Derek Chauvin murder trial (Police officer who arrested George Floyd)

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Twinz said:
So you think he was telling the truth and had trouble breathing BEFORE anyone did anything to his neck?
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I have no idea, I just know I can restrain a handcuffed man safely without resorting to putting a knee in his neck, never mind being able to do it with 2 mates with me. I also know that if someone says they are having difficulty breathing, I’m calling in a category 1 ambulance.
 
hurfdurf said:
I have no idea, I just know I can restrain a handcuffed man safely without resorting to putting a knee in his neck, never mind being able to do it with 2 mates with me. I also know that if someone says they are having difficulty breathing, I’m calling in a category 1 ambulance.
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I think an argument can be made for negligence regarding the time period after he became unresponsive. However, the knee thing is apparently something the officer was trained to do and, more importantly, does not have the ability effect someone's breathing BEFORE it is used.

I have a hard time taking the people calling for the cop's head seriously when they just ignore relevant information such as this.
 
hurfdurf said:
If someone tells your they can’t breath, and they are in your custody and you have a responsibility for them, do you think restraining them with a knee to the neck and they then die, and you haven’t done basic things to assist them, why do you feel at what point they told you they were having difficulty breathing matters?
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Answer what the forum member asked.
If you can't then don't quote him to score points.
 
iamtheoneneo said:
Just on this point. He DID in fact have Covid on the 3 April and BOTH autopsy's revealed that it was still in his system at the time of death.
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So knowing COVID is a respiratory disease has anyone raised the possibility that this could be a contributing factor as to why he couldn’t breathe?
 
Zatoichi.uK said:
Just wait until you look up the symptoms of a fentanyl overdose...
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Especially when combined with methamphetimine (or any other stimulant). That's a Russian Roulette combo.

But I do think there's a plausible case for negligence on the basis of what was not done, especially after he became non-responsive. Even if he was going to die anyway regardless of what the police did (which was probably true), they should have done better. Maybe they would have done without the onlookers, who the police had to treat as a threat.
 
Angilion said:
Especially when combined with methamphetimine (or any other stimulant). That's a Russian Roulette combo.

But I do think there's a plausible case for negligence on the basis of what was not done, especially after he became non-responsive. Even if he was going to die anyway regardless of what the police did (which was probably true), they should have done better. Maybe they would have done without the onlookers, who the police had to treat as a threat.
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I absolutely agree with that. Its pretty clear to me that Chauvin at the minimum seemed to neglect some kind of duty of care. What his reasons were for keeping him held down for so long after he stopped posing a threat is that part that doesn't sit well with me. Maybe that was part of standard procedure, maybe he was concerned about a 6 foot 200+lb bouncer high on meth becoming a problem at any moment, maybe he was distracted by the growing crowd etc. That's for the court to decide.
 
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Twinz said:
So you think he was telling the truth and had trouble breathing BEFORE anyone did anything to his neck?
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It's so dumb that you think this is a "gotcha".

It's entirely possible for someone to have difficulty breathing and then have it made worse by by someone else then kneeling on their neck.

At best it's negligence that lead to someones death. Had they done their job properly he might have still died, but there's no real way to know that because they didn't do their job properly.
 
Zatoichi.uK said:
I absolutely agree with that. Its pretty clear to me that Chauvin at the minimum seemed to neglect some kind of duty of care. What his reasons were for keeping him held down for so long after he stopped posing a threat is that part that doesn't sit well with me. Maybe that was part of standard procedure, maybe he was concerned about a 6 foot 200+lb bouncer high on meth becoming a problem at any moment, maybe he was distracted by the growing crowd etc. That's for the court to decide.
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He wanted to lye down.
 
Raikiri said:
It's so dumb that you think this is a "gotcha".

It's entirely possible for someone to have difficulty breathing and then have it made worse by by someone else then kneeling on their neck.

At best it's negligence that lead to someones death. Had they done their job properly he might have still died, but there's no real way to know that because they didn't do their job properly.
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At the end of the day.
He should have done what he was told, like most people do.
 
Angilion said:
But I do think there's a plausible case for negligence on the basis of what was not done, especially after he became non-responsive. Even if he was going to die anyway regardless of what the police did (which was probably true), they should have done better. Maybe they would have done without the onlookers, who the police had to treat as a threat.
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4 cops with guns

1 suspect in cuffs

Number 3 does look particularly threatening though...

_117768363_numbers-witnesses.png
 
Derek Chauvin did nothing wrong.

It's an unfortunate incident, it's not the officers fault the guy was drugged up and resisting arrest. If the man being arrested was white, nobody would care.
 
People keep going on about the knee on neck, you know it doesn't take much pressure on your neck at all to hinder your ability to breathe or even talk. GF was happily shouting at the top of his lungs for ages.

If DC did indeed have his knee on GFs neck, and was using all of his body weight, GFs larynx would have been severely compressed completely limiting his ability to talk/shout and likely breathe at all. I think any breathing difficulty he had was not as a result of the restraint and entirely to do with the covid/drugs in his system all of which are known/proven to cause serious respiratory complications. Neither of which the cops would have known about right away. They are also well aware of his prior history and would have made a judgement call about him being truthful or telling lies.
 
MadMossy said:
People keep going on about the knee on neck, you know it doesn't take much pressure on your neck at all to hinder your ability to breathe or even talk. GF was happily shouting at the top of his lungs for ages.

If DC did indeed have his knee on GFs neck, and was using all of his body weight, GFs larynx would have been severely compressed completely limiting his ability to talk/shout and likely breathe at all. I think any breathing difficulty he had was not as a result of the restraint and entirely to do with the covid/drugs in his system all of which are known/proven to cause serious respiratory complications. Neither of which the cops would have known about right away. They are also well aware of his prior history and would have made a judgement call about him being truthful or telling lies.
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And yet 3 medical examiners have said completely the opposite. One even points out that he had drugs in his system but was not what killed him on page 2 :
https://www.mncourts.gov/mncourtsgov/media/High-Profile-Cases/27-CR-20-12646/ExhibitMtD08282020.pdf

This is what the trial will come down to ultimately and whether the defense can put together a narrative that twists the drug angle to something that outright caused GF death over the neck restraint.
 
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