champions league draw

[[J.D.C]]

So far in the Spanish season Barcelona have played 15 matches and won every one save two (1 draw, 1 loss). The vast majority of these teams are far below Barcelona's stature, so again I don't understand how they'll be negatively affected by the expectation to dominate or whatever you're on about?

And I could rave about the proximity of Jupiter to the Emirates affecting the game and it would have the same impact of your 'opinion', as it is completely undemonstratible in fact and I could go on self-convinced 'regardless of what anyone else says'.


Any 'animosity' you perceive could perhaps have come out of the fact that you responded 'think harder' to someone saying they didn't understand your (non-)point? Being the first one to bring 'the playground stuff' into affairs as it were?

So let me get this straight..

You're completely convinced there isn't a hope in hell Barcelona might be complacent (I mean..when have they ever been....Jesus, I could have sworn Inter snuffed them out twice and Messi was useless over two legs last year..) against Arsenal? No chance at all?

I'm talking about the oldest tale in the book of football. Any team can beat anyone, any day, any time.

Again, for the last time, I'm simply suggesting the expectation (especially after their demolition of Madrid) has been raised to GOD-LIKE levels and Arsenal are now being given literally no chance. Which is wrong in my opinion for a side like Arsenal who really could beat anyone on their day.

Because that's literally all I'm arguing. Which is why, with respect, I find it absurd you wouldn't grasp that. Even if you disagree with it. You should understand the concept of chance.

Which is why again, it's ridiculous you're making such a meal out of it.

 

[jakeke]

Just to add to your conversation, you see every week in the news, 2 or 3 Barca players saying before a standard La Liga game that they will not underestimate their opponent and will be fully focused, even before playing the likes of Osasuna or Deportivo, they always respect their opponent and they seem a humble bunch, which is why I think they've managed to stay at the top for so long, and actually improve on what seemed like already perfect football (a few seasons ago)

 

[[J.D.C]]

Don't get me wrong I don't think it's likely Arsenal will have a chance either. I just think it's wrong to rule them out completely like so many seem to be doing.

And you're absolutely right about the Barca players being more humble than most. Even Messi doesn't seem to understand just how good he really is, which is scary.

 

[barrix]

Barca is gonna win again IMO.

 

[jakeke]

That's true, and it's the only niggle in my mind, that Arsene may think "Well, we'll probably have to play them at some point, so let's just do it". But then again, there's about an extra £6 million to be won if you get through to the semis, and about another £4.5 million for reaching the final (that's prize money so add on TV and sponsorship as well). So, if I was Arsene and I knew it was a fix, I'd be thinking "Why should my team lose millions of pounds in potential earnings because of corruption?"

Mind you, he seems adverse to spending money so maybe he won't miss it

Yep, I was wrong to say I'm sure it happens, I don't work at FIFA so I don't know for 100%, but let's say it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if it were true. One year somebody says they have a connection who knows the draw and reveals it to prove himself, the next Wenger says he already knew Arsenal would play Barca through having connections, we already knew FIFA was corrupt but it was re-affirmed for the 100th time this summer, and we know that the TV rights for Barcelona-Arsenal would be pretty huge and there's nothing FIFA like more than money. Maybe they're not completely manufactured, but possibly certain games are made to happen, like everyone talking Beckham returning to Old Trafford last year (I think?) and then surprisingly it happens etc.

 

[guyfawkes5]

So let me get this straight..

You're completely convinced there isn't a hope in hell Barcelona might be complacent (I mean..when have they ever been....Jesus, I could have sworn Inter snuffed them out twice and Messi was useless over two legs last year..) against Arsenal? No chance at all?

I'm talking about the oldest tale in the book of football. Any team can beat anyone, any day, any time.

Again, for the last time, I'm simply suggesting the expectation (especially after their demolition of Madrid) has been raised to GOD-LIKE levels and Arsenal are now being given literally no chance. Which is wrong in my opinion for a side like Arsenal who really could beat anyone on their day.

Because that's literally all I'm arguing. Which is why, with respect, I find it absurd you wouldn't grasp that. Even if you disagree with it. You should understand the concept of chance.

Which is why again, it's ridiculous you're making such a meal out of it.

