COVID-19 (Coronavirus) discussion

brightside229 said:
You cant really say if the covid the vaccine helped you get over covid quicker or not.
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This is part of what vaccines do unless you want to argue against every vaccine.
It's unbelievable how people remove their brains over this one vaccine.

I have my own statistic that me and my mates/family who had jabs got over Covid better than those that didn't have the jab.
 
SexyGreyFox said:
This is part of what vaccines do unless you want to argue against every vaccine.
It's unbelievable how people remove their brains over this one vaccine.

I have my own statistic that me and my mates/family who had jabs got over Covid better than those that didn't have the jab.
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I am not completely stupid, i know the jab is meant to help you recover faster.

But the fact remains after you had the jab you have no way to know how you would have actually recovered having not had it. And if you are one of the people that would have recovered just find within a day or two and you had taken the vaccine you would be telling everyone how amazing the jab was because it was all the jabs amazing work that made you recover so fast, despite the fact you would have recovered just as well without it.
 
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brightside229 said:
I am not completely stupid, i know the jab is meant to help you recover faster.

But the fact remains after you had the jab you have no way to know how you would have actually recovered having not had it. And if you are one of the people that would have recovered just find within a day or two and you had taken the vaccine you would be telling everyone how amazing the jab was because it was all the jabs amazing work that made you recover so fast, despite the fact you would have recovered just as well without it.
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i think of the vaccine like I do an airbag or a seatbelt.

i am unfortunately old enough to remember when seatbelts became law and i also remember my gran flatly refusing to wear one suggesting that it could cause more injuries than it stopped.

now it is true it is possible that you can get injuries from a seatbelt and equally i dare say its statistically likely that there are some accidents where a person may have survived where a belt actually did more harm than good (it is certainly the case with airbags and is why small kids especially should not be in front of one).

but OTOH it is without a doubt equally 100% certain that seatbelts save way more lives than they cost........... (as do airbags).

but in any 1 single accident you would be hard pressed to prove beyond doubt that a belt or bag specifically saved a life.............. but with statistics in the millions it is obvious.

damn...... now i have that 1980s or 1990s advert with that woman driving a car with her kids and that pizza one stuck in my head. (like most people ...... knew her killer!)
 
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brightside229 said:
I am not completely stupid, i know the jab is meant to help you recover faster.

But the fact remains after you had the jab you have no way to know how you would have actually recovered having not had it. And if you are one of the people that would have recovered just find within a day or two and you had taken the vaccine you would be telling everyone how amazing the jab was because it was all the jabs amazing work that made you recover so fast, despite the fact you would have recovered just as well without it.
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I work in a hospital and was in the firing line of an Admin role during those early days of Covid pre vaccination.
I can't count the amount of fit people who died with Post Mortems landing on my desk, I even had two friends who spent all their days at the gym who died with it.
Yes there were a lot of unfit people who died pre vaccination also, in fact it was like Covid didn't care who it killed.
After the jab I didn't hear of one friend who had died or who had become seriously ill but yes both jabbed and unjabbed were dying still.
One of the saddest parts of my job and still happens, I have to send out Solicitors to witness Wills of patients dying with Covid who are unjabbed while the relatives are crying in the background "Why didn't he/she have a jab?" or words to that effect.
 
brightside229 said:
I am not completely stupid, i know the jab is meant to help you recover faster.

But the fact remains after you had the jab you have no way to know how you would have actually recovered having not had it. And if you are one of the people that would have recovered just find within a day or two and you had taken the vaccine you would be telling everyone how amazing the jab was because it was all the jabs amazing work that made you recover so fast, despite the fact you would have recovered just as well without it.
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so all in, it's better to have the jab and be on the safe side? :)
 
mk1_salami said:
See that's the issue isn't it. You're 100% sure of something, with nothing but a "feeling" based on your hopes and beliefs.
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Not exactly, I had a meeting with NHS Occupational Health and Clinical Staff who warned me that without protection (PPE at the time) that I was seriously at risk, that isn't a feeling, that's professionals telling me it was paramount to do everything I could not to catch it or I could be in serious trouble.
Personally I'd rather listen to them than you and your conspiracy theorist pals.
 
tonys said:
Everything has risks attatched, why single out just one vaccine?


