Do you ever feel your kids rule you?
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You mentioned above "What is the 5 minute fix"
You are looking at it totally the wrong way, there is no 5 minute fix for a child that is in a rut of of unhappy behavior. You need to setup a household where it is clear she can be on the outside or the inside of the fun and then let her choose.
The bottom line is you need to admit your child probably isn't actually very happy. The pair of you need to get her out of the house, go for a walk and while outdoors speak to her one to one. Ask her if she wants to keep going the way things are or if she would like a fresh start where she has to follow some rules but Mum and Dad won't constantly be on her back. Ask her if she is happy, if anything is worrying her etc.
Give her the opportunity to change (grow up), give her the option of a better relationship but also ensure she knows these rules are coming and there will be consequences if she wants to take the other path. She must know it's always her choices that will cause the consequences. You are making a pact with each other to make life more happy.
This talk needs to be a defining moment, one she remembers clearly and which you can recall when she steps out of line.
"Remember when I told you it was your choice?" "We love you, but we explained what would happen, this can all stop but it's up to you"
Always deliver this calmly, bite your lip, stick to the script. Kids will look for the chink in your armor, don't give her any room for debate. You are a wall of solid love and you are doing what is right.
If you are lucky it might take a couple of weeks for her to respect you again, might be a couple of months. But asking how to debate a 9 year old with a 5 minute fix tells me you haven't been looking at the big picture for some time.
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Soldato
Not wanting to be harsh but this.
You may have had an overly tough upbringing yourself but then going too far the other way means you deal with issues like this.
Our lad is 7, little girl 5 and we've always had firm rules from day one and apart from the odd meltdown which, let's face it, is inevitable with children, we have no real issues.
No iPad on school mornings, no playstation at all during the week, no devices after 630pm and bedtime starts at 7 (unless it's a special occasion) no devices at the dinner table, no devices in the car etc etc. We ensure we go out for walks with the dog as a family, that we have board game nights and other social time away from devices. We rarely if ever have to enforce any of the above now as it is quite clearly understood.
Basically as Dis said, set some rules and stick to them or it will be forever a chore rather than a pleasure.
This guy gets it and I imagine your children are content.
Soldato
@phrases what age are you, and what age is your wife? What are your working hours and does your wife work?
Caporegime
My daughter is 11 and is in bed by 9pm. Only aloud to stay up late on holidays and weekends now but must be in bed before us regardless. She has xbox one and smart tv in her room but knows when she can play and cannot. Her homework and piano must be complete before she even contemplates anything electronic.
Last weekend gone we had dinner outside in the garden and played UNO for hours. Its about you balancing what your child needs as it so easy for them to just go to the electronic stuff.
A lot of people on here are also missing the point. Disabling internet isn't going to solve anything as your child will just find something else to do. You need to find a way to enable your family as a whole to spend time together.
Simple things that are often forgotten like taking dogs for walks, sitting down and eating dinner together etc.
Last weekend gone we had dinner outside in the garden and played UNO for hours. Its about you balancing what your child needs as it so easy for them to just go to the electronic stuff.
A lot of people on here are also missing the point. Disabling internet isn't going to solve anything as your child will just find something else to do. You need to find a way to enable your family as a whole to spend time together.
Simple things that are often forgotten like taking dogs for walks, sitting down and eating dinner together etc.
This I can attest to.Don't worry it going to get far worst when she hits her teen years
One thing i'd say is that IME consistency is one of the corner stones of what you need to do.
Whatever actions you take, apply them all the time, every time. e.g. if the punishment for something is taking away a tablet, you can't ever let it ride because it suits you, you're busy on the phone and she's bothering you or whatever.
It's going to be tough, don't think otherwise and doubt yourself when it does get hard, you'll all be happier in the end though.
We're lucky in that our daughter is fairly relaxed and naturally doesn't like upsetting people, but we've had our moments too. She's 8 now though and our house is generally quite a calm place, my sisters on the other hand is chaos, both her kids were indulged (spoilt in my eyes) to the point i actually once saw my niece get her own way by slapping my sister in the face to get her attention, but because it was easier to let it go in the moment, my sister did.
The end result though is that almost every time you meet them at the school gates, dancing lessons, etc someone has been crying (kids) or the adults are steaming angry because everything becomes difficult and a battle of wills.
Whatever actions you take, apply them all the time, every time. e.g. if the punishment for something is taking away a tablet, you can't ever let it ride because it suits you, you're busy on the phone and she's bothering you or whatever.
It's going to be tough, don't think otherwise and doubt yourself when it does get hard, you'll all be happier in the end though.
We're lucky in that our daughter is fairly relaxed and naturally doesn't like upsetting people, but we've had our moments too. She's 8 now though and our house is generally quite a calm place, my sisters on the other hand is chaos, both her kids were indulged (spoilt in my eyes) to the point i actually once saw my niece get her own way by slapping my sister in the face to get her attention, but because it was easier to let it go in the moment, my sister did.
