Budget AVR advice needed

Haggisman

Haggisman

Haggisman

Soldato
Joined
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Location
Birmingham
Looks like my receiver is on its way out, as it's started making random static hisses, crackles and pops. I've tried various things like unplugging all sources, individually disconnecting speakers, unplugging everything else from the socket, but doesn't seem to make any difference.

It's a cheap and cheerful Denon x540bt, and is pretty much exactly 5 years old, so I guess it's not too surprising that it's dying.

I don't need anything fancy to be honest.

* 4 inputs (Sky, Nvidia Shield, Switch, Media PC)
* 4k/HDR (60hz is fine as my TV doesn't support higher)
* We only use the front stereo & centre speakers - room layout doesn't really allow for rear surrounds, but it's handy having the centre speaker so we can turn it up for dialogue when we're watching stuff at night and don't want to wake the kids, so I guess a stereo receiver would be fine if it was able to decode 5.1 and boost the centre channel before sending to the L&R channels (if that's even a thing?)
* No sub needed
* Max 375mm deep, 550mm width, 200mm height.

Current speakers are Mordaunt Short Ms Avant 902 for the L&R, some little Onkyo thing which came with a kit for the centre (yes I know I should get a decent centre speaker to match the sides :p)

The Onkyo TXSR393 Richer Sounds have for £400 is looking like the most suitable new option so far (although quite a bit more than I was hoping to spend), but wondering if there is a more sensible suggestion, either new or used?

Tried the whole soundbar thing and was very disappointed - couldn't get sound and video to sync up at all, and the audio quality didn't really offer any improvement over the TV built in speakers (if anything it made it worse, dialogue was extremely difficult to hear at lower volumes!)
 
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Onkyo have basic room correction. Would be better to get full size avr if you can.

Why the need for low profile you're not cramming it into a cramped cupboard?

I'd look into Yamaha avr
 
It'll need space for ventilation.

Oh since you have standmount speakers you need a sub as your speakers are incapable of low bass. Setting your speakers to full range and for the to play full range is bad idea. Plus you're going to lose the dedicated LFE channel. It'll put more strain on your avr, and your speakers, and amp will run hotter
 
The front of the cabinet is open and there is space round the sides & top.

In terms of bass, we've never had an issue, in fact we'd rather avoid too much due to aforementioned kids being asleep and neighbours. We did have a sub connected before but ended up never using it
 
S/H with a decent spec isn't going to be much cheaper than the Onkyo. Sound bars took a big fat wet bite out of the budget AVR market. That, COVID, the silicon shortage (which I suspect is a largely overhyped problem) and Brexit for the UK market all contributed to crappy trading conditions for the AV industry. Pioneer and Onkyo merged, then died. Concerns over temperature are valid though. This was one of the nails in Onkyo's coffin.

Go back to the mid/late '00s and Onkyo's star was on the rise. HDMI was the new kid on the block, and Onkyo was the first brand to have these as proper video/audio inputs (not just a signal switch as in some other amps), and, more importantly, at under £600 retail.

The rest of the amp spec was good too, so it wasn't just a one trick pony. Subsequent models kept up the pressure on the competition too. Onkyos delivered more of everything, including power, for prices the other brands couldn’t quite match. For several years the Onkyo amps earned Best Buy awards. Guys who liked to buy based on Top Trumps loved Onkyo. Everything was great.... until it wasn't.

What started out as a few isolated incidents became an epidemic. The amps ran uncomfortably hot. The brand had pushed the envelope in terms of power output, and the excess heat started to play havoc with circuits. Digital audio inputs failed. But worse than that was the HDMI boards keeling over. In some cases the solder just melted!

To their credit, Onkyo were very good with out-of-warranty support, but the damage to the brand's reputation was done. By the mid '10s dealers were dropping Onkyo and it never really recovered despite a few relaunch attempts.

Denon seemed to pick up the batten as the 'most' brand. Most features... Most power... Most heat. This also applies to sister brand Marantz with its main range of AV receivers; the SR-series. It doesn't apply to the NR-series range. Search the Internet and you'll find lots of discussion about which USB-powered cooling fans work best.

Regarding LFE, it's no big deal to lose it if there are other priorities. LFE stands for Low Frequency Effects. By design, there's nothing in the LFE channel of a film's audio that is essential to the sound track. The main audio is carried by the 5 or 7 ground channels. They go down to 20Hz, which is already verging on the "I can't hear it, only feel it" part of human sound perception. Any sound carried in the LFE channel is to increase the impact of stuff already happening in the main channels. The T-Rex stomps about; you hear that through the main channels. LFE adds more depth and weight, but it's as-well-as rather than instead-of.
 
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Thanks, very interesting - before the current Denon I had an Onkyo bought in.... 2009 iirc (can't remember the exact model but came with a speaker package). That lasted me 8-9 years until I finally upgraded to 4k, and was still going strong when I sold it on, so I guess that was one of the "good" models :/

I was leaning towards another Onkyo because of this, but based on what you've posted they're likely to be of a muchness (and possibly the reason the Denon is dying?)

Is it worth taking the back off the cabinet as well to get some extra airflow through?
 
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Haggisman said:
It's a cheap and cheerful Denon x540bt, and is pretty much exactly 5 years old, so I guess it's not too surprising that it's dying.
Click to expand...

