British Grand Prix 2013, Silverstone - Race 8/19

PinkFloyd · 30 Jun 2013 at 19:46

Peg said:
A kerb that has been there for years.

It hasn't, it's the end of the loop. So a few years old at best. That would have been the outside of the corner when they turned that way at Maggots for the short circuit, however there never used to be a kerb there.

They probably should be a bit flatter there, sausage kerb could be fun though

Flibster · 30 Jun 2013 at 19:47

smr said:
Theyll have to change them for next weekend. Going to be a hectic week at Pirelli.!

Sadly, nothing will be able to be done for next weekend. Not enough time to make > 1800 new tyres and get them to the event.

JRS said:
Didn't see the race. Any good? Or shall I not bother with the highlights?

First 10 minutes and last 20 of the race should do.

Not sure how long the highlights are...

Flibster · 30 Jun 2013 at 19:49

Goksly said:
But if that's the case why doesn't this happen more often? Something has changed this race - might have been like one tyre failure every 3 or 4 races due to curbs. 4 in one race + others in FP / Q... something isn't right!

I think we're up to 8 failures now in one weekend...

Danthus · 30 Jun 2013 at 20:11

Korsun said:
Sorry if this has already been mentioned.... The kerbs are not like kerbs found on our roads. I worked for Honda F1 for 6 years and the damage they can do to a car is shocking, let alone the tyres. so I'm not surprised if they are the cause of the failures which has been suggested on the tv coveradge today....

And in those 6 years how many puncture like today did you see?

jonneymendoza · 30 Jun 2013 at 20:27

Hands down the best race this season.

amazing some stuff.

Soo many amazing skills from various drivers.

Hamilton was superb. to be on pole leading the race to your tyre exploding and finishing 4th is nothing short but amazing.

Most guys would have lost there motivation and their will. Imagine leading the whole weekend being fast in practise, starting in pole and leading the race to that happening? The average man would have broken down ****ed thinking the gods are against them but not hamilton. He never gave back. Amazing

Webber. What a fantastic drive he had. Similar to Hamilton, bad start, everything going against him and if teh race was 54 laps, he would have won. Well done and he will be missedin F1. such a great person and driver. Has more class then Vettel.

Alonso did well. superb driving from him well done and Roseberg did a fantastic job. kept his cool and made the luck count. It is difficult under pressure with a few laps to go with webber right up your rear. Well done.

Overall an amazing Race. Mercedez can compete with red bull. Well done. Hamilton made the right decision to join them!

Cant wait for the next race and i am tempted to buy tickets for next years Silverstone race.

JRS · 30 Jun 2013 at 20:34

Flibster said:
First 10 minutes and last 20 of the race should do.

One of those deals then. Okay, add another one to the 'list of F1 races that JRS couldn't be bothered to see' this year. Makes it 8 for 8 *shrug*

deuse · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:01

OldCoals said:
And in those 6 years how many puncture like today did you see?

Not many I would say. But you can't blame Pirelli remember it was Ferrari\lotus and force indi that blocked the tire change for this race.

Now there is only force indi that are saying the tires are ok so the fia will have to keep running with
these tires or bring the new ones under the safety rule.

drunkenmaster · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:03

deuse said:
Not many I would say. But you can't blame Pirelli remember it was Ferrari\lotus and force indi that blocked the tire change for this race.

Now there is only force indi that are saying the tires are ok so the fia will have to keep running with
these tires or bring the new ones under the safety rule.

Well the FIA could and should plainly have forced the change earlier for safety reasons and secondly, PIrelli still made a crap tyre to start with, so it is entirely their fault, if they made a better tyre that didn't fail they wouldn't need to replace it in the first place.

deuse · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:06

drunkenmaster said:
Well the FIA could and should plainly have forced the change earlier for safety reasons and secondly, PIrelli still made a crap tyre to start with, so it is entirely their fault, if they made a better tyre that didn't fail they wouldn't need to replace it in the first place.

I hate Pirelli but it's the fia that wanted the tires made like they are.
The fia could have just asked Pirelli to make them last half a race but they did not.
The blame lies with the 3 teams and the fia for todays result.

Goksly · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:06

deuse said:
Not many I would say. But you can't blame Pirelli remember it was Ferrari\lotus and force indi that blocked the tire change for this race.

Now there is only force indi that are saying the tires are ok so the fia will have to keep running with
these tires or bring the new ones under the safety rule.

1) Drivers shouldn't cut the corner so much
2) You don't change a major component, such as the tyre, half way through the season - unless they confirm tyre wear will remain identical, and the only change is for safety.

Danthus · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:10

Teds Notebook.

http://www1.skysports.com/formula1/presenters/ted-kravitz/video

Kenai · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:13

deuse said:
I hate Pirelli but it's the fia that wanted the tires made like they are.

