Condensation on toilet.

iI remember camping, first thing in the morning you could see how full your gas bottle was because the condensation would only cover the tank up to the level of the internal liquid gas, it's condensation, difference in temperature causes the moisture to accumulate on the surface of the object between the two variances.

Side note-a problem experienced with peltier and phase change unless actively guarded against using such low temps in a warm environment, condensation + pc = boom!
 
i couldnt say, it depends, if the main is at a stable 5c a tank in the loft if its -10c outside could cool a tank in the loft well below 0c.. wouldnt you agree ?

at the same time, the tank could be in the cupboard at 20c with heating on and a badly fitted main could have froze.. 6 & two 3s

yeah insulation to only prevent freezing only ? do they not also preserve heat ? yes they do, obviously people fit it to heating pipework..

underground temps at 5c and a main coming up in an insulated 4 inch pipe will not make it almost freeze..

in 2010 we had temps go down to over -10 but because everythings fitted right, we has no problems with toilets freezing or pipes..


im unsure what you're trying to argue against
 
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Mickie said:
i couldnt say, it depends, if the main is at a stable 5c a tank in the loft if its -10c outside could cool a tank in the loft well below 0c.. wouldnt you agree ?
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No.

Mickie said:
at the same time, the tank could be in the cupboard at 20c with heating on and a badly fitted main could have froze.. 6 & two 3s
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Heat rises anyway, attics are warm, and your pipes are much more likely to freeze than a large body of water; ie tank.

Mickie said:
yeah insulation to only prevent freezing only ? do they not also preserve heat ? yes they do, obviously people fit it to heating pipework..
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Except we aren't talking about heating pipework are we?

Mickie said:
underground temps at 5c and a main coming up in an insulated 4 inch pipe will not make it almost freeze..
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No one has said this.

Mickie said:
in 2010 we had temps go down to over -10 but because everythings fitted right, we has no problems with toilets freezing or pipes..
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It hit -8 deg c here the other month there, and nope no frozen toilets or pipes either :confused:


Mickie said:
im unsure what you're trying to argue against
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Quite.
 
i cant be bothered to talk to you about it anymore, are you even a plumber? you just want to argue for arguments sake.. you wont agree with anything i have to say and some of the things you come out with are probably straight off the net or idiotic logic..


attics dont get cold ? are you joking. i'd love to know why i get called out to burst pipes in attics every winter.. you're just trying to wind me up now..
 
Mickie said:
i cant be bothered to talk to you about it anymore, are you even a plumber? you just want to argue for arguments sake.. you wont agree with anything i have to say and some of the things you come out with are probably straight off the net or idiotic logic..
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No I'm not a plumber but I done all my own plumbing if that's any good?

Ok, thank you for that anyway.


Mickie said:
attics dont get cold ? are you joking. i'd love to know why i get called out to burst pipes in attics every winter.. you're just trying to wind me up now..
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It depends on the heating and loft insulation, but most of the ones I'm in are warm. They can get cold, but not to the point of freezing large bodies of water which was your point (I think). Freeze static low volume pipework? Sure thing.

But that wasn't what you are saying.

I don't believe for a second that rising damp is going to creep up one part of the wall and that alone and then travel around the cistern to then drop to the floor.

The OP has only mentioned the cistern, this is inline with how the principles of physics works, I'm sure if ninja damp was attacking his toilet it would be more than evident by the time it's dripping off onto the floor.. no?
 
Kanifee said:
Why wouldn't attics get cold, they are insulated from all other heat sources and have no heat source of there own!

I have had a tank pop its feed from freezing lol.
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Sure they can get cold and things can freeze, just so happens most of the ones I'm ever in aren't freezing! It depends on the inhabitant's habits and the insulation etc.

Did that tank rupture?
 
dampness in walls is a massive cause of a lot of condensation in a room/home..

which then clings to toilets.. whats not to get ? you guys have no weight behind you having little to no experience. their is no getting around what im saying, its fact, it does happen..

to argue other wise is stupid.. all im saying is it could be a factor..

dont read the internets and believe it could only be the answer you've found, it makes you look like a **** end
 
Biohazard said:
ninja damp
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I do like that.

It is condensation, there would be other signs of rising damp. The toilet is the most regularly used water source in a family house, its constant supply of water ensures the cistern is full of nice fresh cool water sitting in a cozy warm house repelling the winter cold, its as simple of as that.

And yes i pee a lot! :D

Still the loft is a frosty place none the less, unless you have insulation crapper than the council install :D

EDIT
Im not saying it can't be rising damp just that if the poster is as anal to notice damp on his cistern he would have noticed other factor too, im not discounting your theory just that it is harder to diagnose given no other symptoms of damp/water pooling.