Let me set things straight then:

I think the numerical probability of what you're babbling about occuring is so small that it's laughably insignificant given that hard facts argue against it and all you can say now is 'well you can't completely rule it out'. Basically if Barcelona are going to lose it is almost certainly not going to be to complacency, as we have discussed.

Like I said, I might as well debate the impact of astronomy on the game with you for all the credibility at stake here.

And how am I 'making a meal' of anything? The only one struggling to keep the insults out and actually maintain a debate based on logical persuasion is you.

 

[[J.D.C]]

'Babbling about' -

*IGNORE*

 

[guyfawkes5]

*IGNORE*

Should've a while back.

 

[reefoid]

One year somebody says they have a connection who knows the draw and reveals it to prove himself, the next Wenger says he already knew Arsenal would play Barca through having connections, we already knew FIFA was corrupt but it was re-affirmed for the 100th time this summer, and we know that the TV rights for Barcelona-Arsenal would be pretty huge and there's nothing FIFA like more than money.

When you put the argument that way it does make me wonder actually

 

[Hxc]

Messi doesn't seem to understand just how good he really is, which is scary.

He doesn't even look like he's trying. It's just amazing. Nobody else remotely like it. Ronaldo looks like he is working hard when he's on top, messi just looks like he's having a bit of fun.

The posterchild for football. He's humble, beat adversery, and godamn, he's good.

 

[sunnysingh]

Forget the English ties, I'm looking forward to Inter Vs Bayern, last years final. Hopefully both teams with have their strong teams by February such as Robben. Not a easy one to call as Rafa has a decent record in champion league competition. But then again Rafa always finds a way to mess things up !!!!!!!!!

 

[AGD]

Forget the English ties, I'm looking forward to Inter Vs Bayern, last years final. Hopefully both teams with have their strong teams by February such as Robben. Not a easy one to call as Rafa has a decent record in champion league competition. But then again Rafa always finds a way to mess things up !!!!!!!!!

I don't think rafa will still be manager in february... He's gonna get fired if they lose the next game and I can't see him lasting that long in any case.

Arsenal are going to get mullered by barca again. Nice draws for man u and chelsea though.

 

[[J.D.C]]

Forget the English ties, I'm looking forward to Inter Vs Bayern, last years final. Hopefully both teams with have their strong teams by February such as Robben. Not a easy one to call as Rafa has a decent record in champion league competition. But then again Rafa always finds a way to mess things up !!!!!!!!!

If Rafa is still at the helm by then. That said, I thought Bayern were a bit lucky last year in the CL and their defence is very suspect.

That said, Rafa has worked his magic and now Inter look nowhere near as solid.

 

[Twinblade]

Interesting draw and can see all the English sides getting through, although Arsenal do have things a little difficult.

You have to expect Chelsea to beat Copenhagen and United to beat Marseille, especially as come Feb they should have got over their respective dip in form and rustiness.

Spurs can beat Milan, won't be easy, but Italian teams don't play at ant particular pace and Spurs can exploit that - however, our defence worries me still, and AC pose a better attacking threat than Inter do with Robinho, Zlatan and Pato. If we get all our 1st choice players fit we could do it.

Arsenal have it hard, we all know what Barca can do, but Copenhagen got a point against them in the group stages so its possible, unfortunately, I believe Arsenal will need to change their style of play, and I don't know if they have that in them.

 

[Greenlizard0]

We got a point in that way from them last year (2-2), but it's a two legged tie though. They're ridiculously good at home and they know it.

 

[sunnysingh]

Didnt Rubin Kazan get a draw at the new camp ? For me Arsenal really need to change the way they are setup. Of course that's easier said then done but they have to really believe they can win. Never the less it should be an entertaining game. Hope Arsenal can do it !!!

 

[drunkenmaster]

Yep, I was wrong to say I'm sure it happens, I don't work at FIFA so I don't know for 100%, but let's say it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if it were true. One year somebody says they have a connection who knows the draw and reveals it to prove himself, the next Wenger says he already knew Arsenal would play Barca through having connections, we already knew FIFA was corrupt but it was re-affirmed for the 100th time this summer, and we know that the TV rights for Barcelona-Arsenal would be pretty huge and there's nothing FIFA like more than money. Maybe they're not completely manufactured, but possibly certain games are made to happen, like everyone talking Beckham returning to Old Trafford last year (I think?) and then surprisingly it happens etc.

