DX12 CPU Performance Leaked, Way Faster Than DX11 – Threading Model Resembles AMD’s Mantle

[shankly1985]

Direct x took much longer than that, multiple versions in fact before it became somewhat decent. For a fledgling api mantle is doing quite well.

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Wasn't it dx8 that really started to shape directx. Mantle as done stunning within its first year.

 

[Ayahuasca]

Mantle as done stunning

 

[shankly1985]

Another sig for you. Might after start charging you.

 

[tommybhoy]

Just to add my tuppence as well, we also had AMD publicly stating that Microsoft would be dropping DX... Yer no.

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/news/amd-roy-taylor-directx12/

And what if he was right and there was no DirectX 12 in development at that time? Only 11.3 might have existed at the time. For all we know DirectX 12 is nothing more than a low level version of 11.3.

From greggs link:

“There will be no DirectX 12. That was it. As far as we know there are no plans for DirectX 12,” he said to Heise. “If this should not be, and someone wants to correct me – wonderful.”

Why Roy stated what he stated???

Maybe because the other Roy(one of MS own MVP's) leaked/stated the contents of an official MS email stating 'DX is dead'-that caused one hell of a **** storm.

Spoiler

 

[shankly1985]

Yeah but Greg Mantle was the first low level API ever to be invented, so anything else that comes along is just copying Dice/EA.

Just seen this lol, don't think it was the first ever low level api... Am sure they is more out there.

 

[D.P.]

Mantle still be the better option for amd owners.
DX12 has to assign higher values.
yea amd shared mantle with Microsoft they are not like Nvidia who can stand on a stage with a card built by woodscrews and then say wow check our new card guys its awesome and you pay a ton of cash for it.
Microsoft simply couldnt build dx12 without amd and Mantle.

Best thing that happen to PC gamers and Nvidia didn't do anything to make it happen.

Why would mantle still be a better option? How can you possibly qualify that statement when DX12 hasn't been released yet? What if DX12 is faster than mantle? How can mantle be better than DX for AMD owners when most AMD owners can't even use Mantle?

Your whole post if full on retard. "Microsoft simply couldnt build dx12 without amd and Mantle." Why not, multithreading an API and batching system calls is pretty fundamental software! I do it all the time myself.
"Best thing that happen to PC gamer", ehh? A few AMD with the right hardware users get 5-10% speed boost in a couple of games and that is supposed to be a big thing? How does that compare to the first GPU with fixed pipelines, or the first GPU with programmable pipelines, or the first graphics cards full stop.

 

[Ayahuasca]

Wouldn't bother replying to a flopper post, he has a tendency to do fan boy post and runs like that in a lot of threads.

 

[Gregster]

And what if he was right and there was no DirectX 12 in development at that time? Only 11.3 might have existed at the time. For all we know DirectX 12 is nothing more than a low level version of 11.3.

It could have been called DX11.3/4/5/6/7/8/9 or something completely different but the fact remains that AMD claimed Microsoft was dropping DX and that was wrong.

AMD have a habit of making wild claims and then retracting...

AMD calls chief gaming scientist's comments about DX12 not coming to Windows 7 "speculating"

A classic from Richard Huddy there.

Then we have Roy Taylor with his awesome tweets.



https://twitter.com/GeoffHann1/status/509671055263531008

Plus you get other info coming out.

Speaking to a crowd of about 300 developers and press, Anuj Gosalia, development manager of DirectX at Microsoft, described DX12 as the joint effort of hardware vendors, game developers and his team. Our work with Microsoft on DirectX 12 began more than four years ago with discussions about reducing resource overhead. For the past year, NVIDIA has been working closely with the DirectX team to deliver a working design and implementation of DX12 at GDC. - See more at: http://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2014/03/20/directx-12/#sthash.53ueyrvh.dpuf

So 4 years in the making according to nVidia

http://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2014/03/20/directx-12/

And finally we have Forza 5 running on a Titan Black at GDC and using DX12. So they had it in an Alpha state to be able to run a game on nVidia hardware and DX12 in March of 2014 at GDC.... If it was Mantle, they managed to make nVidia run this wonderful API (which I like Mantle) in the space of a month.... So no, DX12 isn't Mantle but it aims to do the same as Mantle and that is where people seem to get confused.

