DELETED_96987

-Ad- · 7 Jul 2011 at 23:28

Just get a Teg.

Faster, better handling and looks better with extra rare factors thrown in for good measure.

And it has bright red recaros and vtec y0 which eclipse the note and seats in the other cars

And comfort us subjective, just thought I'd get that in there

Stormster · 8 Jul 2011 at 00:44

lol

awesome cars but again proper money for a good one.

Focus ST's are great cars. Everything about them is good value, purchase price aint so bad, parts are ok, reliable... and then you go to the petrol station the first time after you've bought it... and then it hits home

Tute · 8 Jul 2011 at 01:28

[TW]Fox;19533460 said:
In reality both are small, cheap hatchbacks and built like small cheap hatchbacks.

None of these cars are well built.

I disagree, as otherwise why recommend the Fiesta (in general, not the ST) as a good "starter" car over the competition?

If someone on here asks for a £1-2K starter car at 21 years old or younger, the Fiesta gets recommended more often than not. Given the criteria, surely this recommendation is based on the fact that it's just a more reliable (hence better built) car than it's competitors?

-Ad- · 8 Jul 2011 at 06:46

Stormster said:
lol awesome cars but again proper money for a good one.

Focus ST's are great cars. Everything about them is good value, purchase price aint so bad, parts are ok, reliable... and then you go to the petrol station the first time after you've bought it... and then it hits home

Not really. S cheap one will still be great and they are pretty bulketproof. Some 100k UK cars ate easily under 3k and high price doesn't mean it's a good example a d will mist likely still need the pushes and suspension doing. Far too many price them on bodywork and mileage when condition is the most important thing.

I would recommend a solid UK or 96spec Jdm for 3.5-4k and spend 1-1.5k on new coilovers and a full rebush with a fast road setup to finish. For that you will have a very special car that still does 32-36mpg when cruising.

Raymond Lin · 8 Jul 2011 at 07:10

Tute said:
I disagree, as otherwise why recommend the Fiesta (in general, not the ST) as a good "starter" car over the competition?

If someone on here asks for a £1-2K starter car at 21 years old or younger, the Fiesta gets recommended more often than not. Given the criteria, surely this recommendation is based on the fact that it's just a more reliable (hence better built) car than it's competitors?

He is clearly drawing the comparison from his 530 and 335.

Joshy · 8 Jul 2011 at 07:15

Tute said:
I disagree, as otherwise why recommend the Fiesta (in general, not the ST) as a good "starter" car over the competition?

If someone on here asks for a £1-2K starter car at 21 years old or younger, the Fiesta gets recommended more often than not. Given the criteria, surely this recommendation is based on the fact that it's just a more reliable (hence better built) car than it's competitors?

Because it is as exactly as Fox just said. Small, cheap hatchbacks and built like small cheap hatchbacks. They're built to a price and to a market where the word luxury doesn't come into play. Yes, some will be better screwed together than other but that alone doesn't make it a luxurious place to be. It will have still been built with the cheap small hatchback market in mind, it would have used all of the materials of a cheap, small hatchback, etc.

Them being popular first cars has absolutely nothing to do with them being better built than the competitors. It'll be because they are cheap to buy and cheap to insure, and nothing much past that.

The pro ST people in this thread are banging on like the Fiesta is generally a nice place to be, but the truth of the matter is that it is not in the grand scheme of things. Its a fiesta.

Johnnytoxic · 8 Jul 2011 at 07:39

Joshy said:
Because it is as exactly as Fox just said. Small, cheap hatchbacks and built like small cheap hatchbacks. They're built to a price and to a market where the word luxury doesn't come into play. Yes, some will be better screwed together than other but that alone doesn't make it a luxurious place to be. It will have still been built with the cheap small hatchback market in mind, it would have used all of the materials of a cheap, small hatchback, etc.

