Chinese cars

b0rn2sk8 · 27 Feb 2025 at 21:42

snowdog said:
That is odd, a TM3 is rwd is 39k here, while the cheapest ID3 is is 34k (which is the slowass 170 hp version, the 204 hp versions start from 39k just like the TM3).

But to get the same options/features you need to spend the same. I've had colleagues with the 50k ''style'' spec and that still only gets you a meagre 204 hp and 100 mph top speed...

Are you comparing RRP with the amount you'd actually pay for one at a dealer?

VW don't sell direct, dealers always have 'discounts' available, particularly these days, a dealer not that far from me has a Pro Match trim available for £29k, RRP is £36.6k on the website, no haggling needed.

The bigger battery (77kwh) version is available for £33k with a 'free' Ohme charger (fitted) and 2 years 'free' servicing thrown in, RRP is £40k.

Edit: none of these are Chinese cars, lets get back to topic.

Simon · 27 Feb 2025 at 21:51

snowdog said:
Errr, the Tesla now has double glazed windows and is quieter than an ID3, which is quite noisy on the motorway imho, especially at speed ( as far as it can get to any meaningful speed).

You been on the kool aid I think. My mum doesn’t care about cars. She even said the Tesla felt cheap and rode like a horse and cart. And it is both cheap and rode bad. 2020 and 2021. Maybe the newer ones are ‘better’. The steering squeaked too as in the vid you ignored

My born is very quiet in motorway so I can’t imagine the ID3 being much different. Teslarati are out in force

Jonnycoupe · 27 Feb 2025 at 22:23

snowdog said:
Errr, the Tesla now has double glazed windows and is quieter than an ID3, which is quite noisy on the motorway imho, especially at speed ( as far as it can get to any meaningful speed).

Errrm it’s squeaky suspension.

m4rmite · 27 Feb 2025 at 23:22

Pesky Chinese spying on their car users. Not the only ones it seems..

Attorney General Griffin Sues General Motors and OnStar for Deceiving Arkansans and Unlawfully Selling Data - Arkansas Attorney General

Griffin: ‘We will hold GM accountable for deceiving Arkansans and increasing profits through deceptive practices’ LITTLE ROCK – Attorney General Tim Griffin issued the following statement announcing that his office has sued General Motors and its subsidiary OnStar for deceiving Arkansans and...

arkansasag.gov

SkyTerran · 9 Mar 2025 at 06:13

Armageus · 8 May 2025 at 16:56

Not 100% EV related, but fits here as much as anywhere else -

Read this earlier, and reminded me that I actually saw one of these (Jaecoo 7) on the road the other day

The Jaecoo 7 is a bad omen for the dystopian software-defined future of motoring | Autocar

The Jaecoo 7 will need the mother of all software updates to make the grade

www.autocar.co.uk

Hideous looking car, and equally by the sounds of atrocious software - hopefully not a staple of all the new Chinese vehicles arriving as part of the EV / PHEV push we are seeing.

b0rn2sk8 · 8 May 2025 at 17:19

Armageus said:
Not 100% EV related, but fits here as much as anywhere else -

Read this earlier, and reminded me that I actually saw one of these (Jaecoo 7) on the road the other day

The Jaecoo 7 is a bad omen for the dystopian software-defined future of motoring | Autocar

The Jaecoo 7 will need the mother of all software updates to make the grade

www.autocar.co.uk

Hideous looking car, and equally by the sounds of atrocious software - hopefully not a staple of all the new Chinese vehicles arriving as part of the EV / PHEV push we are seeing.

There is a Chinese car thread, probably don’t need to RTM this one

Chinese cars

Looks like the sales of Chinese cars in UK are rising. MG offers probably the best deals on EVs. Volvo (don't know if one can count it as Chinese, but it's 100% owned by a Chinese company) has a huge wait list from what I hear. Recently watched a few reviews from China for cars such as BYD SONG...

forums.overclockers.co.uk

that said, it’s not a Chinese car issue, just ask VW how the ID.3 launch went.

Journey · 8 May 2025 at 18:07

b0rn2sk8 said:
that said, it’s not a Chinese car issue, just ask VW how the ID.3 launch went.

They went above and beyond to make sure it was terrible.

inflames · 11 May 2025 at 09:32

How have I not seen this thread before? Seems like the sort of thread I would have posted in. I have been lucky with my job that I have been able to drive and even work on some Chinese cars. The ones that I have worked on, I can say are well built and I would happily own. The biggest unknown with any new brand to us in the west is the longevity of these vehicles. I am sure there are some Chinese cars out there are bad cars, like all manufacturers.

I personally think that BYD will become the new Toyota in the next 10 years that make cheap and reliable vehicles. I would happily own a BYD seal if I could afford one depending on test drive etc.

