Bye Bye AMD

d34d_m34t · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:18

SOLDNER-MOFO64 said:
Here's a compare I pulled from the '06 thread. Notice how this users C2D is at 3800mhz (my 3600 is at 2805mhz)....and his 8800GTS is maxed out...mine is a little off, yet he still barely beats my SM2.0 &3.0 scores even though his CPU scores 50% more???????

Because the SM2 and SM3 tests are mainly gpu bound, so with practically the same gpu you get practically the same scores - but with the red valley cpu bound tests the c2d pulls away because it is more powerful. Unless this is a trick question of some sort...

Journey · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:20

Stop bickering children, or no one will be getting supper tonight.

SOLDNER-MOFO64 · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:21

d34d_m34t said:
Because the SM2 and SM3 tests are gpu bound, so with practically the same gpu you get practically the same scores - but with the red valley cpu bound tests the c2d pulls away because it is more powerful. Unless this is a trick question of some sort...

The same BOTTLENECKED GPU on an AMD scores the same as a C2D powered equivelent GPU?

At the same clocks the C2D and AMD rigs churn out approx the same scores for SM2.0 and SM3.0....depending on drivers used and settings applied etc etc.

The fact that they're anywhere NEAR each other is a win for AMD IMO, or a loss for INTEL whichever.

d34d_m34t · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:27

SOLDNER-MOFO64 said:
The same BOTTLENECKED GPU on an AMD scores the same as a C2D powered equivelent GPU?

No, i don't think your AMD X2 @ 2805 would bottleneck a 320 mb GTS at all - it is powerful enough to make it operate near it's absolute limit - which is why adding an even more powerful cpu such as a c2d @ 3800 can't increase the gpu's performance by a huge margin - the card is already near it's limit anyway. I think that is probably what's happening.

SOLDNER-MOFO64 · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:29

d34d_m34t said:
No, i don't think your AMD X2 @ 2805 would bottleneck a 320 mb GTS at all - it is powerful enough to make it operate near it's absolute limit - which is why adding an even more powerful cpu such as a c2d @ 3800 can't increase the gpu's performance by a huge margin - the card is already near it's limit anyway. I think that is probably what's happening.

640MB here, but I understand the point you're making. I'd like to see a quad-core with GTS scoe the same though.

just Scott · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:29

SOLDNER-MOFO64 said:
mpare.

Put your 1yr old CUTTING EDGE POWERPLANT up againts my 3yr old ageing A64 at the same clocks and we'll see what's what yeah? Got the bottle?

OK.

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/2007/03/26/the_gigahertz_battle_uk/page13.html

helmutcheese · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:30

3 good brands of NF2 mobos+ Mobile CPU = highly OC'able

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Socket 754 once it matured = highly OC'able esp HT(FSB)

Socket 939/940/AM2 = highly OC'able esp HT(FSB) , its only the later AM2 socket with high end end of line 90nm CPU's like X2 6000's that cant OC as much as lesser CPU's as no headroom, this is all 3 year old tech (all above sockets are basically the same tech just memory controler mods etc) AMD had Intel in the dust with until Intel did a great job 1 year ago with 2CD.

stickroad · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:30

SOLDNER-MOFO64 i have said all along AMD and Intel at stock speeds are pretty much equal.

Now on best bang for your buck if you had this CPU:

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=CP-192-AM&groupid=701&catid=6&subcat=803

Or this one:

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=CP-146-IN&groupid=701&catid=6&subcat=793

If you were going to be overclcoking most people would go for the E6420, not becuase its Intel, because they are highly overclockable.

Lets keep this thread civilized from now on, its got kinda out of hand by both SOLDNER-MOFO64 and i.

d34d_m34t · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:31

SOLDNER-MOFO64 said:
640MB here, but I understand the point you're making. I'd like to see a quad-core with GTS scoe the same though.

well, i think the logic still applies to the 640 mb version. the 640 and 320 still have the same number of stream processors, and the same speed core, shader and memory clocks if i am not mistaken.

of course i may be mistaken - if anyone with a greater knowledge of how gpu's work disagrees with me then i will gladly defer to their wisdom.

