise!
 
Biohazard said:
I have hostility towards stupidity.
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Humans are stupid, as a whole, fact. They make stupid mistakes all the time, and there is no getting away from it, regardless of who you are and what you do.
Biohazard said:
Why do so many people automatically jump to the defence of stupidity just because it is the armed forces?
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For the excusability suggested above. I'd apply it to any kind of person in any kind of job (except people who work in KFC, they always annoy me for their sheer stupidity and missing my hot wings off my variety meal - EVERY TIME!! There is no excuse for this)
 
Well, you'd have to train someone new to Captain a ship at some point, otherwise you'll just have the same really old captain, forever? lol
 
Its a seriously new and expensive and potentially lethal bit of kit, why not stick a proven commander on it until you have shown its sea worthyness at trials? Problems could arrise that would warrant experience, not dampness behind the ears.

What happened the other day for example.

You have all the time in the world to train people out at sea once the things in proper service, not in confined spaces in the isles with equipment everybody is learning.
 
Ah, seems like you should co-ordinate the training strategy for all new equipment for the MOD! What is your current job title, because I tell you what, you're wasted there!
 
Captain Planet said:
Ah, seems like you should co-ordinate the training strategy for all new equipment for the MOD! What is your current job title, because I tell you what, you're wasted there!
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You think so?

I would have thought all what I said would be common sense?

Don't let the unexperienced play with expensive equipment? Or equipment going through sea trials or any other type?

Why all the smart ass jokes? Why are you taking this so personally? It isn't even directed at you.

I can't tell you my exact job title, sorry. I am a commisioned law enforcement officer with HMRC however.
 
Von Smallhausen said:
Astute subs are a different class than Vanguards aren't they ?

Any sub experts on here ? How would Astute compare to the US Navy Seawolf ?
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Castiel said:
vanguard are ballistic missile subs, the Astute is an attack sub.

The Astute is much better than either the electric Seawolf which was a disaster or the Virginia class electric subs the Americans currently have in service.

Basically the Astute class nuclear attack sub is the most advanced submarine in the world, that we will have seven of them eventually means we will have some serious firepower at sea.
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Yea sorry I wasn't saying Astute class is replacing Vanguard they are to be in service along side each other are they not?

I remember hearing/reading that we'll only have 1 Vanguard out at sea at any given time? Is this still true? and what of the astute class subs (when they're in the field)?

I'm going to guess to have all 8 out at sea would be mighty expensive? It would be so damn cool though if we did.
 
Ideally for every ship you buy you also buy 2 more, so you then have 1 ship deployed, 1 getting ready/reserve and 1 in refit/upgrade and these 3 ships rotate through each role as a matter of routine. In an emergency this cycle will break up with the deployed ship staying deployed longer, the reserve going into use and if possible finishing the refit ship early and getting it out to work too.

Modern navies struggle with this philosophy as their just aren't enough spare units to cover all the roles. The vanguard class keep a schedule like this though as we usually only have one of them on patrol at a time.
 
rypt said:
Modern Navies could easily afford this if the MOD stopped wasting so much money
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And also if we did not increase foreign aid by 37% we would all be better off?

We paid 32 million pounds in foreign aid to china? Last time I looked china was a superpower. 2003 to 2008 we have given India 1 billion in aid. India has got a space program? Also we are given more then 825 million to India by 2011.
 
The MoD has strange economics, you'd think with its massive buying power and assured payments it could negotiate fantastic prices on items it buys but from my point of view it works in the opposite direction.

I had a radio lesson last week, the instructor was telling us to be careful with one of the cables as they're £2000 pound each, much of the cost being put down to the high quality gold cable. I'm sure it'll come as no surprise to anyone that this is a digital cable, that could be made for a tiny fraction of this cost - but someone in procurement has been dazzled by marketing and bought the 2k one anyway.
 
AmTechFox said:
Yea sorry I wasn't saying Astute class is replacing Vanguard they are to be in service along side each other are they not?

I remember hearing/reading that we'll only have 1 Vanguard out at sea at any given time? Is this still true? and what of the astute class subs (when they're in the field)?

I'm going to guess to have all 8 out at sea would be mighty expensive? It would be so damn cool though if we did.
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The Vanguard SSBN is a nuclear deterrent. For a deterrent to work it needs to be available for launch 24/7, so we have 4 subs, one on operations, one for refit, one resupply/in transit, and one for training/spare.

I would expect that the Vanguard would have an attack sub ghosting it as SSBN's are vulnerable to attack from enemy attack subs.

As for the rest, I would expect some to be deployed at various strategic area's in the worlds oceans and others in refit/resupply etc.
 
I've not read through the whole tread (all 18 pages!) but has anyone read "Invasion"? basically, china takes over the world... brilliant book :)
 
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