Them being popular first cars has absolutely nothing to do with them being better built than the competitors. It'll be because they are cheap to buy and cheap to insure, and nothing much past that.

The pro ST people in this thread are banging on like the Fiesta is generally a nice place to be, but the truth of the matter is that it is not in the grand scheme of things. Its a fiesta.

Not one person in the thread is thinking there getting Bentley esque interior with a Fiesta.

But your making it sound like theres no difference worth mentioning just because there from the same group of poverty hatchbacks.

Own a clio per se?

Will · 8 Jul 2011 at 07:53

Joshy said:
Because it is as exactly as Fox just said. Small, cheap hatchbacks and built like small cheap hatchbacks. They're built to a price and to a market where the word luxury doesn't come into play. Yes, some will be better screwed together than other but that alone doesn't make it a luxurious place to be. It will have still been built with the cheap small hatchback market in mind, it would have used all of the materials of a cheap, small hatchback, etc.

Them being popular first cars has absolutely nothing to do with them being better built than the competitors. It'll be because they are cheap to buy and cheap to insure, and nothing much past that.

The pro ST people in this thread are banging on like the Fiesta is generally a nice place to be, but the truth of the matter is that it is not in the grand scheme of things. Its a fiesta.

I think you're taking this to extremes now...nobody here thinks its interior is amazing, it ain't no jag, everyone knows this, but its a compromise all round when choosing a car, accepting where the car is worse than its competitors in some ways (speed as standard, handling) but just that little bit better in others (interior, reliability, looks).

How much or how little you value each of these criteria on which you weigh up any given car is a personal view but just because you dislike the inside of a clio and think a fiesta is slightly better doesn't mean you will just think 'sod small hatchbacks let's buy an old jag' because the interior is just one factor you choose a car on. We all know that the st interior is poor in the scheme of things, its just a little less poor than a clio 182. Life isn't spent at ten tenths on your favourite b road...so just occasionally the interior matters, even on a small hatch.

Just because someone wants a hot hatch doesn't mean they are so uncaring about interiors that they are happy to drive a car where the steering wheel melts over time, where they struggle to find a comfortable driving position, and the seats offer no support for a tallish chaps legs (which is what I found with the clio).

[TW]Fox · 8 Jul 2011 at 07:55

Raymond Lin said:
He is clearly drawing the comparison from his 530 and 335.

No, he's drawing comparisons from a Fiesta v a Clio and coming to the conclusion that they are in, the grand in scheme of things, pretty similar really.

dazz25 · 8 Jul 2011 at 08:05

EDIT!

Will · 8 Jul 2011 at 08:18

[TW]Fox;19539140 said:
No, he's drawing comparisons from a Fiesta v a Clio and coming to the conclusion that they are in, the grand in scheme of things, pretty similar really.

Of course you are right but the small differences still matter to a potential owner. If someone said 'id buy a BMW f10 over the equivalent e class partly because the interior is better' everybody would be be fine with it, and yet, in the scheme of things they are pretty similar really (both great places to be).

Yet in this thread it seems in joshys world you're not allowed to use interior as a part of the reason to favour one similar car over another, just because you could buy a vehicle from a completely different class of car with a better interior.

JamesM · 8 Jul 2011 at 09:40

Joshy said:
The pro ST people in this thread are banging on like the Fiesta is generally a nice place to be, but the truth of the matter is that it is not in the grand scheme of things. Its a fiesta.

Not sure which thread your reading but I've not seen a single post which has given me that opinion?

Tute · 8 Jul 2011 at 09:48

Joshy said:
Them being popular first cars has absolutely nothing to do with them being better built than the competitors. It'll be because they are cheap to buy and cheap to insure, and nothing much past that.

Whoa whoa whoa. So why doesn't the Corsa get recommended much? It's cheap to buy and cheap to insure.

The pro ST people in this thread are banging on like the Fiesta is generally a nice place to be, but the truth of the matter is that it is not in the grand scheme of things. Its a fiesta.