Ahem, 5 years is nothing, if it were 20 years old I might agree but I do find it quite surprising that an AVR would only last 5 years. I have a Denon AVR-1910 that I bought used nearly 10 years ago, spilled drinks on it during various parties and it still works just fine.

Is it no longer under warranty? Might be cheap to have it repaired anyway.

If not buy something similar on the used market, you'll save a ton of money vs buying new.
 
Ormy1 said:
Ahem, 5 years is nothing, if it were 20 years old I might agree but I do find it quite surprising that an AVR would only last 5 years. I have a Denon AVR-1910 that I bought used nearly 10 years ago, spilled drinks on it during various parties and it still works just fine.

Is it no longer under warranty? Might be cheap to have it repaired anyway.

If not buy something similar on the used market, you'll save a ton of money vs buying new.
Click to expand...

Thanks, yeah I was a bit surprised considering it's not that old, but then it was pretty cheap, so probably not the best quality components. Sadly not under warranty. I did find a post on reddit with a video of another Denon receiver making a similar noise, and apparently was fixed by unplugging one of the internal connectors, so I might give that a go later - nothing to lose by it (as long as I don't manage to electrocute myself on a capacitor :p).

Anyone got experience buying from Hyperfi.co.uk? They seem to have a few more options than RS for lower budget. Edit: seems these are B-Stock, so only 12 month warranty.
 
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Haggisman said:
Thanks, yeah I was a bit surprised considering it's not that old, but then it was pretty cheap, so probably not the best quality components. Sadly not under warranty. I did find a post on reddit with a video of another Denon receiver making a similar noise, and apparently was fixed by unplugging one of the internal connectors, so I might give that a go later - nothing to lose by it (as long as I don't manage to electrocute myself on a capacitor :p).

Anyone got experience buying from Hyperfi.co.uk? They seem to have a few more options than RS for lower budget. Edit: seems these are B-Stock, so only 12 month warranty.
Click to expand...

Do not buy from hyperfi . When I enquired they said it could be any condition (which means smashed and non working) and they is no warranty or DSR.

Hahahaha
 
Haggisman said:
Is it worth taking the back off the cabinet as well to get some extra airflow through?
Click to expand...
Yes. Absolutely. That goes for any AVR.

Onkyo learned its lesson about over-stressing the amps, but too late to save the company at the time. After a long and drawn-out dying swan act where new amps were vapourware for what seemed like an eternity, the brand was finally rescued from oblivion by a joint venture between VOXX and Sharp. The deal closed at the latter end of 2021. VOXX is one of the brands owned by The Premium Audio Company. Read more here.

Just how much the market has shifted was brought home when I looked at the back panel of the Onkyo. Ten years ago, folk were getting sniffy at this kind of spartan layout on £199/£249 entry-level AVRs. Four years ago £499 got you the Sony STR-DN1080 which for a time was THE receiver to own.

Now Sony's '£499' slot is occupied by the spartan STR-DH790. There are no Pioneer receivers. There's precious little available from anyone much under £400, and a lot of the new entry-level gear it's a toss-up between standard 5.1 or 3.1 + 2xATMOS speakers. You can tell how bad it got when second-hand STR-DN1080s were selling for as much or more than their new price just two years earlier. These are the mad and sad days of the AV receiver market.

You'll probably be fine with the Onkyo. It was originally launched in 2019, by which time the message had got home loud and clear about the temperature issues. That doesn't mean you can entomb the amp in an enclosed cabinet and expect it to be happy, but with the back panel off and the front doors (if it has them) open then it will improve things.

The Marantz NR-series receivers use a different sort of amplifier tech (Class-D) which is why they're able to get away with a shorter height. It's more power efficient and runs cooler. Pioneer did something similar in some of their standard height AV amps. Yamaha is now using this tech in their RXV-series amps, so the RXV4A (£439) might be worth a look. It's just 11mm taller than the Onkyo, and they sound pretty decent for music too.
 
Well... I popped the case off, disconnected all of the ribbon cables on the main PCB, and left it for half an hour to allow everything to fully discharge, put it all back together, and *touch wood*, it seems to be fine - got a good few hours gaming in last night with no unwanted sound effects. Not going to celebrate quite yet, as the noise has been somewhat intermittent and might have just been coincidence, but I'll hold off on a replacement for now. Some good suggestions to consider if the noise comes back :)
 
Haggisman said:
Well... I popped the case off, disconnected all of the ribbon cables on the main PCB, and left it for half an hour to allow everything to fully discharge, put it all back together, and *touch wood*, it seems to be fine - got a good few hours gaming in last night with no unwanted sound effects. Not going to celebrate quite yet, as the noise has been somewhat intermittent and might have just been coincidence, but I'll hold off on a replacement for now. Some good suggestions to consider if the noise comes back :)
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If that is the case, i'll make the following suggestion. Get some Isopropyl Alcohol spray, spray the male ends of the ribbons, connect and disconnect the male and female ends a few times. Let them dry/evaporate, then repeat.
I'm guessing oxidised connections here, that often happens with old gear.
 
kitfit1 said:
If that is the case, i'll make the following suggestion. Get some Isopropyl Alcohol spray, spray the male ends of the ribbons, connect and disconnect the male and female ends a few times. Let them dry/evaporate, then repeat.
I'm guessing oxidised connections here, that often happens with old gear.
Click to expand...

Can I just clean them with a cotton bud & isopropyl? Got half a litre of the stuff but no spray bottle :p
 
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