SOLDNER-MOFO64 · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:43

stickroad said:
If you were going to be overclcoking most people would go for the E6420, not becuase its Intel, because they are highly overclockable.

Lets keep this thread civilized from now on, its got kinda out of hand by both SOLDNER-MOFO64 and i.

But this HIGHLY OVERCLOCKABLE drivvle means nothing.

If I had 2 CPU's.....1 which ran 2GHZ stock (3ghz OC'd) and one which runs at 9ghz stock (15ghz OC'd) but the 2GHz CPU when OC'd to 3ghz outperformed the 15ghz OC'd rival by 30% for less money...which would you rather have? The UBER COOL 15Ghz BRAGGING RIGHTS cpu.....or the faster one? Clocks mean nothing......but since you can get a 4 in the clockspeed of a C2D then people start to pee themselves.

All I'm saying is there's not a whle world of dif between the two.....50%,60%,70% oc's considering the age dif in tech is really nothing to shout about. I've conceded a long time ago that a C2D IS faster in 90% of benches...and who wouldn't. At the end of the day though.....if clockspeed numbers are all that matter to you then yeah a 4ghz C2D looks very cool. I'd still rather have a 4Ghz A64 though

just Scott · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:46

SOLDNER-MOFO64 said:
But this HIGHLY OVERCLOCKABLE drivvle means nothing.

If I had 2 CPU's.....1 which ran 2GHZ stock (3ghz OC'd) and one which runs at 9ghz stock (15ghz OC'd) but the 2GHz CPU when OC'd to 3ghz outperformed the 15ghz OC'd rival by 30% for less money...which would you rather have? The UBER COOL 15Ghz BRAGGING RIGHTS cpu.....or the faster one? Clocks mean nothing......but since you can get a 4 in the clockspeed of a C2D then people start to pee themselves.

All I'm saying is there's not a whle world of dif between the two.....50%,60%,70% oc's considering the age dif in tech is really nothing to shout about. I've conceded a long time ago that a C2D IS faster in 90% of benches...and who wouldn't. At the end of the day though.....if clockspeed numbers are all that matter to you then yeah a 4ghz C2D looks very cool. I'd still rather have a 4Ghz A64 though

Age shouldn't matter when choosing a CPU.

It's simple really. C2D out performs AMD when overclocked. Not just in benchmarks, but in everything CPU dependant.

Also - look at the link I posted. Any 2.4GHz Core 2 Duo outperforms any AMD x2 2.4GHz.

SOLDNER-MOFO64 · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:50

H2F Scott said:
Age shouldn't matter when choosing a CPU.

It's simple really. C2D out performs AMD when overclocked. Not just in benchmarks, but in everything CPU dependant.

Also - look at the link I posted. Any 2.4GHz Core 2 Duo outperforms any AMD x2 2.4GHz.

Exactly the correct response.

Nothing matters except which one scores higher. Overclockability has nothing to do with it. Are you saying if the AMD overclocked to 5ghz but still lost to C2D you'd buy the AMD "'cos it overclocks more"? lol ofcourse not. Like I say, OC'ability means squat.....scores mean everything.

stickroad · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:53

SOLDNER-MOFO64 said:
Exactly the correct response.

Nothing matters except which one scores higher. Overclockability has nothing to do with it. Are you saying if the AMD overclocked to 5ghz but still lost to C2D you'd buy the AMD "'cos it overclocks more"? lol ofcourse not. Like I say, OC'ability means squat.....scores mean everything.

I think theirs a bit of confusion in this thread.

What i am saying SOLDNER is if you can buy CPU A and then overclock it to the same speeds of CPU B but the CPU B costs more you wouldn't go for CPU A?

If you wont be doing any overclocking then you/I would go for CPU B.

Journey · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:56

You should just forget everything said and get an Intel E2140 and OC to 3GHz+ AMD Price + Intel Performance.

SOLDNER-MOFO64 · 24 Jun 2007 at 14:58

stickroad said:
I think theirs a bit of confusion in this thread. What i am saying SOLDNER is if you can buy CPU A and then overclock it to the same speeds of CPU B but the CPU B costs more you wouldn't go for CPU A, if your into overclocking that is?