Yes I know it's the covid thread before you start.
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Because this one vaccine, which we were told was 100% safe and effective has proven to be neither, while also making people seriously ill and or killing people. More so than every other vaccine combined in the last 20 years (VAERS reported data).
 
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mk1_salami said:
Because this one vaccine, which we were told was 100% safe and effective has proven to be neither, while also making people seriously ill and or killing people. More so than every other vaccine combined in the last 20 years (VAERS reported data).
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Nothing is 100% safe we should all know that. There are always risks that have to be assessed when there is a threat of any sort. Do you think we get the side affect statistics of drugs and vaccines from the initial development of them or from the mass usage and then reporting of the issues found?
 
mk1_salami said:
Because this one vaccine, which we were told was 100% safe and effective
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Again I'll ask you for a link to proper professionals who claimed it was 100% safe and effective, I'm not talking about Johnson and the media.
You probably won't reply like you haven't with a link providing evidence that the vaxx wouldn't give you tinnitus.
 
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I'll tell you what... Please visit the VAERS site and use their CDC Wonder query tool.

Select 2022. And run a query on all adverse reactions for Flu shots vs Covid shots. Come back and tell me these covid shots are anywhere near safe.

To save you the trouble I just did it, but please verify (I bet you won't).

- In 2022 in the USA, there were 145 million Covid Shots administered, with 211,116 reported adverse reactions (0.14559% reaction rate)
- In 2022 in the USA, there were 157.72 million Flu Shots administered, with 9,312 reported adverse reactions (0.00590% reaction rate)

So, you're 24.6 times more likely to suffer an adverse reaction to a Covid shot as a Flu shot. Extrapolate that percentage to the UK population, and you have just under 100,000 people who suffered as a direct result of taking a shot. Please remember these are only reported issues. How many more went unreported? This is speculative, but I'd guess 2-3x more?

Please look and use the tool. And come back here and tell me they're safe, or even in the same ballpark as other more traditional vaccines.


Once you've done that (which you won't), we can both conclude these shots are NOT SAFE and NOT EFFECTIVE, and we can stop arguing. You could argue they're comparatively safe, as opposed to playing Russian roulette and I'd agree with you. But compared to traditional vaccines, they're on a different level of danger.

This isn't my opinion. It's not my made-up stats. It's not a link to a wacky article. It's hard data which is free for everyone to use.

If you can honestly look at that this, and know what you know now about the vaccine efficacy (it's garbage) and still argue the point, you're a lost, brainwashed cause.
 
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mk1_salami said:
I'll tell you what... Please visit the VAERS site and use their CDC Wonder query tool.

Select 2022. And run a query on all adverse reactions for Flu shots vs Covid shots. Come back and tell me these covid shots are anywhere near safe.
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I don't need to, I KNOW that Covid jabs or any vaccine aren't 100% safe and effective.
I ALREADY KNOW THIS, I've been having vaccines for 66 years.
For some reason people like you throw out your brain and think people like me think they are 100% safe and effective, they aren't.
You then claim the makers of the Covid vaccine is 100% safe against tinnitus :)
 
mk1_salami said:
I'll tell you what... Please visit the VAERS site and use their CDC Wonder query tool.

Select 2022. And run a query on all adverse reactions for Flu shots vs Covid shots. Come back and tell me these covid shots are anywhere near safe.

To save you the trouble I just did it, but please verify (I bet you won't).

- In 2022 in the USA, there were 145 million Covid Shots administered, with 211,116 reported adverse reactions (0.14559% reaction rate)
- In 2022 in the USA, there were 157.72 million Flu Shots administered, with 9,312 reported adverse reactions (0.00590% reaction rate)

So, you're 24.6 times more likely to suffer an adverse reaction to a Covid shot as a Flu shot. Extrapolate that percentage to the UK population, and you have just under 100,000 people who suffered as a direct result of taking a shot. Please remember these are only reported issues. How many more went unreported? This is speculative, but I'd guess 2-3x more?

Please look and use the tool. And come back here and tell me they're safe, or even in the same ballpark as other more traditional vaccines.


Once you've done that (which you won't), we can both conclude these shots are NOT SAFE and NOT EFFECTIVE, and we can stop arguing. You could argue they're comparatively safe, as opposed to playing Russian roulette and I'd agree with you. But compared to traditional vaccines, they're on a different level of danger.