The end result though is that almost every time you meet them at the school gates, dancing lessons, etc someone has been crying (kids) or the adults are steaming angry because everything becomes difficult and a battle of wills.
Cheers for your thoughts guys.
Going to have a sit down with the wife tonight plan some time out of the house together as a family as its not often we all get to do something together my wife mainly does the running around as i tend to do overtime and honestly its probably an escape more so than the money is needed.
Don't get me wrong here she isn't a bad kid she knows when enough is enough but every now and then her behaviour takes a turn and it can be a bumpy couple of days to get her back on track, especially this school holiday things have run to the way side as i've barely seen them this week.
Thinking about taking a cut in my hours too as its a constant niggle in the back of my mind and i know i am not home as much as i should be, My wife is beat most days from work and i don't credit her enough for having to deal with things whilst i am not around.
We are currently saving for a trip to florida next year its almost paid for so that is something we are all looking forward to and the downtime away from the house will be a good change.
Going to have a sit down with the wife tonight plan some time out of the house together as a family as its not often we all get to do something together my wife mainly does the running around as i tend to do overtime and honestly its probably an escape more so than the money is needed.
Don't get me wrong here she isn't a bad kid she knows when enough is enough but every now and then her behaviour takes a turn and it can be a bumpy couple of days to get her back on track, especially this school holiday things have run to the way side as i've barely seen them this week.
Thinking about taking a cut in my hours too as its a constant niggle in the back of my mind and i know i am not home as much as i should be, My wife is beat most days from work and i don't credit her enough for having to deal with things whilst i am not around.
We are currently saving for a trip to florida next year its almost paid for so that is something we are all looking forward to and the downtime away from the house will be a good change.
Soldato
Sounds like a hellish situation OP, but sadly, one of your (and your wife's) own creation.
Not a parent yet, I'm probably not a great source of advice - but seeing how friends deal with situations like yours, it is all about common sense, planning, and no deviation - she's a child, and should not have the mindset you have outlined in post #1.
First and foremost - both parents must be signing from the same hymn sheet, if you are weak, your daughter will (and sounds like she is) use that against you. You both need to have a serious chat, and agree how you are to deal with her unruly ways. Moreso, as your work clearly means that your wife is going to be the main driving force of change.
Off the back of this, you should introduce punishment for not doing what she is told, and especially answering back - take away all access to electronic devices, and stop the TV from being able to access Youtube. Being in the modern world, you have a great rewards system you can implement - not the sticky starts on a chart from the 80s - you can rewards her with internet access! Draw up a chore list, get her doing housework, helping out around the house, keeping her room clean, doing homework etc - when she does these things, rewards her. When she doesn't, then punish her.
One would hope that a ~9 year old doesn't have a smartphone, but I know some parents do dish these things out to their kids - so again, you have something that can be used to reward or punish her. If you've not given her a phone, then you can structure something so that she can keep to 'being good' until the day she gets a phone - maybe keep a diary or something, outlining her behavior; with a view of her getting a phone when she is 12/13.
As for the whole answering back - I would say that she clearly has no respect for you, as she knows you are weak. Regardless of how funny/valid her argument may be, your job is to hide that fact, put on a poker face, and still get her to do what you tell her to. I appreciate you don't want her to have a harsh rule-filled upbringing you had, but the alternative, is her to end up a disrespectful, egotistical and needy adult - much like some of the 'influencers' who are online these days!
If you are truly worried about locking her into stringent rules - you can still give her choices, but have those within your own rules. Let's say she asks for a cat, you don't want the cat in her bedroom, so she answers back and argues - you give her the choice; either she has a cat that does not go in her room/upstairs, or no cat. Same goes for tech - she either uses it at the times you say, or she doesn't get to use it at all.
As I say though - I have no experience whatsoever in these matters, but I do pay attention to how people deal with their kids these days, as I am hoping to start a family soon - so will have a read of the posts after the OP.
Best of luck though!
Not a parent yet, I'm probably not a great source of advice - but seeing how friends deal with situations like yours, it is all about common sense, planning, and no deviation - she's a child, and should not have the mindset you have outlined in post #1.
First and foremost - both parents must be signing from the same hymn sheet, if you are weak, your daughter will (and sounds like she is) use that against you. You both need to have a serious chat, and agree how you are to deal with her unruly ways. Moreso, as your work clearly means that your wife is going to be the main driving force of change.
Off the back of this, you should introduce punishment for not doing what she is told, and especially answering back - take away all access to electronic devices, and stop the TV from being able to access Youtube. Being in the modern world, you have a great rewards system you can implement - not the sticky starts on a chart from the 80s - you can rewards her with internet access! Draw up a chore list, get her doing housework, helping out around the house, keeping her room clean, doing homework etc - when she does these things, rewards her. When she doesn't, then punish her.