Errm, Arsenal vs Barca tv wise won't pull in anywhere near the viewing figures of, well a game people don't all expect a walkover game from.

Likewise the World Cup corruption rubbish about Fifa is beyond a joke.

Fifa for the best part of 15 years have been promoting and for the past TWO world cups have made sure a NEW country and hopefully a new continent hosts the world cup, a mistake was made with south america because no one else bid against Brazil, whoops, so they took of the only one continent rule to stop that happening again.

Some bright spark at the FA< despite KNOWING FiFa would pick the best nation to never have held it before, realised telling people like stupid Brown and other stupid people we had a genuine chance, they'd get a bigger role more money, more income to the FA and more publicity.

Now, who is corrupt? Fifa who have been completely clear on their mandate making everyone to bid whose hosted before complete moron's, or the guy who saw a profit to be made in the FA by telling everyone we had a chance.

THere was never, at any stage in the past 10 years and the next 20 years, or England getting the world cup, everyone knew that except England apparently.


As for Arsenal, yes, West Brom, Brentford, Torquay all have a STATISTICAL possibility of beating a full first team Barcelona squad, theres also a chance a meteorite might hit their pre match huddle and we go through by default. These things are such ridiculously low odds its perfectly acceptable to accept the fact they won't actually happen.

Arsenal will not beat Barca, we didn't beat them last year, with a stronger squad, they did have one average game, and at home we still couldn't beat them, away we were made to look pathetic.

People who bring up copenhagen are daft, does no one remember Barca's group last year, they LOST to FAR worse teams than Copenhagen, which goes to prove, Barca don't take pointless games overly seriously. Knockout game's they most certainly do.

 

[drunkenmaster]

We got a point in that way from them last year (2-2), but it's a two legged tie though. They're ridiculously good at home and they know it.

Unfortunately this goes back to our Home form, last year and the previous decade, we were basically a fortress, we lost two games all last year at home, Utd, Chelsea. This year we lost to West Brom, Newcastle, Spurs and have almost dropped points against a whole bunch of other teams. Compared to the last decade our home form is shamefull this year.

Didnt Rubin Kazan get a draw at the new camp ? For me Arsenal really need to change the way they are setup. Of course that's easier said then done but they have to really believe they can win. Never the less it should be an entertaining game. Hope Arsenal can do it !!!

Yes they did, I believe they lost in the away leg, actually they might have lost at the Nou camp and drawn away, largely because in games that really don't matter points wise, they didn't waste the time and effort.

Arsenal won't change the way they are setup, Wenger's over 5 years decided this is the most defensive setup we can have, 4-5-1 hasn't worked a single time against a top team yet, we haven't beaten a truly top team for 5 freaking years, why anyone thinks we'll start with the worst squad we've had in that 5 years I don't know.

EDIT:- yup, Kazan beat them 2-1 at the Nou Camp, 0-0 away, also drew away to Inter but beat them at home, in the group stage at least.

 

[jakeke]

Errm, Arsenal vs Barca tv wise won't pull in anywhere near the viewing figures of, well a game people don't all expect a walkover game from.

Despite your hate for Arsenal, they're well supported across the world and one of the more popular teams amongst neutrals all over, and Barcelona are possibly the best supported team in the world recently. A game between those two so early on is one a lot of people will look out for.

About you calling the FIFA stuff rubbish, they only approached 2 people and both of them requested money for their vote, imagine if they'd asked all 20+?

 

[Greenlizard0]

Didnt Rubin Kazan get a draw at the new camp ? For me Arsenal really need to change the way they are setup. Of course that's easier said then done but they have to really believe they can win. Never the less it should be an entertaining game. Hope Arsenal can do it !!!

I never said they were not going to win every game - it's pointless looking for examples of where they failed to beat their opponents. When it's all serious and there's something at stake, you can beat your bottom dollar that Barca will in the big picture of two legs, come up top against Arsenal. would have course love it not to happen, but that's the way it will go.

As said above, the result against Shaktar is really the cause of this. I mean who did they end up getting? Roma - that should be our opponent. :/

Edit:

"Theo Walcott is equally bullish, insisting: "I would love to go back there and show them what we are all about this season."

Oh Theo, if only you were 10% of what you think you are.