Career change and pay cut

[tom_e]

It seems like an opportunity to be creative and analytical without having to spend my days faking enthusiasm to a brainless client team who can't decide on what they want.

I can tell you've never tried to get a spec from a non techy and never had to deal with the constant stream of "Can we just..." when it comes to spec creep

 

[RobHu]

@dowie is spot on with regards to salary, at least in London. I would guess at an average of 60-70k for someone with a senior developer title (perm), and you don't need to be great to get there. I know of a lot of people with 3-4 years experience on ~50k at average non-tech focused companies. I've also 'worked' with people on contracting rates of 4-500 a day who I wouldn't give a junior role, and yet they go from contract to contract quite happily. If you go in to finance whether it's a big bank or hedge fund then senior developers can push over 100k in a perm role. This can be a lot higher at the more exclusive places as well but those jobs are for the top 0.1% of geniuses IME.

 

[Freefaller]

I switched industries in my late 30s, I'd ended up in management roles in investment banking tech. It was soul-destroying, boring work with a toxic working culture.

I packed it in to get into the games industry. I was only out of work for a couple of months before I landed an intermediate level programming role. My pay went from 100k+ to ~30k.

I didn't miss the money at all, and have since got back up to management level roles so it's not such a big difference these days.

Having a job that is challenging, exciting, interesting, a pleasant working environment, good work/life balance.....is worth far more than a fat salary.

Amen.

Don't get me wrong to be well paid and have all of the positives listed in your last sentence is the cherry on the cake, but I'm totally with you with choosing the career/intellectual stimulus over the pay.

But I guess it's easy for us who have experienced those eye watering salaries to dismiss them? As you go up the ladder, the workload increases as does the responsibility, accountability and ultimately the pressure too. It's not necessarily healthy.

 

[ZombieFan]

The software development market is boyant at the moment. There are plenty of jobs out there for juniors paying good money in London. I've found CWJobs to be a good indication of pay in an area - https://www.cwjobs.co.uk/jobs/junior-developer/in-london?radius=10&s=header

Personallity, communication skills and the ability to fit in well with other members of a team are just as important (if not more) than pure technical skill. Demonstrating the right attitute then that will get you far.

 

[ProStreet]

My salary is c£70k and I have also thought of doing something completely different. I just can't see myself doing the same job for the next 30 years. I want to move but there's not many jobs out there in my field atm.

 

[mid_gen]

The software development market is boyant at the moment. There are plenty of jobs out there for juniors paying good money in London. I've found CWJobs to be a good indication of pay in an area - https://www.cwjobs.co.uk/jobs/junior-developer/in-london?radius=10&s=header

Personallity, communication skills and the ability to fit in well with other members of a team are just as important (if not more) than pure technical skill. Demonstrating the right attitute then that will get you far.

It's worth considering what jobs are still going to be around in a few decades. Software development is a safe bet (and pays well).

 

[regulus]

Late to thread but this is exactly what I'm doing right now. I'm closing to maxing out my current career trajectory and my salary (180k+ NZD) won't jump much more without taking on some major, potential-company-destroying-if-I-screw-up positions I simply do not care about. I just about care about my current position but the novelty is waning by the month. That's why I've given myself a deadline of end 2021 to reposition myself in a more commercial role instead of operations and delivery. I'm looking at a 80k (NZD) pay cut but truth be told, I don't need the money. I'll more than likely be back up to my similar salary in 5-7 years anyway but in a far more interesting role dealing with project financing and negotiations. And then at age 50 (10 years away), I'm going to abruptly retire, move to either Portugal, Cornwall, Western Australia or Spain, get myself a surfboard and surf and drink until a shark or liver failure gets me!

 

[dowie]

And then at age 50 (10 years away), I'm going to abruptly retire, move to either Portugal, Cornwall, Western Australia or Spain, get myself a surfboard and surf and drink until a shark or liver failure gets me!

Haha, nice!

Though have you considered a sabbatical? Like the older you get the more you potentially limit your options... if you're going to have a career change anyway then (obvs perhaps post Covid/vaccine - so in a year or so) taking a year or two out aged 40 and retiring at 52 (or perhaps a few years older still*) might be more fun than carrying on working and retiring at 50... I mean it's early retirement regardless and you'll have bags of time to do all sorts of stuff. If you take say 2 years out then the career change options include returnship programs - these are mostly aimed at say women who have had a career break for child care but not exclusively and are open to anyone who has taken a break whehter it's for that reason or looking after an elderly relative or whatever...

*granted if you start dipping into savings/investments to fund a sabbatical you do lose a decade of compounded returns on that amount too

 

[HangTime]

@dowie 've also 'worked' with people on contracting rates of 4-500 a day who I wouldn't give a junior role, and yet they go from contract to contract quite happily.