Double edit.
im watching house explaining diagnose and symptoms :D
 
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Biohazard said:
Sure they can get cold and things can freeze, just so happens most of the ones I'm ever in aren't freezing! It depends on the inhabitant's habits and the insulation etc.

Did that tank rupture?
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dont change your mind, admit you were wrong. be a man..

lofts are rarely warm in winter, due to insulation, ventilation and their not being a radiator up there.. and we arent talking conversions..

**** agree or get out
 
Mickie said:
dont change your mind, admit you were wrong. be a man..

lofts are rarely warm in winter, due to insulation, ventilation and their not being a radiator up there.. and we arent talking conversions..

**** agree or get out
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I've not changed my mind at all? :confused:

I've not discounted tanks freezing, it's just pretty rare in comparison to pipework.

Loft temperatures will vary, some will be cold others bloody cold. That's much more likely to be heating than anything else, you will not eliminate all thermal losses through insulation and all heat sources will contribute to raising your roof space. How long is a piece of string, but no I don't agree that;

i couldnt say, it depends, if the main is at a stable 5c a tank in the loft if its -10c outside could cool a tank in the loft well below 0c.. wouldnt you agree ?
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Firstly, if it's minus ten water supply is going to be lower than plus five. Secondly this sort of hypothetical is useless, can't say anything about the gains and losses of the roofspace.

This is a massive dribble of pish, right through the night, about ninja damp and you trying to refute pretty simple laws of science.
 
do i need to explain again ? if its -10 outside the water supply will still be around 5c because frost does not ingress below 2.5 foot under ground..2.5 foot where all cold mains are fitted.. just to stop you looking that up on the internet..

ive already told you this, now you're saying it can.. what planet are you on? obviously not earth..

i did a bloody job last week ffs where he had bad rising damp, their was that much moisture in the room it was dripping off his cold toilet..


the less moisture in the room, the less can cling to a toilet and if their is hardly any or non at all their wont be any moisture on the toilet at all...
 
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If it's minus ten outside the input - reservoirs and lochs - are going to be colder than plus 5. More like hovering over freezing at best. It doesn't matter about the frost yet, by the time it gets to your house it's not going to have warmed much to say the least.

I don't believe for a second that the water system, largely still victorian here at least, is laid to the depth of 2.5 feet for it's entirety. I'm not sure, but I don't think that would logically make sense. Perhaps in cityscape, yes, I won't check the internet no but I may ask my civil engineer friend the next time I see him.

I'm not sure what you're saying I'm now saying that was different from before, perhaps you may like to read my posts again.

I've no doubt it could be caused by rising damp in some situations, I don't think it is in this case unless it's ninja damp. Very unfortunate and rare that would be too. If the room is tiled wall to wall damp through the walls is going to be rare. In a partially tiled room, it's going to become pretty bloody evident quickly.

Mickie said:
the less moisture in the room, the less can cling to a toilet and if their is hardly any or non at all their wont be any moisture on the toilet at all...
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This is interesting though, it's almost as if you acknowledge athmospheric condensation on cold surfaces... [trollface.jpg?]

You don't need a damp problem to have a moist atmosphere, hell having a shower cooking or people over can sort that out very easily.

You spam for nothing my friend.
 
I get this on my toilet cistern, I also get condensation forming on the kitchen tap, it's pretty normal, I don't have a damp problem (new build) and I've seen it elsewhere too (work)

Just cold incoming mains causing condensate to form on the surface.
 
Mickie said:
Ok, cooled, not super cooled, thanks Mr pedantic. and what makes you think i have no idea..
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Because you used it twice to describe a completely different phenomenon to what it actually means, its not being pedantic, it's making sure that one doesn't use terms in a grossly inappropriate way.

OP has a damp problem, as in there is moisture condensing that isn't wanted. It is not rising damp. This is simply caused because the cistern is cold when the water gets replaced. You cannot get rising damp on a cistern. By it's very nature they are built to be water impermeable and thus rising damp cannot traverse the cistern even if it's touching a wall that has rising damp. Rising damp requires water permeable objects in which it can travel in, such as wood, brick, mortar etc (This is why often you see a layer of plastic sheet in the brick work of a house about a foot above above the ground level as it acts as in impermeable membrane to block rising damp).

Assuming OP's toilet is upstairs, you're saying that he's got rising damp, to the extent that it is traveling up the entire ground floor wall and into the 1st floor, where it magically travels through an impermeable object to then present itself on the outside of the entire cistern? and he's somehow just ignoring the rising damp downstairs?
 
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