 

[D.P.]

Given that the latest inclusion of DX11 was AMD's work with MS i doubt the latter of that ^^^ is true.



I don't think he did, i think he suggested it was a possibility, But if you have any facts that say otherwise cite it, or stop spouting nonsense.

AMD developed features tat required MS to incorporate it in the API, so what.

The DX API is formed by a consortium including Intel, Nvidia and AMD, they all have a say in what the API will look like.

 

[bru]

What a stupid article.

Typical wccftech, lets take a good news story and completely miss the point and add loads of non relevant bias.

Here is the original leak in its entirety

Windows 10 will be coming with DirectX 12. DirectX 12 is the first version of DirectX that really uses multiple cores effectively.

Below are two slides provided by Microsoft:

DirectX 11: See how much of the work is done on the first core?

DirectX 12, the work gets split up.

Bottom line: In DirectX 11 this frame took almost 9ms to render. In DirectX 12, it took about 4ms. Now, how much real world improvement you get depends heavily on both the developer and the game. But the reason we’re all getting so excited is that DirectX 12 should be the biggest performance bump for those who utilize it we’ve ever seen.

What this means to you

Next time you watch Jurassic Park or Phantom Menace, please realize that the CGI in those movies can be done in real-time today. However, most graphics engines in games still render scenes very differently than in movies. That’s because it’s only recently been possible to create real-world fidelity in real-time. But a modern machine with DirectX 12 (or Mantle) could do real-time visuals in a game that is as good as you would get in say Lord of the Rings.

The Post-Frame Rate game world

We will need get away from frame rate as being the key metric on its own (unless we’re comparing apples and apples). The DirectX 12 / Mantle specific games will look unmistakably different than what we have today.

What we basically do today in games is render a frame and then apply a bunch of post-process effects to it. In a DirectX 12 / Mantle world we’ll render images the same way they did CGI in the past. With a modern CPU + GPU combo with DirectX 12 you could do parts of the Battle of Helms Deep from LOTR in real-time. Keep a very close eye on Unreal 4, Frostbite, Crytek and of course Nitrous.

wccftech article no mention of the numbers at all, and loads of AMD bias baloney, that has nothing to do with this actual leak at all.

Will any of this make any difference to any of the arguments/discussions in here.......of course not but when have the facts ever mattered before when there is red vrs blue brownie points to be won. (eh blue don't I mean green, hmm something definitely not right here )

Original article source.

 

[Noctifer]

It could have been called DX11.3/4/5/6/7/8/9 or something completely different but the fact remains that AMD claimed Microsoft was dropping DX and that was wrong.

Currently not in development is not the same as dropping the API. Also, 11.1 and 11.2 were not major API iterations, far all we know 11.3 and 12 might be the same.

 

[thebennyboy]

Why is there so much hate and flaming this thread? My opinion on the matter is that DirectX 12 will be good news for both Nvidia, AMD and potentially Intel. I do believe however that Mantle had a hand in giving MS a kick up the arse to sort out DirectX.

 

[Gregster]

Currently not in development is not the same as dropping the API. Also, 11.1 and 11.2 were not major API iterations, far all we know 11.3 and 12 might be the same.

 

[triss]

Not sure it really matter who's api does what as long as in the end everyone benefits. Oddly PS3/4 consoles have had a lower level api for years i thought? Did someone just take some of those ideas?

 

[tommybhoy]

So 4 years in the making according to Nvidia

They also revealed a wooden gpu to the world.

Glad too hear it's only Amd that drop the clangers.

Forza 5 on Titan Black doesn't prove ****, not that it can run outwith an XBONE or anything, forgetting about the hidden PC's that were used show Xbone to the public?

 

[GoogalyMoogaly]

First off, does DX12 support non-GCN cards (AMD and non-AMD)? Cuz I don't think Mantle does, so it's not exactly the same.

