CPU Upgrade for gaming

[steveinhants]

Hello,
A few weeks ago I started out by looking at upgrading my GPU....that went ahead with a PSU upgrade and now I'm being quite limited by my CPU. It's an AMD Ryzen 9 3900 Twelve Core 4.2GHz
I'm now running an RTX 4080 with a 1000W PSU but I'm not sure if it's possible for me to jump to an AMD Ryzen 7950X3d with the following cooler which I have from the original purchase:

Cooler Master MasterLiquid Lite 120 AIO CPU Cooler - 120mm

Many thanks
Steve

 

[PaulM]

What resolution do you game at?

 

[Gray2233]

What resolution do you game at?

A 5800X3D would be the easiest solution for gaming and not require you to change platform, it should be able to pop right into your current motherboard (albeit with a bios update). That said, the fact you appear to be going for higher core processors infers that you might use the system for other workloads?

 

[steveinhants]

What resolution do you game at?

A 5800X3D would be the easiest solution for gaming and not require you to change platform, it should be able to pop right into your current motherboard (albeit with a bios update). That said, the fact you appear to be going for higher core processors infers that you might use the system for other workloads?

I mainly sim on MSFS in VR and use the PC for processing very large photographic images. Both are CPU intensive. The motherboard I have is

Gigabyte X570 AORUS ELITE (AMD AM4) DDR4 X570

 

[Gray2233]

If you're into MSFS I'm told that it loves the extra cache on the X3D variants.

A 5800X3D might net you huge gains in your sims, but should your work related software have good multicore support (16t +) I'd consider moving to AM5. I wouldn't personally touch the 7900X3D, but the 7950X3D is basically king of the hill if you want the best of both worlds.

 

[steveinhants]

If you're into MSFS I'm told that it loves the extra cache on the X3D variants.

A 5800X3D might net you huge gains in your sims, but should your work related software have good multicore support (16t +) I'd consider moving to AM5. I wouldn't personally touch the 7900X3D, but the 7950X3D is basically king of the hill if you want the best of both worlds.

Ideally I'd like to keep costs down a little. That said, I do want to realise the potential.
If I went for a 7950X3D I'd need a new motherboard wouldn't I? But the 5800X3D can go straight in you think?

 

[Gray2233]

Ideally I'd like to keep costs down a little. That said, I do want to realise the potential.
If I went for a 7950X3D I'd need a new motherboard wouldn't I? But the 5800X3D can go straight in you think?

New motherboard and RAM, although you could net back some of the costs by selling your old kit.

The 5800X3D would plop right in, just make sure your bios supports it and update if necessary.

I'd also take a look at how hard it will hit your productivity (if at all), but it's by far the easiest solution and would offer massive improvements in MSFS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwOAwmZTRQY

This is a 3700X vs 5800X3D but for MSFS specifically it should give you a good indication of what to expect with the change.

 

[steveinhants]

New motherboard and RAM, although you could net back some of the costs by selling your old kit.

The 5800X3D would plop right in, just make sure your bios supports it and update if necessary.

I'd also take a look at how hard it will hit your productivity (if at all), but it's by far the easiest solution and would offer massive improvements in MSFS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwOAwmZTRQY

This is a 3700X vs 5800X3D but for MSFS specifically it should give you a good indication of what to expect with the change.

Thanks a lot, this is very helpful. Sorry for more questions but what about the 7800X3D?

 

[JollyJamma]

I mainly sim on MSFS in VR and use the PC for processing very large photographic images

Can you make use of Nvidia CUDA cores for the photographic editing?

 

[Gray2233]

Thanks a lot, this is very helpful. Sorry for more questions but what about the 7800X3D?

A great choice, but you would need to update your motherboard/ram to go with.

I imagine it would at least match the 3900X in raw productivity due to IPC uplift.

AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D Review - The Best Gaming CPU

AMD's Ryzen 7 7800X3D is everything that gamers want: eight fast cores, in a single CCD, with 3D VCache stacked on top at a price point of $450. In our review we can confirm that 7800X3D is indeed the fastest gaming CPU available, beating Intel's 13900K and even the 7950X3D.

www.techpowerup.com

Again you should review your image editing requirements before making a decision, the extra cores you have might not do much for you at all and a 5800X3D for £270 without the hassle of a rebuild? I'd say that's a less daunting prospect than switching out half your PC for the region of £600-800+.

 

[steveinhants]

A great choice, but you would need to update your motherboard/ram to go with.

I imagine it would at least match the 3900X in raw productivity due to IPC uplift.

AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D Review - The Best Gaming CPU

AMD's Ryzen 7 7800X3D is everything that gamers want: eight fast cores, in a single CCD, with 3D VCache stacked on top at a price point of $450. In our review we can confirm that 7800X3D is indeed the fastest gaming CPU available, beating Intel's 13900K and even the 7950X3D.

www.techpowerup.com

Again you should review your image editing requirements before making a decision, the extra cores you have might not do much for you at all and a 5800X3D for £270 without the hassle of a rebuild? I'd say that's a less daunting prospect than switching out half your PC for the region of £800-1000.

Thanks again. I only produce images every so often and I think an 8 core CPU would still be fine. PC useage is probably 80/20 for sim/images.

 

[ATIorNvidia]

I think a 5800X3D is the best approach.

 

[Gray2233]

Thanks again. I only produce images every so often and I think an 8 core CPU would still be fine. PC useage is probably 80/20 for sim/images.

It's a very good choice for your uses.

 

[ICDP]

I went from a 5900X to a 7900X3D because I do mainly productivity but do game a lot, so 3D cache was a must. For me my use case is that a lot of apps such as multiple large PSDs in photoshop, a sim I do texture work for, archiving, uploading/downloading, 3D model viewers, web browsers, RDP sessions and more all running concurrently. For gaming the 7800X3D is better value, but I wanted physical cores and didn’t want to go over a budget on the 7950X3D which was £150 more expensive here in the UK.

At 4K with a 4080 the majority of games show zero improvement in average FPS, though MSFS had a big jump from mid 40s at ultra, to mid 50s FPS.

There seems to be a lot of unwarranted hate for the 7900X3D but the 6 3D cores is not a hindrance at all in gaming, where in many cases single thread speed is more important. Hell if AMD were to release a 7600X3D I bet a lot of the negativity for “only 6 3D cores” would go away.

For me the 7900X3D hits the sweet spot in physical cores and cost. But if I was just gaming, I would plonk a 5800X3D into your AM4 board and save a lot of money. Just don’t expect it to be great for reasonably intensive productivity, and I don’t mean MS Office.

 

[JollyJamma]

There seems to be a lot of unwarranted hate for the 7900X3D

I think it was criticised for being expensive and the dual CCD design doesn’t perform well with games.

The 7800X3D has one CCD and so latency between the two cpu chips containing the cores isn’t a factor.

7900X3D is probably the best solution to OPs needs though as you can force the games to use only the one CCD cores and sort of remove the latency between each CCD.

easiest option is the 5800X3D but I think OP wants a major upgrade

Edit: I think OP should go for the 7800X3D over the 7900X3D after reading a couple reviews of the 7900X3D.

The 7900X3D uses two 6 core CCD chips and 8 cores is going to become the go to for gaming in the future since all modern consoles feature 8 cores.

 

[ICDP]

While I agree if you are gaming only the 7800X3D is a better choice. Though the performance of the 7900X3D in gaming is perfectly fine and in fact it is top notch. The issue the reviews have is price, not performance. The idea 8 cores will become the go to is not remotely backed up by facts. In fact most modern games are still GPU bound rather than CPU bound.

