Does something need to be done about dogs?

It sounds like the owner claimed it wasn't an XL Bully and the police took their word for it. Thick officers because it definitely looks just like one.
Looks are precisely (and only) what the government definitions go by, and since the Police apparently have "experts" at identifying such things, there can be no argument..... right?

Cant wait for our usual suspect to turn around and say its because she's an uneducated chav and it has nothing to do with the dogs breed itself.
You already know it has nothing to do with dog breed or type, her education or social status - She was simply yet another moron who didn't treat her dogs properly and didn't get proper training.
The most it seems she did is put a post on Farcebook asking for advice for dealing with hyperactive dogs.

When ttaskmaster finishes his UK tour teaching them all how to be good owners.
Why me?
There are thousands of dog training classes available all around the UK - Why aren't the dumb owners actually doing the responsible thing and making use of them?

So it seems the XL Bully breed was created in USA in the 1990`s and the man credited with breeding it claims there were not issues with it in the USA. So if that is true then could it be that the UK breeders were morons who selected for aggression on purpose and bread a nasty variant of the dog.
That has been the general assertion, yes, that a certain percentage were selected from a very questionable breed-line, with a good number of them making their way here, either directly imported for breeding or brought 'in liquid form'.
 
Looks are precisely (and only) what the government definitions go by, and since the Police apparently have "experts" at identifying such things, there can be no argument..... right?

You already know it has nothing to do with dog breed or type, her education or social status - She was simply yet another moron who didn't treat her dogs properly and didn't get proper training.
The most it seems she did is put a post on Farcebook asking for advice for dealing with hyperactive dogs.

These are a breed of dog, bred from dogs that have literally killed both humans and other dogs and animals. They could go by genetic DNA to classify them if they had that. These dogs are responsible for the vast majority of dog violence in the UK

And you think you can train that out of their DNA?

Also claiming you need to train your dog not to bite you, shows you know very little about 99.9% of dogs. 99.9% of dogs love their owners and would never bite their owners. This is a breed of dog bred to kill every living form it comes across.
 
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They are basically over sized versions of American Pit bull terriers? and we banned those n the early 90s and for good reason.

Would the police even recognise an American pit bull terrier if they saw one? I'm guessing no and they would just say its not an XL bully because its smaller...
 
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These are a breed of dog, bred from dogs that have literally killed both humans and other dogs and animals.
They are a variant of a sub-breed.
Its ancestors having killed is no more a factor than your ancestors having killed in a war. Hell, pretty much every dog has the killer instinct somewhere in its DNA. What point do you think you're making with this?

They could go by genetic DNA to classify them if they had that. These dogs are responsible for the vast majority of dog violence in the UK
Funnily enough, they do have that. So do the government, yet they still base the definition on looks alone.
But then, if these dogs are responsible, why do we legally hold the owners to account?

And you think you can train that out of their DNA?
I didn't say that.

Also claiming you need to train your dog not to bite you, shows you know very little about 99.9% of dogs.
Claiming I said that shows you didn't read the post.
You train your dog to be well behaved, which includes omitting the overexcitedness and similar behaviours that, unchecked, eventually lead to this sort of incident.

99.9% of dogs love their owners and would never bite their owners.
The thousands of owners who get bitten each year would disagree with that.

This is a breed of dog bred to kill every living form it comes across.
This is a variant of a sub-breed, some of which has been trained to kill, as evidenced earlier in the thread.
But actually 'bred to kill' is a stretch and not so easily accomplished as you think - Breeding for any specific trait, even if both parents exhibit it very strongly, a mere 1-in-7 is considered a good result.

They are basically over sized versions of American Pit bull terriers? and we banned those n the early 90s and for good reason.
We also banned breeding from APBTs, so ABs and XLBs were technically illegal anyway...

Would the police even recognise an American pit bull terrier if they saw one? I'm guessing no and they would just say its not an XL bully because its smaller...
Possibly, but then every force is supposed to have access to specialists who can properly determine exact breed.

So true, imagine if she had an untrained sausage dog or Pug it could just as likely have happened.
And it would, and it does. That's because they're all dogs and will behave according to the nature of dogs. XLBs are no different.
Well done you - You've finally started to understand that this is, and always has been, a dog owner problem, not a breed specific one.
 
FML When was the last time a Pug brutally killed an able-bodied, adult woman?

I had a small dog think it was a good idea to jump out of his owner's arms, run across the road and bite me in my left leg, a few years ago.

No reason for the attack, just an animal thing.

Punctured skin and drew blood, but nothing serious and only required a hospital visit for a tetatanus jab.

Now imagine that was an XL Bully type of dog, outcome would have been a lot different methinks.
 
Growing up a friend had a jack russell which was a hateful little devil dog.
They got away with it being so poorly behaved as it worst it give you a nip.
When a Bully Xl get's out of control even abled bodied adults may struggle to keep it under control.
 
I had a small dog think it was a good idea to jump out of his owner's arms, run across the road and bite me in my left leg, a few years ago.

No reason for the attack, just an animal thing.

Punctured skin and drew blood, but nothing serious and only required a hospital visit for a tetatanus jab.

Now imagine that was an XL Bully type of dog, outcome would have been a lot different methinks.
Had the same happen except for some kind of spaniel (not cocker or springer but not a king charles either. Yeah I don't know my dog breeds). Anyway it just ran across the road and bit me on the leg the backside was on a bike at the time and used the helmet to put it between me and the dog as I turned around which prevented any more. Owner just came over collected it and said sorry it just does that. Ah right, thats ok, then. :rolleyes:
 
FML When was the last time a Pug brutally killed an able-bodied, adult woman?
FYL indeed, if you refuse to address the point being made.
Who cares whether any dog kills or merely injures? It's the refusal of owners to own responsibly that results in this and the overwhelming majority of incidents.