Also, didn't AMD say that DX12 looks to have some nice features that they're going to pinch and use in Mantle 2? So if DX12 is Mantle, how does it have stuff Mantle doesn't? That doesn't make sense...

I see everyone looking at this at the wrong point of view!

If mantle wasn't invented or designed do you really think DX12 would have the same benefits mantle offers or just be the next DX upgrade like it usually is? Answer honestly!

Mantle has done what AMD intended and that was to get a api that offered more power the developers than what currently was on offer. Now they made mantle for this but if they wanted mantle to be the only API that offered this, why take it to microsoft and show them what it is, how it works and offers?

They wanted to eliminate that CPU overhead that currently was seen in the current APIs. I see mantle did that and now microsoft have made sure DX12 has done that too because they realised, if they didn't do this Mantle will gain a lot of traction and may become the way to go API.

Fair enough Greg DX12 is still DX12 but it's copied mantle that's for dam sure.

And rusty if you originally had one car that seemed to only run and offer the same performance for a long period of time then along comes a faster car which offered better performance which car would you choose to get from A to B? In gaming terms? Honestly?

However now the slower car has now improved and made its self faster maybe matching or becoming faster than the other car. Would it have done this if there was no competing car? Honestly?

I wish people would stop being so negative with AMD with innovation all it has done is benefit gamers but yet people go on and bash/hate on mantle and ohh here we go again another mantle thread bla bla. Ignorance...

Ah, but didn't Nvidia have a programmable architecture before AMD?
So AMD came up with a programmable architecture to keep up with Nvidia and then developed Mantle that required the programmable architecture (which is why AMD can't be bothered to get it working on older cards). Mantle may then have influenced DX12.
So really we have Nvidia to thank for DX12 as they made it all possible...

 

[tommybhoy]

Yeah we do.

 

[Noctifer]

First off, does DX12 support non-GCN cards (AMD and non-AMD)? Cuz I don't think Mantle does, so it's not exactly the same.

APIs do not support hardware. MS doesn't make DirectX for GCN, Maxwell, Kepler etc. MS invites the hardware vendors and talks about what features they want to support. MS then makes an official list of specifications, hardware vendors make GPUs around those specs and then later on make drivers that allow the API and hardware to communicate.

Can Mantle work on non GCN hardware? WWill have to wait and see once it goes public, so far AMD didn't give Intel Mantle even though they have shown interest.

Also, hardware specific features can be used in APIs trough extensions. A vendor can have tech in their hardware that other vendors don't and then expose that trough extensions. It is possible both in Mantle and DirectX 11.x.

 

[Gregster]

They also revealed a wooden gpu to the world.

Glad too hear it's only Amd that drop the clangers.

Forza 5 on Titan Black doesn't prove ****, not that it can run outwith an XBONE or anything, forgetting about the hidden PC's that were used show Xbone to the public?

Why so defensive and being such a conspiracist? I was pulling articles out and showing what is what. I don't really care as I have a decent CPU and get good GPU usage but I do find it hilarious that the Mantle Defence League go in full force to try and sway the public opinion by giving it the "Tra la la la - Fingers in ears" to anything rational.

I should have stayed out of this thread really and I should know better.

Belive what you like guys, as I and many many others don't care.

 

[GoogalyMoogaly]

APIs do not support hardware. MS doesn't make DirectX for GCN, Maxwell, Kepler etc. MS invites the hardware vendors and talks about what features they want to support. MS then makes an official list of specifications, hardware vendors make GPUs around those specs and then later on make drivers that allow the API and hardware to communicate.

Can Mantle work on non GCN hardware? WWill have to wait and see once it goes public, so far AMD didn't give Intel Mantle even though they have shown interest.

Also, hardware specific features can be used in APIs trough extensions. A vendor can have tech in their hardware that other vendors don't and then expose that trough extensions. It is possible both in Mantle and DirectX 11.x.

OK, APIs don't support hardware, but hardware supports APIs.
I'm not sure if DX12 will support older AMD cards but AMD have said that Mantle won't.