Canon EOS 7d Body - New - £699

For me the beauty of the 7D is the handling, speed, build and features.

If I was a sport and wildlife photographer I would want my camera to work and work fast! the ISO, MP and Video is just an added bonus tbh.
 
Also it might be worth considering that no photographer will ever say any camera is bad, if they are presenting a talk or whatever. All that would do is alienate followers who do use that equipment, and alienate manufacturers from supporting that photographer e.g. Lara Jade would never say a bad thing about any Canon camera, just that the latest one is the best.
 
Ksanti said:
It is when you're selling images to interior design agencies, fashion clients and fine art galleries. Perhaps not so much in wedding photography but then we're not shooting the same stuff. The interior design agencies point is particularly relevant to wildlife photographers if they want to make any sort of liveable income off of their photography, again a point where the 7D's sensor design could present a serious limitation compared to even an old 1D system.
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Then perhaps if it is your livelihood then you should invest in a 1D4 with a 400mm/2.8.

The 7D is not the top of the line of the cropped body.

An Exception said:
My point being, if your not posting in gear threads to discuss gear, then your simply here to argue for the sake of arguing. Perhaps you can find some of my grammar mistakes to correct again, that must be fun.

This is a forum. People discuss their opinions. Such discussion in an online course would likely be seen as inappropriate and is another tangent.
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I already stated my opinion on the 7D two days ago so not going to repeat myself there. You already agree it is a good camera for the money, so all these talk about the sensor, pointless? Why are we talking about something 4 years old anyway? If it was good value when it came out and sold for twice as much, it is now half the price. What is all this negativity about?

and why I am doing it? I am trying to point it out to you, again, that everyone here is repeating the same mess over and over and over and over again for the past year.

You post a chart or a video or a link to something or another on a camera that you've not used.

Someone else will post their view on a camera they have used.

Rinse and repeat.

I mean, do you not get tired of it? Because I do, and I am trying to make you stop, not because I don't want to read it, as I can just not click on it or put you on ignore but i don't. I am not saying the information isn't useful, I am sure someone will find it useful. The problem is that this topic come up every week.

It is exhausting, and tragic to see every thread turn out this way. The thread started as a heads up on people who are looking to buy a 7D. Not a debate on whether a D800 has a better sensor. We agree it is a good value camera so if you are looking to buy a 7D, get one.

Agreed?

p.s it's you're, not your. You asked for it !
 
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The 1D cameras do not count to me as a crop cameras, as when I say cropped I mean APS-C. The 7D is the top of the line crop camera, now more than ever that the 1DX is the top end of Canon. If the 1D is the only viable pro camera for sports and wildlife then the 7D isn't deserving of sitting in the xD family instead of being the 60D.

It was reasonable value when it came out, but times change. Demands from customers changed as phone cameras got better, demands from clients got higher as other people put out better technical quality images and the like. More competition comes out particularly from Nikon (and Pentax) which means that the 7D being higher resolution than the Nikon's is no longer an argument as it's not a tradeoff between noise performance and resolution any more - it's just that the Nikon sensors are better.
 
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The 1D is the top of the line cropped camera.

The 7D is a 1st generation of that prefix. What do you think professional wildlife and sports photographer shoot before the 7D?
 
They shot the 1D, and they still shoot the 1D. They didn't all shoot the 1.3x crop as a choice though they just wanted the burst speed. The 7D's crop is a much bigger decision than the 1.3x of the 1D, and there are valid reasons for choosing it - but any trait that takes the IQ further from the larger sensors is really bad.

A 7D2 with a sensor as good as rumors are claiming could be a genuine professional choice - the 7D never really was.

EDIT: Have you just totally missed that the 1DX has come out with a full frame sensor?
 
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No, and I never meant to mention the 1DX.

I mean at the launch of 7D, 1D4 (1D series) was the top of the line. They had 2 very clear and distinct line of products.

I am not going to start a debate about 7D being top of the line 4 years after their release because they scrapped the 1D/1Ds lines and combined them 6 months ago. I don't know about Canon's marketing strategy anymore than you do. They could bring out a 1Dc (for copped) in the next expo for all I know and reinvent the whole line again.
 
I honestly had to check the start date on this thread :D

I think it's a bargain as a current crop shooter. I might try and pick a good 2nd hand one up now for shooting football on sundays where my AF on the 50D isn't the best until I can afford a FF camera.