It's about perspective. Of course, as you go up the car classes, from small to large hatch, to saloon, to bigger saloon, you're going to gain refinement. But that doesn't mean that, when you buy a small hatch, you should completely ignore build quality totally. After all, having to take a car in for repairs all the time sucks, no matter what it is.

Also, whilst a Fiesta ST is never going to be anything like a 5 or 7 series, I personally think it's still a step above the likes of the Clio. If you want something chuckable and are prepared to live with the niggles, then by all means get the Clio.

Logsi · 8 Jul 2011 at 12:39

I feel it's pretty stupid to compare the interiors and quality of car "in the grand scheme of things".

Of course a car in a different price bracket is going to have a nicer interior. When comparing to similar cars, what everyone should be doing, it's rather nice.

Take the Abarth 500 for example. The interior of that is sublime. But then again, it commands a higher asking price for the trouble. Would you say that's just a Fiat 500?

Stormster · 8 Jul 2011 at 18:21

You get what you pay for. A 6k 08 plate 30,000 mile Fiesta ST is still good value!

How much will a "good quality interior" cost you with the rest of the car around it for comparable age/miles? I've been looking at the ST vs. a MK5 Golf GTI. Ok the Golf is possibly better put together (but the plastics are still naff compared to the MK4 and thats coming from someone who owns a creaky mess! lol)... but you will pay a huge premium to get a newer low mile one. It's all subjective. For a small nippy inbetween "hot" hatch the ST is decent quality for the cash you pay out. The Clio is cheaper to buy anyway and it's quality to the touch isn't as good. But yeah both are cheap cars in terms of build, which is why they are cheap to buy. A Civic Type R is more to buy and no better inside than a Fiesta ST AT ALL. I aren't sure what my point is there but meh

What do you drive Joshy? You must hate small nippy cars so I'm expecting something pretty fancy for your pages of hate here!

[TW]Fox · 8 Jul 2011 at 18:40

Stormster said:
What do you drive Joshy? You must hate small nippy cars so I'm expecting something pretty fancy for your pages of hate here!

He drives a 1991 Toyota Soarer.

Logsi · 8 Jul 2011 at 19:03

ignore...

Overlag · 8 Jul 2011 at 19:32

Joshy said:
The pro ST people in this thread are banging on like the Fiesta is generally a nice place to be, but the truth of the matter is that it is not in the grand scheme of things. Its a fiesta.

Oh, because a clio, corsa or 206 are any better?

[TW]Fox · 8 Jul 2011 at 19:48

Overlag said:
Oh, because a clio, corsa or 206 are any better?

Nobody is saying buy a Clio because the Fiesta is.. a Fiesta. People are saying buy the Clio as its the better hot hatch and the benefits the Fiesta offers over the Clio in other areas are marginal.

I do agree the Fiesta is the better 'car' - if it was Clio 1.2 v Fiesta 1.25 then its Fiesta every time as the Clio isnt able to make up for its shortcomings aginst the Fiesta in other areas.

Joshy · 8 Jul 2011 at 20:00

Stormster said:
What do you drive Joshy? You must hate small nippy cars so I'm expecting something pretty fancy for your pages of hate here!

What does the car that I choose to drive have anything to do with this subject? I could get the bus and still be able to tell you that a small hatchback is going to be built like a small hatchback.

There's no hate to be found in this thread, just confusion and a bit of annoyance that people want to sit here and cast the clio aside for having a bad interior and then put the Fiesta ST on some sort of pedestal for having a better one when in reality the differences are marginal. What is not marginal is the difference in performance and handling, and this is what hot hatches are about, but some people seem to be quick to ignore that in favour of heated bad quality leather seats.

If you want a truly nice place to be on a cold winters morning or to eat up the motorway miles you quite simply don't buy a Ford Fiesta on 17s and sports suspension unless you're a bit odd.