The contracting market in London was a bit of an eye-opener for me. Prior to working in the City, I found contract resource was used quite sparing for specific targeted undertakings and genuinely looked like quite a risk in terms of roles only lasting a short while and not that many to go round. Then in the City there is/was loads of long-term contractors, and even those who left contracts could simply pick up another one in the City (so no need to relocate etc). It's sort of a self-fulfilling enterprise; they have multiple 'industry names' as past employers on their CV which means they can just float around picking up contracts even if they are mediocre because the fact they've had 12 roles in 8 years doesn't seem that suspicious for a contractor. The recruitment process is less stringent for contractors than perms so all they need to be able to do is talk a good game at interview. Because of the high rates and outside-IR35 status (at least til April) it doesn't even matter if they have a few months out of work, they are still quids in.

 

[randomshenans]

I contracted for 11 years until just this year when I switched to perm. I went into contracting with only 2.5yr experience in IT. I peaked about 5yrs ago money wise on a busy, no holidays taken, long hours year at 200k. Got so boring though and didn't enjoy what I was doing at all. Rather have some holiday and more time for myself and family than the money tbh.

 

[HangTime]

The thing is that means you'll have been able to make hay during the glory years of no IR35, bigger dividends and some other tax exploits I've probably forgotten about, which will have put you in a great position financially where you can now sit back and relax. In other words it's easy to value the holiday and time with family more than money when you've raked in over a million quid [and the hard miles that comes with it] in the past decade giving you that security. So whilst the gravy train is drying up a bit moving forwards, people have already filled their boots. Ironically, I'm probably at a stage where I'd consider contracting now but the benefits are diminishing.

 

[randomshenans]

We never had IR35 over here, so didn't have that to contend with, but at the same time we can't work for an umbrella etc. or our own Ltd. company, so I simply paid my tax as I would on any income in France, which takes a lot of the benefit you got in the UK out of it, but at the same time commanded a higher pay. Benefit being I still paid social contributions so didn't have to manage those, downside is 40% of my wages still disappeared.

But, agree with you @HangTime it's very easy for me to say I want to take more time for me when I've earned well over the last 10yrs! If I hadn't, I'd no doubt still be putting in the long hours and no holiday.

 

[ScottyAu]

Hi all, I am not sure how I've ended up finding this forum as I am a nurse and health centre manager so work in a very different industry

MARMOT - Your story resonates with me very closely. I am also on a £60,000 + salary and I am very much considering a change in job and pay cut for what sounds like similar reasons. I have just experienced an episode of panic attacks and anxiety for which I had time off work and after reflecting on the situation and doing some deep soul searching, I have concluded that management is not for me! The cross team working and relying on others, project management, unhappy employees, staff shortages, deadlines, answering for finance deficits to the accounts managers, chairing and leading big board meetings in front of specialist consultants and other managers NUP - not for me. I too find the big meetings stressful, It takes me about 2 weeks to prep and it's all I can focus on in that time and yup, I too deliver a good meeting and get great feedback BUT to the detriment of my quality of life. Plus - I am a softy and you need a thick skin to be a manager, also, it's lonely at the top I very much am missing the team work and camaraderie.

SO, I am going back to my roots and going to do what I trained to do and that is work directly with patients and YES it is going to be a pay cut, an eye watering MAJOR pay cut! However, the wage I was on was lovely at first but as the toll of the job and the stressors took over it became less relevant. For me I believe the rewards of helping people directly as a nurse and working in a happy, busy team are my motivating and driving factors. I think we all need to find what motivates and drives us and for some of us it isn't always money, and that's OK - it took me a year of torment to learn that about myself

I am not sure if this post will help anyone, but I do hope so. We must be kind to our selves! We must enjoy what we do, if we don't there is a chance it could become a monotonous heavy burden the effects of which can spill out into your personal and social life and effect your quality of life. If this is the case, or your mental health or other health is being affected, then take a step back, take a deep breath, do a bit of soul searching and reflection and weigh up if the salary/benefit is worth the risks.

Life is short and we have but only one go at it, be happy, be safe and be kind to yourselves and each other and finally be BRAVE, you do not know what exciting and wonderful opportunities may just be waiting around the corner, sometimes we just need to take the plunge!

 

[Spiritwolf]

When it comes to a job, don't push yourself to do something you don't like, my Dad did that for most of his life and that's always what he said. You will soon find a ceiling where you will be stuck, and what money you earn will be lost on metal breakdowns / health etc.

I am in my 30s, originally after graduation I joined investment banking in the city because that seems to be where the money is, worked up a few levels and decide it was not going to be for me, sure the money is nice, but you are constantly under so much stress and over worked, and at the end of the day, what I did really didn't seem to matter to the world. So I left and took on a junior dev job 15 years ago and reworked my way up.

Right now I earn similar level to the friends who are still in the city game, (at SVP or Director level). Except instead of reading reports and making presentations all day, I am doing something I feel is making a difference to the world, and something I am good at.

Remember the founder of KFC was 62 when he founded the company, it is never too late to start.

 

[ScottyAu]

Spirtwolf that is great advice and a great story of how you made the change and have worked your way back up the ranks and it sounds as though you have found your place in your career.