Making a tyre last 15 laps instead of 50 does not make them 'spontaneously' explode multiple times in a race.

Pirelli have been making these high degradation tyres for years now, this is not a result of what the FIA asked them to produce, this is a separate issue.

If this was down to what the FIA asked for, it would have been happening every race for years.

smr · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:18

Indeed something has simply gone awry in the construction process of the tyre. At least now Pirelli can't hide behind excuses like debris, which we all knew were fodder anyway. They're almost trying to turn it into a comedy by blaming the kerbs, what will they say next? The winds causing it? The tyres haven't been built properly and that needs changing swiftly to ensure the safety of the sport.

CaptainRAVE · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:20

deuse said:
Not many I would say. But you can't blame Pirelli remember it was Ferrari\lotus and force indi that blocked the tire change for this race.

Now there is only force indi that are saying the tires are ok so the fia will have to keep running with
these tires or bring the new ones under the safety rule.

Assuming these new tyres that were blocked fix the problem.

Twirlywoos · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:22

Tyres in the Limelight again and determining the outcome of a race, how bloody boring. This isn't the F1 I used to love watching. Bring back 2 choices of manufacturers, why was that scrapped anyway? Was it due to costs and Bernie inhibiting competition and innovation?

mmj_uk · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:32

Pirelli should pull out of F1 for their own good, the FIA are just using them to make the races more entertaining but from a brand perspective what Pirelli are doing is suicide, their tyres may well be top class but who here would willingly choose Pirelli over say Bridgestone after seeing the race today?

When I think of Michelin I think of Indianapolis '05 (yes it was a one-off but that doesn't matter), when I think of Bridgestone I think of Michael Schumacher and Ferrari outlasting everybody on superior tyres, when I think of Pirelli I think of extremely high wearing/exploding tyres that you have to nurse constantly.

It doesn't matter that these tyres are especially made for F1, those images of them being poor quality tyres and getting lots of criticism will stick.

Reaper 392 · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:38

Goksly said:
1) Drivers shouldn't cut the corner so much

why not? the rules say that as long as one wheel is between the white lines then the line they are taking is legal (ignoring the presence of other cars of course). The line that they were taking was perfectly valid and the drivers should not be punished for taking such a line

Kenai · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:42

mmj_uk said:
who here would willingly choose Pirelli over say Bridgestone after seeing the race today?

I'd still just buy whatever seems to be testing best for my budget, last time that was a Continental.

I'd have no problems buying a PZero over a Potenza though.

drunkenmaster · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:46

deuse said:
I hate Pirelli but it's the fia that wanted the tires made like they are.
The fia could have just asked Pirelli to make them last half a race but they did not.
The blame lies with the 3 teams and the fia for todays result.

Kenai said:
Making a tyre last 15 laps instead of 50 does not make them 'spontaneously' explode multiple times in a race.

Pirelli have been making these high degradation tyres for years now, this is not a result of what the FIA asked them to produce, this is a separate issue.

If this was down to what the FIA asked for, it would have been happening every race for years.

As Kenai said, the FIA wanted tyres with high deg, that the tyres basically explode in certain situations isn't something the FIA asked for.

A tyre with high wear that gets crap performance after 10 laps, could also last for 100 laps(just slowly) and never, ever explode or cause damage to the car, or leave debrie on the track. These are completely different situations, they've had tyres for 2 years that the softest options are crap after 10 laps and yet don't react.

We've heard about "the cliff" that the tyres when they run out drop 5 seconds a lap(like Hamilton at Canada on Vettel/Alonso last year), did either of them have their tyres explode LONG after the usuable life/speed in the tyre was gone, nope, they just ran out of performance with no safety issue, no exploding and no trouble.

El_Watcher · 30 Jun 2013 at 21:53

Kenai said:
Pirelli have been making these high degradation tyres for years now, this is not a result of what the FIA asked them to produce, this is a separate issue.

You have to remember this years car has several important differences to those of previous years that affect the loads on the tyres, EBD for one.

The problem is, they made a tyre on request of the FIA. During the design, they tested it with a 2010 Lotus, which is significantly different in style to the 2013 car. Therefore the tyre design is inherently flawed.
If they had been allowed to design and test these tyres with a 2012 or 2013 car, I am sure they would have noticed the issues.
And why have they not been able to test them with a 2012/13 car, oh yeah, the FIA testing rules.
Then when they propose a tyre which should be better, several teams rejected the change.

So in conclusion, the FIA asked for **** tyres, the FIA gave Pirelli a flawed system to develop **** tyres (which were then found to be even ****er), were persecuted by the FIA for trying to test tyres with a less flawed system (testgate), and then were blocked by the FIA (and teams), when they found a workaround.

If people think this is all Pirelli's fault, they are as deluded as the Hamilton/Vettel fanbois.