Ksanti said:
A 7D2 with a sensor as good as rumors are claiming could be a genuine professional choice - the 7D never really was.
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Canon rumours makes me laugh, If I didn't know better I'd think the information was cobbled together by a 12 year old. In fact canon rumours should have it's own thread on here just for the lol's.

"Expect an announcement X date" Regurgitate 1 week later when date passes :D

As for the sensor...

ISO Performance to get close to the 5D3

The only thing close will be the use of the same ISO numbers ;)
 
Ksanti said:
Raymond you don't shoot wildlife, where detail is pretty much all the way up there. DXO is a good way of quantifying ISO performance in particular which otherwise tends to just be given as a thereabouts measurement of "usable up to xxx ISO". It just makes it easier to compare them than looking up comparable samples of each one. The strong AA filter on the 7D makes a big impact for wildlife, particularly when you're printing large as most wildlife photographers who make their living off of it do. If you hadn't noticed dynamic range being an issue shooting anything older than the 5D2 I'd be quite surprised as dynamic range has been really quite poor on older cameras - to the point where even under relatively even lighting you couldn't possibly shoot a detailed wedding dress as well as a tuxedo.
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The problem is, the thousands upon thousands of amateur wildlife shooters shooting with a 7D would appear to junk your statement entirely. If you're shooting entirely static subjects then I guess you can get away with other bodies, most people don't though...
 
Rojin said:
The problem is, the thousands upon thousands of amateur wildlife shooters shooting with a 7D would appear to junk your statement entirely. If you're shooting entirely static subjects then I guess you can get away with other bodies, most people don't though...
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How many times do I need to say it doesn't make a huge difference at web sizes but it's a dealbreaker in massive prints particularly with any cropping and it's a significant problem for pretty much any professional client?
 
Ksanti said:
How many times do I need to say it doesn't make a huge difference at web sizes but it's a dealbreaker in massive prints particularly with any cropping and it's a significant problem for pretty much any professional client?
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If you're truly a professional you'd be shooting a 1D4 anyway, or like most now who have moved onto the 1DX. Wildlife at a professional level is a not what the 7D is aimed at.

Massive prints would be a weakness, especially when cropping. I certainly agree with that. Let's be honest though, that's not a concern for the vast majority of amateurs though is it?

Something that also is a plus for the 7D, which helps level out the weaker sensor, is the 100-400L. This is a massively popular setup. I'd be happier using this combo rather than a D7000 and a 80-400. Sony have a nice 70-400, so the A77 starts to look attractive. If Nikon release a good 80-400, that in conjunction with the D7100 with its improved AF could be very nice (you'd have to stick a grip on it though!).
 
Can't we just link to the previous thread and lock this one? As soon as someone posts something, certain people yet again turn up to start arguments and then Ray bizarrely gets attacked for pointing it out again.

As Ray pointed out, it's exhausting reading the same people stating the same things that have been discussed regarding a 4 year old camera, with the same people that don't even own the camera putting it down because they own a Nikon camera that is obviously better than it.

Seriously, are peoples egos so fragile that they have to put down old technology as to indirectly willy wave about their own hardware?

You wonder why less people post here? Look at the attitude of some of the people in these 'discussion' threads and you'll see why people are going to other forums.
 
Ksanti said:
It is when you're selling images to interior design agencies, fashion clients and fine art galleries. Perhaps not so much in wedding photography but then we're not shooting the same stuff. The interior design agencies point is particularly relevant to wildlife photographers if they want to make any sort of liveable income off of their photography, again a point where the 7D's sensor design could present a serious limitation compared to even an old 1D system.
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Who have been buying images for YEARS before the D800 even came out. You just don't get it mate.
 
K.C. Leblanc said:
So a 7D wouldn't be good for gig photography?


Ok I'll stick with my Nikon D200 then.
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Sadly I'm afraid it'll explode like a lawgiver pistol from DREDD the moment you try and take a nice photo on it. Atleast thats what people on here would lead you to believe lol.
 
 
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James J said:
Who have been buying images for YEARS before the D800 even came out. You just don't get it mate.
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Actually you don't, try selling images from say a 20D to a proper agency today, it's just not going to happen. Very few will want to handle film images any more. Times move on and so do the demands of the industry. Just because the camera hasn't changed doesn't mean it's just as suited to the market as it was when it was launched.

I'm measuring relative to the demands and competition of the time, you're measuring in absolute terms, which is only applicable to people who never intend to earn any money at all off of their photography. That may be a fairly significant market, but for what feels like the 70th time, there are other drawbacks to the 7d which must be considered.
 
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