For example GN ragged on the 5900X3D, yet their gaming benchmarks showed it to be marginally better than the 7800X3D in CP 2077 in 1% lows. That was the ONLY really graphical intensive game they tested. Please don’t show me some 1080p CSGO or F1 2022 benchmarks as “evidence”.

 

[JollyJamma]

That was the ONLY really graphical intensive game they tested. Please don’t show me some CSGO or F1 2022 benchmarks as “evidence”.

But those games after often used in reviews to show the difference in CPU performance because they put less pressure on the GPU?

Yes, most games are GPU limited but that’s not the point in a CPU review. The point is to show the difference between each CPU, not the difference between each GPU and if you want the best CPU if you’re choosing between 2 products, you want to know the differences in absolute performance.

The performance of the 7900X3D in gaming is perfectly fine and in fact it is top notch.

Nobody is saying it isn’t good, people are saying that it’s expensive for what performance it gives and that the 7800X3D is better as an overall purchase for the money

The idea 8 cores will become the go to is not remotely backed up by facts.

Yes but also game devs tend to code for the most common hardware used by gamers and the PS5 and Xbox both use 8 core processors with 16gigs of RAM so it makes sense that they will write modern code to make use of all those resources.

A lot of games could make good use of the Nvidia 1060 because for a long time, it was the most popular GPU as per the steam survey.

 

[ICDP]

But those games after often used in reviews to show the difference in CPU performance because they put less pressure on the GPU?

This kind of testing has been utterly pointless since forever for those of us who game at higher resolutions and even at lower resolutions it is mostly pointless. The difference between 300 and 320 FPS means nothing for most gamers who run at their monitor refresh rate.

For everyday graphical intensive gaming at 1440p or 4K ultra settings, the difference between a 5800X3D, 7800X3D or a 7900X3D will be unnoticeable to most people. Even older games where all three CPUs will deliver 100+ FPS, the difference is marginal. Where the 7900X3D becomes sensible is for higher end productivity work. If just gaming then a 7800X3D is a cheaper and better choice.

To the OP, your CPU cooler will work fine. I have a Noctua NH-U12S SE on my 7900X3D. It is hardly a top end cooler and works fine. Idle is low to mid 50s gaming is mid 60s celcius. Only things like Cinibench will push to mid 80s.

 

[Drumroll]

The 7800x3D also runs very cool. A Thermalright 35-40 quid cooler can keep it under control and quiet. Much easier to cool than the 3900x.

 

[JollyJamma]

This kind of testing has been utterly pointless since forever for those of us who game at higher resolutions and even at lower resolutions it is mostly pointless. The difference between 300 and 320 FPS means nothing for most gamers who run at their monitor refresh rate.

So reviewers often point out that the point of a review is not to recreate the average gamer experience but to objectively test the product against other products in the same family.

The only way to review something objectively is to remove all possible bottlenecks from the system to isolate just that one product they are reviewing.

For example, if you just put the new product they are testing in a regular chassis instead of on a test bed, you're essentially reviewing that chassis rather than the CPU or GPU itself.

Reviewers will often review products in an open test bed and try to keep the variables the same by making sure that they use the same components as other reviews and with an environment at the same or similar temperature.

They also often point out that they need to isolate the variables to objectively review a product and that people don't understand that about reviews. They do this very often in reviews.

If all you want in a review is to confirm that your choice was the best well then that's not a review, that's just a fun build or a biased review.

Competitive gamers often use ultra high refresh rate monitors and want the highest number of FPS possible in a game. They will also use 1080P over 1440P or 4K because they don't need high res graphics and often run the games at low graphical settings.

If you game at higher resolutions, the choice of CPU is far less important as even an i3 12100 is very close to even a 13700K in a lot of games. It would be pretty pointless for a CPU review if they only used 4K and they concluded that you might as well get an i3 12100 because it's very close to a far more expensive CPU so just get that.

Reviews use a mixture of games and productivity performance metrics to see where the CPU excels objectively and objectively, the 7900X3D isn't the best option.