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Discussing GCN Architecture, Performance & The Future

Suarez7 said:
*****

If AMD get Mantle right it could change a few things but on the grand scheme I don't think it will affect nvidia at all, also they are way to stubborn to adopt Mantle as we all know.
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If mantle becomes the main api which is a long way off, Nvidia stubborn or not would have to use it. Even if mantle does not become the main api but becomes really popular with dev's then Nvidia may still be forced to use it to stay competitive if they can get major boosts from it.

If mantle can give close to 30-45% gains on amd hardware with lots of games using it, Nvidia will no longer be the performance leader which in turn will effect there reputation. Atm Nvidia only hold around a 10% lead @ 1080p with the 780ti over the 290x. This seems to get smaller at higher resolution and mantle will wipe that lead out completely with the amd cards being faster in games using it.

There's so many ways the whole mantle thing can play out though but it does look promising for amd. If by some miracle the unreal engine gets mantle then its game on.

Time will tell.
 
It's far too early at the moment to be speculating about Mantle becoming "the main API" (a very loose term anyway), it hasn't even been officially released yet. Let's wait and see what the proper benchmarks from non-interested parties bring.
 
PhysicsMan94 said:
Elaborate :)
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I wasn't suggesting that Nvidia/Intel/Microsoft were in danger of going out of business or anything, just that if AMD's dominoes fall where they have laid them (and it looks like they will) then it will have a number of effects. Namely causing AMD/Nvidia to trade position in the GPU market with Nvidia trailing AMD (for the time being). Cause the stigma of Intel being better for gaming to be shattered and revert it to the old days of when AMD was the gamers CPU choice giving equal/better performance than Intel for less money (the pre Core2 Duo/Quad days). And finally cause Direct3D to lose ground, because if Microsoft try and sabotage Mantle to make it look not as good as Direct3D like the did with OpenGL, then that will benefit Linux/SteamOS/etc (as making D3D look better than something isn't making it better) which would be bad for Windows as a whole, and Microsoft would much prefer people to be using Mantle on Windows than using OpenGL on another O/S.
 
PhysicsMan94 said:
It's far too early at the moment to be speculating about Mantle becoming "the main API" (a very loose term anyway), it hasn't even been officially released yet. Let's wait and see what the proper benchmarks from non-interested parties bring.
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Yep as i said a long way off. Time will tell and there's a lot of cards to still be played by other party's.
 
Again uber, you've got a few delusions of grandeur there lol :D.

Mantles support list is enticing most definitely, but there is no where near enough supported content thus far for anything like that to happen.
 
MjFrosty said:
Again uber, you've got a few delusions of grandeur there lol :D.

Mantles support list is enticing most definitely, but there is no where near enough supported content thus far for anything like that to happen.
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I would say 20 games in development is a decent start but a start is all it is atm. Amd are going in the right direction but need to keep pushing as i think most will remember when ati were the leading vendor for a year or two. Nvidia fought back in some style to become dominant again.
 
ubersonic said:
I wasn't suggesting that Nvidia/Intel/Microsoft were in danger of going out of business or anything, just that if AMD's dominoes fall where they have laid them (and it looks like they will) then it will have a number of effects. Namely causing AMD/Nvidia to trade position in the GPU market with Nvidia trailing AMD (for the time being). Cause the stigma of Intel being better for gaming to be shattered and revert it to the old days of when AMD was the gamers CPU choice giving equal/better performance than Intel for less money (the pre Core2 Duo/Quad days). And finally cause Direct3D to lose ground, because if Microsoft try and sabotage Mantle to make it look not as good as Direct3D like the did with OpenGL, then that will benefit Linux/SteamOS/etc (as making D3D look better than something isn't making it better) which would be bad for Windows as a whole, and Microsoft would much prefer people to be using Mantle on Windows than using OpenGL on another O/S.
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There are a lot of "ifs" and "buts" there though and I think it's pretty pointless to try to predict the outcomes of such a sensitive market with only very few bits of information. Sure, AMD will be in a good position if Mantle does well - but to say that it will place AMD in front of Nvidia in the graphics card industry is going a bit too far, in my opinion. Remember that Nvidia are still around 3 times as large as AMD in terms of Market Cap, it will be a long time (if ever) before Nvidia are surpassed by AMD.

Intel are in a good position at the moment with their CPUs and it is generally established that their processors are better than AMD's on the whole. And we have the fact that AMD have ended their line of FX CPU's for now and are concentrating on APUs, the latter is not what gamers will be buying for their computers; we will have a dedicated GPU along with a CPU as always, so naturally many people will stick with Intel - along with others migrating from AMD to Intel because of this.

So, all in all, I think that this whole Mantle "thing" is being blown a bit out of proportion. I suspect that it will not be as good as it's being hyped up to be, and to be quite frank this is AMD and I generally don't trust them.
 
Rroff said:
You mean the same guy who is behind one of the most broken high profile game releases in recent history? :D not sure I'd take him very seriously.
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Is BF4 still messed up for you Roff? i have not had a problem with BF4 in months.
Perhaps its your GPU?

Originally Posted by AMD

I’m hoping there’ll be news of Nvidia embracing the technology,
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Maybe that will fix it? :p
 
humbug said:
I'm predicting Tuesday the 28'th Jan :)
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Its looking the likely date.

PhysicsMan94 said:
... *2020 arrives... "honestly guys, it's coming soon"* ... :p
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Lol.

I can just see myself now making a prediction in 2019 with my walking stick that its coming any day now. Only to drop dead just before the patch goes live 2020. My soul would then be stuck in an API purgatory.
 
Mantle was announced 25/26 Sept 2013

Todays date is 20 Jan 2014

Is there any chance of no more separate threads for Mantle until it finally shows up and we can talk about it with first hand experience.
 
Kaapstad said:
Mantle was announced 25/26 Sept 2013

Todays date is 20 Jan 2014

Is there any chance of no more separate threads for Mantle until it finally shows up and we can talk about it with first hand experience.
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There's only one active Mantle thread on the last 10 pages of the gpu section Kaaperz. But now you've said this i want to start a new one, damn you!
 
LtMatt said:
There's only one active Mantle thread on the last 10 pages of the gpu section Kaaperz. But now you've said this i want to start a new one, damn you!
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I think where it does get here it needs a new thread, half of the other one is off topic.
 
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