One the biggest issues with Chinese EV brands is the sheer amount of them in China, so many it’s ridiculous and many of them have folded over night. The big players in China will do well in the west, some already are doing well down under. The Geely family, Neo, Saic and BYD will be big players in the global car market.

jpaul · 17 May 2025 at 21:39

Wait until BYD products have spread much further than the fleet market in the UK , to see if the 2nd hand private market gives them the thumbs up.

chinese market apparently thinks they are good value for money versus porsche - chinese get a vote too

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/porsche-faces-mounting-problems-rattled-081344062.html

Within the last 14 months, Porsche has walked back its plans for 50 percent of its vehicle sales to be battery-electric vehicles and plug-in hybrids by 2025. On Nov. 26, Porsche said it would develop new combustion-engine derivatives after global sales of BEVs slumped on weak demand in China.

Porsche has also delayed the introduction of the electric 718 Boxster and Cayman and a new three-row flagship SUV, according to Automotive News Europe sister publication Automobilwoche.
...

He added that to transition to electric Porsche would have benefited from adopting “a more flexible production approach between combustion and BEV cars, like BMW did.”

To reverse the slide, Porsche plans to implement restructuring measures and cut thousands of jobs. As many as 8,000 jobs are at stake, according to Automobilwoche.

Simon · 17 May 2025 at 22:01

Chinese buying Chinese cars. Surprised ?

esmozz · 18 May 2025 at 09:01

Can somebody correct me if I'm wrong?

The BYD Seal (AWD) in Germany is 51,000 euro which includes a 34% tariff from the EU on Chinese EV's

The BYD Seal (AWD) in the UK is 49,000 pounds and the UK applies no tariffs to imported Chinese EV's.

Are we getting absolutely stiffed again?

m4rmite · 18 May 2025 at 09:11

esmozz said:
Can somebody correct me if I'm wrong?

The BYD Seal (AWD) in Germany is 51,000 euro which includes a 34% tariff from the EU on Chinese EV's

The BYD Seal (AWD) in the UK is 49,000 pounds and the UK applies no tariffs to imported Chinese EV's.

Are we getting absolutely stiffed again?

Ours is right hand drive, so I'm sure that will be the excuse for "extra" costs.

esmozz · 18 May 2025 at 09:22

m4rmite said:
Ours is right hand drive, so I'm sure that will be the excuse for "extra" costs.

True, but I'm just doing a bit of googling now about this and it turns out a BYD Seal (AWD) in Australia in 63000 AUS or 31,000 pounds!!! And they drive on the left too. I don't know about additional taxes (if any) they have to add in Aus but I reckon we are getting stiffed. We always get stiffed like this in the UK.

m4rmite · 18 May 2025 at 09:37

esmozz said:
True, but I'm just doing a bit of googling now about this and it turns out a BYD Seal (AWD) in Australia in 63000 AUS or 31,000 pounds!!! And they drive on the left too. I don't know about additional taxes (if any) they have to add in Aus but I reckon we are getting stiffed. We always get stiffed like this in the UK.

Don't forget Australia is a lot closer to China for shipping.

But yes the uk consumer always gets stiffed

esmozz · 18 May 2025 at 09:46

m4rmite said:
Don't forget Australia is a lot closer to China for shipping.

But yes the uk consumer always gets stiffed

Yes, and it looks like Australia gets close to the Chinese domestic price but that mark-up is bonkers. A quick google would suggest a price of about 4000 pounds to ship from China to the UK. When I visited the BYD dealership last week no wonder they were all smiling (said in jest, I doubt they see much of the mark-up)

b0rn2sk8 · 18 May 2025 at 14:16

The UK has a 10% tariff on Chinese built cars and pretty much always has (or more accurately any imported cars not covered by any other trade or tariff deal).

esmozz · 18 May 2025 at 14:42

b0rn2sk8 said:
The UK has a 10% tariff on Chinese built cars and pretty much always has (or more accurately any imported cars not covered by any other trade or tariff deal).

Yes, I was doing some googling to find out more and you're quite correct. Still, 10% UK vs 35% Germany and the BYD Seal is still cheaper in Germany. Although maybe overall taxes and costs may be more over there, I don't know.

jpaul · 18 May 2025 at 16:23

Simon said:
Chinese buying Chinese cars. Surprised ?

they don't think porsche represent good value for money so are not buying them - need more effective marketting to pursuade them otherwise,
albeit depreciation probably feeding into those decisions too, if it's like taycan in EU, chinese economy like eu is suffering, and porsche oversupplied them into fleet purchases.

for the likes of the Seal, do we know what their declared value is for customs/duty purposes - the rrp that the private consumer might pay wouldn't resemble the deducted price they are knocked down at for the fleet market.

Simon · 18 May 2025 at 16:43

A taycan isn’t a mass market car.