This isn't my opinion. It's not my made-up stats. It's not a link to a wacky article. It's hard data which is free for everyone to use.

If you can honestly look at that this, and know what you know now about the vaccine efficacy (it's garbage) and still argue the point, you're a lost, brainwashed cause.
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From their own website
'While very important in monitoring vaccine safety, VAERS reports alone cannot be used to determine if a vaccine caused or contributed to an adverse event or illness.'

Statistics can only go so far in showing you the data. Pick the wrong data and you're screwed.

Probably more people reported on covid than they did Flu, just because it was so new and fear inducing than regular old Flu
 
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SexyGreyFox said:
I don't need to, I KNOW that Covid jabs or any vaccine aren't 100% safe and effective.
I ALREADY KNOW THIS, I've been having vaccines for 66 years.
For some reason people like you throw out your brain and think people like me think they are 100% safe and effective, they aren't.
You then claim the makers of the Covid vaccine is 100% safe against tinnitus :)
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So you already knew it's 24 times more dangerous than Flu shots, yet still defend it despite its lack of efficacy. It beggars belief.
 
SexyGreyFox said:
Again I'll ask you for a link to proper professionals who claimed it was 100% safe and effective, I'm not talking about Johnson and the media.
You probably won't reply like you haven't with a link providing evidence that the vaxx wouldn't give you tinnitus.
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Dr Sara Kayat, practising GP, degrees in Medicine and Physiology:

"...after 12 days from the first vaccination of the AstraZeneca vaccine, you are 100% effective against hospitalisation and death..."

This was broadcast on This Morning to an audience of around 1.6 million people.

Oh hang on, she's the wrong type of "proper professional", isn't she?

How about straight from the manufacturer of the vaccine, surely they wouldn't make such a claim, would they?

Oh...https://www.astrazeneca.com/media-c...he-primary-analysis-of-phase-iii-trials.html#
 
mk1_salami said:
I'll tell you what... Please visit the VAERS site and use their CDC Wonder query tool.

Select 2022. And run a query on all adverse reactions for Flu shots vs Covid shots. Come back and tell me these covid shots are anywhere near safe.

To save you the trouble I just did it, but please verify (I bet you won't).

- In 2022 in the USA, there were 145 million Covid Shots administered, with 211,116 reported adverse reactions (0.14559% reaction rate)
- In 2022 in the USA, there were 157.72 million Flu Shots administered, with 9,312 reported adverse reactions (0.00590% reaction rate)

So, you're 24.6 times more likely to suffer an adverse reaction to a Covid shot as a Flu shot. Extrapolate that percentage to the UK population, and you have just under 100,000 people who suffered as a direct result of taking a shot. Please remember these are only reported issues. How many more went unreported? This is speculative, but I'd guess 2-3x more?

Please look and use the tool. And come back here and tell me they're safe, or even in the same ballpark as other more traditional vaccines.


Once you've done that (which you won't), we can both conclude these shots are NOT SAFE and NOT EFFECTIVE, and we can stop arguing. You could argue they're comparatively safe, as opposed to playing Russian roulette and I'd agree with you. But compared to traditional vaccines, they're on a different level of danger.

This isn't my opinion. It's not my made-up stats. It's not a link to a wacky article. It's hard data which is free for everyone to use.

If you can honestly look at that this, and know what you know now about the vaccine efficacy (it's garbage) and still argue the point, you're a lost, brainwashed cause.
Click to expand...
An adverse reaction for most people is a sore arm or perhaps at most a fever that lasts a day two with a slight headache and some fatigue.

Yes, going by my own anecdotal experience the above is significantly more likely to happen with a COVID vaccine than with one for flu, but that doesn't mean it's unsafe. Do you think the above side effects make it unsafe? Common sense says no.

You also have to weigh that against the much worse potential effects and complications from actually getting COVID versus flu and that such disabling or even fatal complications are orders of magnitude more likely from getting the virus than from having a vaccine.

Lastly the pandemic would have been much worse without the vaccines, they prevented many deaths and disabilities and they truly saved our bacon (unlike the often useless politicians like Johnson and Trump who are the real villains).
 
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