Can You Solve 'The Hardest Logic Puzzle In The World'?

I can work out which one is telling the truth but I can't get from there to reliably figuring out which one is lying and which one is random. (Or vice versa I can get which one is lying but not able to work out which the other 2 are for certain).
 
I think you need to ask one of the gods all three questions, and eliminate one of them....ie, by asking all three questions you can work out who two are, leaving the third as the other one

where it gets tricky, is that the god you could be talking to is random lol
 
Problem is, you don't know if Ja or Da is yes or no...

It's bugging me.

If you were to question a God about another, A, Does God B always tell the truth?
Something along those lines.
 
Ignore the Ja/Da until you have a solution for them speaking in English. Theres enough possibilities even then... I've made a little progress, I think I'll continue on the train.

I think the idea is to find which one is random for sure using two questions, then ask one of the other two "is the sky blue"
 
Judgeneo said:
Ignore the Ja/Da until you have a solution for them speaking in English. Theres enough possibilities even then... I've made a little progress, I think I'll continue on the train.

I think the idea is to find which one is random for sure using two questions, then ask one of the other two "is the sky blue"
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that was my line of thinking to start with, but random could answer three jas
 
I'm thinking you need to somehow establish who's giving random answers and then query one of the other two.

Could really do with pen and paper.
 
Dragons are very logical. None of them would turn into sparrows.

On the first day they would have worked out all the possible logical answers.

The logical thing to do would be to break the 'worse case scenario chain reaction' before the first day is out.

One young dragon (a Grammar Dragon, none the less) suggests that the one way to be sure that none of them will turn into sparrows is by gouging one eye out each.

This way, even if they all had green eyes, they only have one eye now each a piece! so none of them have green eyes.

Luckily there were Older, wiser Dragons at hand...
to be continued
 
Ahh very good! I obviously didn't solve the dragon one without looking at the answer but I enjoyed it nonetheless!

I enjoyed people trying to convince themselves the answer is BS more though.
 
Judgeneo said:
Thats three questions :p
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See edit :p

But I think I'm on right lines. You need to phrase the questions similar to how I did above to help eliminate ja/da translation.

Also need to eliminate random.

So something like: to A; if I asked you if B is random, would you say ja?

Then based on answer, I think you can work out one who cannot be random.

Ask that god a question like: if I asked you if you're true, would you say ja?

Then you should be able to work out if that god is true or false. Then simply ask them if one of others is random.

On phone so can't really explain better. But been through it in my head and think it works
 
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div0 interesting line of questioning, I was trying to work it out by asking God A is God B or God C "Truth", God B is God A or God C "False". Not those exact questions but the idea of asking one of the God's about the other two.

Edit: Also going back to the dragons, I thought I had this worked out but thinking about it some more. I understand why they would all change but why would it not be day 2? The catalyst for change is the dragons not changing as you expect. As Dragon 1 you would expect 2-100 to change midnight day 1, Dragon 2 expects 1 and 3-100, Dragon 3 expects 1,2 and 4-100, Dragon 4 expects 1-3 and 5-100.... Therefore the conclusion that none of them changed day 1 is that each dragon is seeing 99 pairs of green eyes, therefore I (whichever number you are) must also have green eyes and therefore all change day 2.
 
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ikillbears said:
Incase people can't access it, here it is
You visit a remote desert island inhabited by one hundred very friendly dragons, all of whom have green eyes. They haven't seen a human for many centuries and are very excited about your visit. They show you around their island and tell you all about their dragon way of life (dragons can talk, of course).

They seem to be quite normal, as far as dragons go, but then you find out something rather odd. They have a rule on the island which states that if a dragon ever finds out that he/she has green eyes, then at precisely midnight on the day of this discovery, he/she must relinquish all dragon powers and transform into a long-tailed sparrow. However, there are no mirrors on the island, and they never talk about eye color, so the dragons have been living in blissful ignorance throughout the ages.

Upon your departure, all the dragons get together to see you off, and in a tearful farewell you thank them for being such hospitable dragons. Then you decide to tell them something that they all already know (for each can see the colors of the eyes of the other dragons). You tell them all that at least one of them has green eyes. Then you leave, not thinking of the consequences (if any). Assuming that the dragons are (of course) infallibly logical, what happens?
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" This is not a trick question. There's no guessing or lying or discussion by or between dragons. The answer does not involve Mendelian genetics, or sign language. The answer is logical, and the dragons are perfectly logical beings. And no, the answer is not "no dragon transforms." "
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(From my husband - he's a mathematician).

Use induction (problem is stated for N=100).

N=2 case: each dragon would turn into a sparrow on the second night.
Proof: each dragon, on the first night, knows that the other dragon has green eyes. Since they are only told that at least one of them have green eyes, they cannot be certain of their own eye colours this point. On the second day, they conclude that they each must have green eyes, since neither of them can have seen a dragon with non-green eyes on the first night.

General N>2 case: each dragon would turn into a sparrow on the Nth night.
Proof: we just need to establish the inductive step. Assume N=k result is true. If there are now N=k+1 dragons, fix a particular dragon and call him Dave. Dave knows if his eyes aren't green, then the other k dragons will all figure out what colour their eyes are in k nights (by inductive hypothesis). When the other dragons don't turn into sparrows on the kth night, Dave realises it's because his eyes are also green. So Dave will turn into a sparrow on the (k+1)the night. All the other dragons reason the same as Dave, so all dragons will turn into sparrows on the (k+1)th night.

In summary, all 100 dragons will turn into sparrows on the 100th night.
 
Dragon one is just a rehash of an old problem... tis an example of 'common knowledge'

Greboth said:
[..]Therefore the conclusion that none of them changed day 1 is that each dragon is seeing 99 pairs of green eyes, therefore I (whichever number you are) must also have green eyes and therefore all change day 2.
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nope

What would the conclusion be if only 99 had green eyes and one had blue eyes? They'd still not all change on day one.... ergo you can't just conclude that none of them changing on day 1 means all have green eyes.
 
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