If you wont be doing any overclocking then you/I would go for CPU B.

Hey.....we agree on something..lol

That's why I bought the 3600.....runs to 3Ghz with very little help from me and scores the same as a 6000 at it's 3ghz stock speed (once you tweak memory that is), but cost me only a third roughly. I also like to OC

SOLDNER-MOFO64 · 24 Jun 2007 at 15:00

Journey said:
You should just forget everything said and get an Intel E2140 and OC to 3GHz+ AMD Price + Intel Performance.

Now that's actually not a bad idea.....but I'm not up on the C2D's and would need a mobo to run it to a good OC. Then there's Barcelona whenever it decides to show face. Ooooooh decisions decisions

Mattus · 24 Jun 2007 at 19:58

Soldner, you're making no sense.

Say I have a C2D which runs at 1.86Ghz stock.
Say I have an A64 X2 which runs at 1.8Ghz stock.

The C2D is faster.

Say I overclock the C2D to its highest stable OC. It is now running at 3.4Ghz.
Say I overclock the A64 to its highest stable OC. It is now running at 3.0Ghz.

The C2D is faster by a larger margin.

Why would you rather have a 4Ghz A64 than a 4Ghz C2D? The A64 would be slower.

We're talking about RELATIVE overclocking, ie. PERCENT. If I wanted to run at 7Ghz and look cool, I'd just get a Celeron D.

SexyGreyFox · 24 Jun 2007 at 20:15

My brains hurting

Gashman · 24 Jun 2007 at 20:22

for the love of god what the hell are you lot bickering about, AMD and intel are dead even in price/performance, E6300 at stock speeds is good along side a 4200+ at stock speeds, there both similar priced, the AMD has clock advantage because there not as fast clock/clock, but there only faster by about 10-15% in normal applications, super-pi seems to bum C2D processors for some reason, but it TOTALLY doesn't translate into real-world performance, plus AM2 65nm processors can do 3.4Ghz or so with a good motherboard, so there not terrible clockers by any means, lets just be quiet, act like adults and accept AMD are behind for now, but theres tons of hope for them, i mean if i were AMD i'd be very happy, one generation behind and main competitors product is what 10-15% faster, AMD can easily get 10-15% more performance with there new processors, so this round will proberbly be interesting, the performance crown will likely jump between the two few times in the next year or so, lets just leave it at that SOLDNER-MOFO64 and stickroad before one of you gets yourself a suspension, and AMD can't hope to match intels production capabilities without some serious capital investment in more foundries, they need to make serious amount more processors than they are now to start eating into intels market again

Amonlym · 24 Jun 2007 at 21:39

Id just like to point something out:

"% overclock" is meaningless.
get an X2 6000 to 3.1 ghz, and its a seriously low %, get an X2 3600 to 3100 the % is much higher, but chances are you have the exact same actual silicon in there (well, 50% cache disabled, but thats not my point) getting the X2 chip itself to 3.1+ its what counts.

what counts *really* is the end speed.
the C2D core is the C2D core. if you get a C2d that gets 4 ghz on air, thats a very well made C2D. but its still a C2D, same as the C2D that only makes 2.7ghz.

with the above: the 2.7ghz C2D might have started at 333mhz, a truely awesom % overclock then, but truely dreadfull for C2D chips.

% oc = E-peen (and money saving)
Max oc = Real World Use

now, amd have messed up sockets a bit this time round, with the old 700 socket, 939 am2, and am3. but they stuck with socketA for about, a gajillion years.

intel are guilty of this also, old P4's had 1 socket, then new p4's another, and now theres yet another

you buy what you want to get, you spend how much you want to spend, you get the best you can. your a fan boy, your not.

me - i avoid NF boards and cards, i just dont like n-vidias for some reason, i admit that. so i have ati cards on VIA mobos. i enjoy the feeling of getting "rubish oc boards" to oc nicely

To the OP - good luck with new machine, sounds liek a good one. i hope it serves you well,a nd i hope the server does also!