Citizenship help

Burnsy2023 · 12 Feb 2013 at 21:52

Right, I'll explain the situation first.

My mother is German and I hold a German passport, however, anyone who has met me would find it difficult to find anything that makes that obvious. I have lived here since birth and culturally, I am as British as any other person that holds a British passport.

I know that when I was 16 or so, I did put in an application for a British passport and this was declined by the UKPA. The exact reasons for this I'm not clear on, but I assumed it was because there was no father named on my birth certificate, I couldn't prove a British parent. I also was under the assumption that I had no automatic entitlement to British citizenship as I was born after 1983 when the law changed.

I was looking at getting naturalised so I could apply for certain jobs that require British citzenship and came across this:

If you were born in the UK on or after 1 January 1983 but before 2 October 2000, you are a British citizen if, at the time of your birth, either of your parents was an EEA citizen who was exercising Treaty rights under European Community (EC) law. This is because your parent's stay is regarded as having been free of a time limit under immigration laws.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/b...ishcitizenship/borninukorqualifyingterritory/

I was born in the UK in 1987 and my mum is an EU citizen, so despite what I've previously thought, am I a British Citizen?

I know that this is a complicated matter, does anyone know of organisations that can help advise me other than the CAB (who I will approach soon)?

[FnG]magnolia · 12 Feb 2013 at 21:53

SEND THEM BACK!

e : can't you speak to the people your link is from?

Burnsy2023 · 12 Feb 2013 at 21:56

[FnG]magnolia;23749515 said:
SEND THEM BACK!

e : can't you speak to the people your link is from?

You tell me. As far as I am aware, the UKBA won't give advice on this and will direct me to a solicitor, which I obviously want to avoid paying for.

Nix · 12 Feb 2013 at 21:58

Isn't there something that applies being as you've lived here so long? I was under the impression there was.

Rotty · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:02

if you reapply would they not give you a reason if it was refused ?

and yes, having met you I never noticed that you were anything other than British (well apart from the lederhosen and sausage breath

)

Skeeter · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:02

"Do I look Scottish?!"

Burnsy2023 · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:07

Nix said:
Isn't there something that applies being as you've lived here so long? I was under the impression there was.

No, not as far as I can see.

Rotty said:
if you reapply would they not give you a reason if it was refused ?

and yes, having met you I never noticed that you were anything other than British (well apart from the lederhosen and sausage breath )

Well we all like a bit of sausage.

Skeeter said:
"Do I look Scottish?!"

I hate you.

I think the issue I will face is not the requirements, but proving them. From the IPS (UKPA)

Born or adopted in the UK
Before 1 January 1983

You must send your birth or adoption certificate.

On or after 1 January 1983

You must send your birth or adoption certificate and either:

your mother’s or father’s UK birth certificate, Home Office certificate of registration/naturalisation, a British passport belonging to one of your parents that was valid when you were born or a British passport number for either parent (which you must put in section 4 of the application form)

evidence of one of your parents’ immigration status in the UK at the time of your birth (eg a foreign passport belonging to one of your parents that was valid when you were born)

I can't prove my mother's immigration status at my birth and I have no idea how I would.

mo9204 · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:11

i tough after 5 years in the UK your Eligible, let alone born here. your living here with your German passport, which is EU, and EU Citizen can life here.
you can change to dual Citizen, is your father British?

is your birth certificate British? then i dont see why not

Horse Pop · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:14

This stuff is complicated and costs money to get wrong (actually, does it cost money to apply for you? It does for the missus).

There's a reason lawyers can charge money for this.

Nonetheless I'd seek proper advice.

UKBA as you say, will not help you.

Burnsy2023 · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:14

mo9204 said:
i tough after 5 years in the UK your Eligible, let alone born here. your living here with your German passport, which is EU, and EU Citizen can life here.
you can change to dual Citizen, is your father British?

is your birth certificate British? then i don't see why not

I have a British birth certificate, but there is no father listed. I would like to be a dual national and hold both passports, but I don't know if I am already a British citizen and how I go about proving that.

Burnsy2023 · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:16

Horse Pop said:
This stuff is complicated and costs money to get wrong (actually, does it cost money to apply for you? It does for the missus).