One would hope that a ~9 year old doesn't have a smartphone, but I know some parents do dish these things out to their kids - so again, you have something that can be used to reward or punish her. If you've not given her a phone, then you can structure something so that she can keep to 'being good' until the day she gets a phone - maybe keep a diary or something, outlining her behavior; with a view of her getting a phone when she is 12/13.
As for the whole answering back - I would say that she clearly has no respect for you, as she knows you are weak. Regardless of how funny/valid her argument may be, your job is to hide that fact, put on a poker face, and still get her to do what you tell her to. I appreciate you don't want her to have a harsh rule-filled upbringing you had, but the alternative, is her to end up a disrespectful, egotistical and needy adult - much like some of the 'influencers' who are online these days!
If you are truly worried about locking her into stringent rules - you can still give her choices, but have those within your own rules. Let's say she asks for a cat, you don't want the cat in her bedroom, so she answers back and argues - you give her the choice; either she has a cat that does not go in her room/upstairs, or no cat. Same goes for tech - she either uses it at the times you say, or she doesn't get to use it at all.
As I say though - I have no experience whatsoever in these matters, but I do pay attention to how people deal with their kids these days, as I am hoping to start a family soon - so will have a read of the posts after the OP.
Best of luck though!
Two things about this, first is that cutting your hours, if you can afford it, could be a good thing if you spend that time with your daughter. I suffer from depression but have only recently been diagnosed, since though i have spent more time just getting out the house with my daughter for walks. Just giving her that time to skip along and talk rubbish with me has improved our relationship no end. I hadn't realised how my own introspective behaviour and long hours at work (causing the depression) impacted on our relationship.
The other is that a trip to Florida sounds like a massive thing for you as a family, sorry if that assumption is incorrect, and I know you can't threaten to cancel the trip once committed, but why not make a contract with her?
We're going to Florida and this is the itinerary as it stands, however if we see the following improvements in OUR behaviour then we will do these extra things.
As part of that, recognise that there are things you could do differently, don't make it all out to be her fault, concede you could spend more time with her or whetever it is, and stick to that as you would expect her to stick to whatever it is you ask of her.
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The wife and I set very clear discipline parameters and are consistent with punishment. Harsh but fair type of thing. My sister and her sack of **** boyfriend are lazy, feckless and let their 9 year old get away with anything and constantly covered for her terrible, and quite frankly worrying, behaviour early on. Guess who has the serious issues at the moment.
If mine kicked off about something I'd empty their room of all toys and gadgets which had to be earned back. On the rare occasion I got screaming, I'd shut them in a room. We have clear bedtimes, I have complete access to all digital devices and it's clear that's it's my house, my rules
Kids are basic creatures and master manipulators. They know that if they do X they get Y.
If mine kicked off about something I'd empty their room of all toys and gadgets which had to be earned back. On the rare occasion I got screaming, I'd shut them in a room. We have clear bedtimes, I have complete access to all digital devices and it's clear that's it's my house, my rules
Kids are basic creatures and master manipulators. They know that if they do X they get Y.
Soldato
Ha I wish, in the main they are but as with most children they have their moments and we do have regular battle of wills as they try to push the boundaries but me and the wife are pretty consistent so on the odd push we push back and it finishes.
It's never easy, easy thing would be to give them devices and make our lives easier and being honest after a particularly tough time (or we have a lot of chores to do) we sometimes let them have a little too much time but we play it smart and call it a "treat" for them so they don't come to expect it.
To be honest I never expect it to be easy, they are ultimately little adults and trying to spread their wings and develop and just go to help them do so in what is, hopefully, the right manner.
I feel you there in regards to the long hours impacting on my state of mind. I know its not been great for me since i can come home after 12-14hrs at work inc travel and just be ready to hit the hay as soon i walk through the door so in that aspect that is down to me being unwilling to make a change. My wife has often asked for me to do more together as a family and i've always knocked it off till the week after which never comes. In part most of this is likely to be my fault as i know when i am around its hard to coax me to want to do things over than chill out and power down for the weekend again this does not help with state of mind as you become locked into that way of thinking.
I had a chat with my boss this morning and decided to cut down on my hours so thats a start.
Really positive step.
Hahaha no way she is pretty cynical for her age. She is a kid who will sit on the fence for awhile watching the others before joining in trying to work out if shes too cool for them or not. She mainly watches her gymnastics stuff. But now and then its those annoying chad clay wilder or vv quay whatever her name is. Glad shes moved on from cookieswirl C though her voice ripped through my soul.
i do have mac address filtering enabled so after a certain time it will cut off internet to her devices all 3 of them!
We have come to an agreement that 10pm during school hols and 8.30pm during school term means she doesn't continue watching till she falls asleep. Going to see how it goes first and see if the ground rules are listened to so she has come level of trust her way.