Heard it here now everyone, XL Bully's are overexcited, not just murderous hell hounds....
Newsflash - Every dog in the same conditions behaves the same way. What makes you think breeding is the defining factor?

Sources?
Or is this just wish washy nonsense too?
Every dog training school you care to ask, every animal psychologist or behaviourist, every scientific study of canine behaviour...
Take your ******* pick.

Try telling that to @ttaskmaster
No seriously, please do try telling that to him, half the forum has tried now and he still doesn't get it.
Tell me what? That the extent of human responsibility is defined by a dog's capacity to do damage, rather than their own failings, as you seem to think??
 
As has been pointed out several times now...
Breed IS a factor.
bad owners are ALSO a factor.

Put both those bad traits together and you've got serious problems just waiting to happen, a public danger multiplier if you like.

I know someone who has a pit bull type dog, and it seems really soft around humans (for now), but in the presence of other dogs it's just uncontrolable, it's like it just losses it's mind and goes for them, so they have no choice but to keep it muzzled in public unles they want a bloodbath.
 
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What makes you think breeding is the defining factor?

It's a major contributor... just look at the sheer disproportionate amount of attacks and deaths (on people and other dogs) caused by a very small subset of 'breeds'.

You don't need to be a statistical analyst to work it out.

When was the last time a Labrador ate a childs face?
 
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Had the same happen except for some kind of spaniel (not cocker or springer but not a king charles either. Yeah I don't know my dog breeds). Anyway it just ran across the road and bit me on the leg the backside was on a bike at the time and used the helmet to put it between me and the dog as I turned around which prevented any more. Owner just came over collected it and said sorry it just does that. Ah right, thats ok, then. :rolleyes:

I reported it to the police, ended up getting a few hundred in compo, with them warning the owner to keep the aggressive little mutt on a leash! :p
 

According to these statistics,

According to the study, Pitbulls, mixed breeds, and dogs weighing between 66 and 100 pounds, with heavy, broad heads and short muzzles, are most likely to attack people. Other research estimates that Pitbulls were involved in approximately 3,400 attacks and killed at least 235 people in the U.S. from 2014 through 2020.

Second on the list, and in quite a distant second place is Rotweilers.

responsible for about 535 attacks on humans over the last several years, causing at least 51 deaths since 2005.
 
FYL indeed, if you refuse to address the point being made.

I'm not the one claiming Pugs and sausages dogs are just as likely to have done it and then not being able to back it up!

Who cares whether any dog kills or merely injures?

Most people - you could try a poll if you like:

Would you rather:

A) Be bitten by a Pug

B) Be mauled to death by an XL Bully

Like WTF are you smoking man, can you really not see what people would obviously care more about there?
 
As has been pointed out several times now...
Breed IS a factor.
bad owners are ALSO a factor.
A dog's specific lineage is a minor factor, but as has been pointed out for many years by many industry professionals and studies, actual breed itself is not a factor.
Bad or irresponsible ownership, however, has clearly been the deciding element in most fatalities and the major factor in most attacks.

I know someone who has a pit bull type dog, and it seems really soft around humans (for now), but in the presence of other dogs it's just uncontrolable, it's like it just losses it's mind and goes for them, so they have no choice but to keep it muzzled in public unles they want a bloodbath.
I know several people who have pit bull type dogs too, which are all soppy as Labradors.... So what?
I also know several Labradors that are great around people but hate other dogs, and vice versa... So what?
Both cases are anecdotal and tell only the sort of upbringing the individual dog has had.

Some dogs are more sensitive and responsive than others, but this just further highlights how they then reflect the sort of raising and ownership they've had.

Not even remotely true - ask any dog groomer - different breeds have very different common triggers (and tolerances).
Now ask your dog groomers how they think any given dog would behave if you let it go completely untrained and ungoverned, put it in bed with you, treat it like a baby, refer to it as your "son" and let it do what it likes while "not giving a ****", to quote the dead XLB owner in question....

Any dog, given that degree of improper treatment, will behave very badly.

It's a major contributor... just look at the sheer disproportionate amount of attacks and deaths (on people and other dogs) caused by a very small subset of 'breeds'.
And how many of those were owned by responsible owners who did all the right things?
How many of the owners were negligent in their ownership?

You don't need to be a statistical analyst to work it out.
But you do need to have the wider picture to give them context.
Everyone's so quick to harp on about how XLBs are just status dogs owned by drug dealers and the lowest scum of society who just want to weaponise them, yet seem very reluctant to actually pull the trigger on driving responsibility and holding such people accountable for what they cause...

When was the last time a Labrador ate a childs face?
In which country?
Since you're citing US stats, there have been a couple of Labs this year who killed children, including one infant.

I'm not the one claiming Pugs and sausages dogs are just as likely to have done it and then not being able to back it up!
Prove me wrong then - Take any dog you like, mistreat it and then show me how well-behaved it is....... Go ahead, I'll wait.

Like WTF are you smoking man, can you really not see what people would obviously care more about there?
And that's where your problem is.
It's not the capacity of the dog to cause damage, it's the irresponsible ownership. Dogs have been doing this long before the XLB even existed. You and the rest of them only care because now a few more people than usual have died. There are still many thousands of attacks, as there have been for decades, because of irresponsible ownership.

If you actually did care, you'd address the problem instead of the symptom.
 
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