There's a reason lawyers can charge money for this.

Nonetheless I'd seek proper advice.

UKBA as you say, will not help you.

Any suggestion of who can help me, before I start spending money on legal advice? Obviously I don't want to spend hundreds of pounds on advice that I can avoid paying. So any suggestions other than CAB?

shine · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:19

The key point in the legislation is the immigration status of your parents, in your case your mother as no father is listed. You need to ask your mother what her legal status was at the time of your birth - were she resident on a visa or had she been granted Indefinite Leave to Remain (ILR) which is permanent residence.

If she had permanent residence at the time of your birth then you should be able to claim British citizenship but you'll need to provide her documentation to prove this, if she were only on a visa then no, you can't claim British citizenship.

In British law, anyone born after January 1983 can only British citizenship if their parent(s) are British or considered to be permanently settled (had ILR). If the parents can't fulfil these criteria then the child must take the nationality of the parents.

Burnsy2023 · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:21

shine said:
The key point in the legislation is the immigration status of your parents, in your case your mother as no father is listed. You need to ask your motor what her legal status was at the time of your birth - were she on a visa or had she been granted Indefinite Leave to Remain (ILR) which is permanent residence.

If she had permanent residence at the time of your birth then you should be able to claim British citizenship but you'll need to provide her documentation to prove this, if she were only on a visa then no, you can't claim British citizenship.

In British law, anyone born after January 1983 can only British citizenship if their parent(s) are British or considered to be permanently settled (had ILR). If the parents can't fulfil these criteria then the child must take the nationality of the parents.

Here's another spanner for the works: I'm not in contact with my mother and haven't been for a long time. I have no other documentation other than my birth certificate and her German marriage certificate. As she was an EU citizen, wouldn't she automatically have ILR? She did live here from a bit before my birth until 2003 though, that says to me that she was settled.

jsmoke · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:22

Sounds a bit strange that you may not be a British citizen after being born and lived here. On the other hand Britain may not be around for much longer, who knows, hope it is.

Horse Pop · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:26

Burnsy2023 said:
Any suggestion of who can help me, before I start spending money on legal advice? Obviously I don't want to spend hundreds of pounds on advice that I can avoid paying. So any suggestions other than CAB?

Unfortunately not really.

My missus had access to some legal advice via a forum for Russian wives but that doesn't really help you.

CAB seems like a decent step.

shine · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:29

Burnsy2023 said:
Here's another spanner for the works: I'm not in contact with my mother and haven't been for a long time. I have no other documentation other than my birth certificate and her German marriage certificate. As she was an EU citizen, wouldn't she automatically have ILR? She did live here from a bit before my birth until 2003 though, that says to me that she was settled.

You have to prove she was legally settled here, I'm afraid I don't know what the UKBA would consider proof.

Would not be easier to go down this route instead?

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/britishcitizenship/eligibility/registration/britishnational/

Burnsy2023 · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:30

That would cost me close to £1000 in fees and I'd have to pass that stupid citizen test.

semi-pro waster · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:38

Would you not be able to claim permanent residency via the Immigration (EEA) Regulations 2006? You're an EEA national (German passport holder) and you've been resident within the UK for the past 5+ years exercising treaty rights (student and employment).

Definitely take proper advice on it, immigration law is something I know little about but I suspect that might be the easiest option for you to prove.

shine · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:39

Was your father British? If so, then that is enough to pass on citizenship but you'll need to prove your father is a British citizen and that he is your father as he is not listed on your Birth certificate.

Burnsy2023 · 12 Feb 2013 at 22:47

semi-pro waster said:
Would you not be able to claim permanent residency via the Immigration (EEA) Regulations 2006? You're an EEA national (German passport holder) and you've been resident within the UK for the past 5+ years exercising treaty rights (student and employment).

Definitely take proper advice on it, immigration law is something I know little about but I suspect that might be the easiest option for you to prove.

I'll take a look at that, thanks mate

Edit: not useful unfortunately as I'm not after residence status, I'm after full blown citizenship.

shine said:
Was your father British? If so, then that is enough to pass on citizenship but you'll need to prove your father is a British citizen and that he is your father as he is not listed on your Birth certificate.

That's a complete no go unfortunately.