Chinese cars

[SkyTerran]

Looks like the sales of Chinese cars in UK are rising. MG offers probably the best deals on EVs. Volvo (don't know if one can count it as Chinese, but it's 100% owned by a Chinese company) has a huge wait list from what I hear.

Recently watched a few reviews from China for cars such as BYD SONG (which seems to have replaced VW and Toyota as the most popular taxi car in China). And it looks like the 80 or so car companies in China are making huge progress and are soon to leave the Germans far behind.

Especially with EVs China has a huge advantage over Germany - it makes and exports batteries, while German car makers have to import batteries from S. Korea and China. Also the Chinese have a huge range of models, from very cheap city cars with 50 or a 100 miles range to huge SUVs full of tech, like lidars. And unlike the German brands, the entry level cheap cars get a ton of tech for free.

 

[Diddums]

Ok

 

[Tom_ed1987]

If you buy one you are essentially directly supporting the CCP.

 

[SkyTerran]

If you buy one you are essentially directly supporting the CCP.

OK, but if you buy an iPhone assembled in China do you support the CCP?

A huge part of the products on the shelves of our shops are made in China. Most European EVs have batteries made in China - and the battery is the most expensive part of an EV.

 

[BUDFORCE]

Yea you'd have to go really out of your way to buy stuff not made in China.

 

[jpaul]

Chinese design and native/domestic engineering quality eg Geely versus Western mftr over viewed production in China are not the same.
Chinese cars are going to have a trial by fire on the 2nd hand uk market even if manufacturers like volvo/ex30 are trying to introduce them surreptitiously

On the Chinese - well hyundai build quality question - this confirmed the earlier articles/my fears Kia EV6 | On The Hoist
so beauty in the cabin, but the what's happening beneath ? (under protected body work, lots of fasteners/bracing, discrete components, human welding on battery compartments)
they suggest 1990's construction ... Datsun?

 

[Jim99]

It really wouldn't surprise me if in a few years they form a huge part of the UK market.

The only thing I'm not sure about is whether it will be Chinese brands that take over, or whether it's them buying existing brands like MG, Volvo etc and using them to push through Chinese models.

I really don't think the average consumer cares much beyond price and features, and they've got every chance of winning on those fronts.

 

[EH75]

Did people not used to scoff when Japanese cars first came on the scene? Look at them now. Maybe China is next.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

Don’t forget those pesky Korean cars no one wants, oh wait….

Chinese designed cars (so not the stuff still mainly designed in Sweden) have come a long way and are pretty much as good as what the likes of Stelantis are putting out at that end of the market. At the other end the likes of Nio and Xpeng have an interesting offer.

 

[geekman]

They are hugely popular here, we have MG, BAIC, JAC, Chirey, Changan, FAW, and probably a few others that I can’t remember. Some of them offer longer warranty periods than brands such as Toyota or Kia but they haven’t been out long enough to know whether or not they’ll honour them long term.

I had a go of a friend’s Chirey Omoda 5 - lots of technology for the price and I can see why people like them, but the fit of the trim around the glovebox area was absolutely terrible, looked like it had been taken apart and put back together by a 5 year old. Hopefully they pay more attention to the mechanical stuff.

 

[SDK^]

if Euro and other non Chinese car makers are to survive there needs to be more duty/tax applied to Chinese cars.
The others can’t compete on price and when you look on social media it’s already playing out.

The Stellantis group have launched several new EV’s at a price whuch many consumers can’t deal with.

 

[Terminal_Boy]

Are these Chinese cars independently tested in Europe for compliance to EU/TüV/CE safety standards?

 

[FerretBoy]

My 2017 Golf R was built in Germany, it rattled and creaked from new. My 2021 China built Tesla has zero issues, pretty impressive imho

From watching the reviews the main issue with the Chinese brand EVs seems to be all the extra UI noises they add Not a deal breaker.

 

[Grim5]

 

[b0rn2sk8]

The Stellantis group have launched several new EV’s at a price whuch many consumers can’t deal with.

I think you can get a Corsa-E for under £22k again which is good because the list price is stupid (£32,000).

@Grim5 whats the TLDW and is the YouTuber actually credible?

 

[b0rn2sk8]

@Grim5 whats the TLDW and is the YouTuber actually credible?

Ok, I watched the first 90 seconds and I’m going to go with no.

 

[Grim5]

Chinese cars are throwaways, so long as you are happy with that then so be it. Just don't expect the car to have any resale value and don't expect it to last more than 10 years before the rust make the floor fall out or the everything dies on you


As for people with their whataboutism regarding Tesla and iPhones - those products are built to western standards and enforced by the western owners because they are premium products - it may surprise you but the Chinese can make high quality products when they want to, the problem is they don't want unless you force them to and you give your technology so they know how to use western technology to create those products. The Chinese owned car brands are built to Chinese standards using Chinese tools and machines, they cut corners wherever possible - for example using recycled steel and not galvanising the steel, so by the time your car is 10 years old half of it is covered in rust and holes

 

[b0rn2sk8]

I think claims like that need to be backed up with some creditable evidence.

People said the same thing about Korean cars, and in fairness, their early cars were utter trash but then they weren’t.

Early Chinese cars were trash, now time will be the judge of the rest.

To add my own anecdotes, I (my wife) has had two western cars at 10 years old suffered with rust issues. One was a Mazda, the other was a Ford and Ford literally invented the car factory. Over time, both of these cars became renown for being rust buckets.

 

[Kill_Phil]

Chinese cars are throwaways, so long as you are happy with that then so be it. Just don't expect the car to have any resale value and don't expect it to last more than 10 years before the rust make the floor fall out or the everything dies on you


As for people with their whataboutism regarding Tesla and iPhones - those products are built to western standards and enforced by the western owners because they are premium products - it may surprise you but the Chinese can make high quality products when they want to, the problem is they don't want unless you force them to and you give your technology so they know how to use western technology to create those products. The Chinese owned car brands are built to Chinese standards using Chinese tools and machines, they cut corners wherever possible - for example using recycled steel and not galvanising the steel, so by the time your car is 10 years old half of it is covered in rust and holes

Have you got a source on using recycled steel in cars coming to the European market?

And you seem to forget that nearly every ev battery is made in China. Simply having this advantage means non of the establishes brands can compete on price

There a reason why the VAG group have just purchased a 700m 5% stake in one of the largest ev producers in China

 

[jpaul]

European/UK rules of origin are restoring competitiveness of established brands so that chinese can't just dump batteries - todays bmw investment is testament to that future tax.


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Korean car integrity - need to watch aforementioned Monro video on kia ev6 tear down - and then discuss whether there is any trash concern.