Well exactly. No different to people riding other motor vehicles illegally.
Separate out those who want to rid an e-bike or scooter legally and responsibly, from those who don't.
E-bike snobbery
- Thread starter scoopex
- Start date
Separate out those who want to rid an e-bike or scooter legally and responsibly, from those who don't.
I disagree. I think most of the general public have no idea and just get sold something which sounds good.
My wife initially bought one second hand which had a throttle and thought it was brilliant because it helped when her disability was at it's worst and often used the throttle for initially setting off so she didn't have as many balance issues. She had no idea (at the time) that it was illegal.
I imagine most people fall into the same category. You either see an illegal bike but it won't be obvious it's illegal. Bit like e-scooters. If it wasn't for the publicity i imagine very few people would know they're technically illegal because they're sold so carefree. Then you consider people who fit Bafang motors as a side business. You offer someone on the street a throttle for an extra tenner and i don't imagine much people would have a clue that could turn a legal bike into an illegal one.
Yes there's plenty who know and don't care, but i think the vast majority just are ignorant of the law.
Last edited:
I think we are talking about different kinds of ebikes. The oiks on the throttle assist ones that look like dirt bikes and go super fast know what they are getting and that its illegal. The average user getting a throttle assist e-bike to get about easily, perhaps not.
This is what posted today on a facebook ebike group, a lovely video demo of how fast it can go on UK road, if the government really want to tackle the problem then all it takes is a few high profile cases to be publicly dealt with. I guess we have other priorities at the moment with the current affairs.
Man of Honour
- Joined
- 29 Mar 2003
- Posts
- 58,018
- Location
- Blurton
Like I said earlier, all five people I know who had them confiscated were 4 normal working blokes who thought they were legal and the other one was a young lad whose Dad didn't know they were illegal.
I am amazed he let his lad go out on a 30mph bike with no helmet
Man of Honour
- Joined
- 29 Mar 2003
- Posts
- 58,018
- Location
- Blurton
This is what posted today on a facebook ebike group, a lovely video demo of how fast it can go on UK road, if the government really want to tackle the problem then all it takes is a few high profile cases to be publicly dealt with. I guess we have other priorities at the moment with the current affairs.
I'm in a Group called De-restricted eMTB Chat and I'm often gobsmacked.
There was somebody on an eScooter doing 75mph.
Last edited:
And life is often unfair that these example of behaviour may live to tell the tale and some poor family end up paying the price when accident happens. In some ways eScooter are worse given the small wheels and more difficult to balance.
Man of Honour
- Joined
- 29 Mar 2003
- Posts
- 58,018
- Location
- Blurton
Last year I was approaching this tunnel at 50mph and an eScooter came flying past me.
Yes I was 10mph over the limit but it was 11pm at night and I thought I was the only person on the road but a few seconds later two Cop cars in hot pursuit.
you don't have to get any insurance for recreational flying and the whole operator ID thing is a waste of time.
if your doing something dodgy why would you use an operator ID? it's a literal sticker of numbers that mean nothing... unless your law abiding and happen to do something naughty.
if your a chav or whatever your not sticking some operator ID sticker on your bike, it's not like anyone polices anything these day
erm./.. its nothing like a "basic training course" it';s common sense and about 12questions or something..
a2 cocfc would be a proper course..
why would anyone display an ID on a bike or motor? you know with drones the actual drone isn't registered anywhere right? you never give the serial number of the drone or anything..
It's just a sticker so they can identify whos drone it was if you broke the law and a plane hit it or it falls into a crowd at a music concert....
but why would you use a sticker? you think these people who don't care about the law are suddenly going to stop riding illegal ebikes because they are supposed to register and get a sticker?
They know the bikes they are buying are illegal in the first place.... they should go after the people importing them from china..
Chav on a Sauron is basically the same as riding around on an unregistered motorbike with no insurance, no mot, no license, nothing... they don't care but if we implement a system where they have to display a sticker.
suddenly they start obeying the law
where's the army of police who are going to put up checkpoints?? they can;t even stop shop lifters
loads of dog walkers don't obey the highway code either, maybe we could bring in dog stickers and suddenly all dogs will be on a short leash in shared spaces
if we bring in stickers for humans we could create a utopia no society has ever dreamed of.
we could call it
Chinas surveillance state
Last edited:
come on, you can't leave me hanging like that, And Theeennn... ?
Have I got it wrong? You can join a drone flying club and have insurance came with it, I am with FPVUK.org for a while and used to be around £20 a year and you get £5m public liability insurance. I always worry that it fall out of the sky and someone going to sue me for billions.
The point of the whole operator ID thing is to let people who is genuinely enjoy flying drones sensibly a way to get a standard education of the current drone law and fly legally. Of course there are people out there who are bad ass and like to test their limits and break every set law they seems trivial but this is not for that, when I first flying drone it was the time you have to built your own and everything is illegal.
Man of Honour
- Joined
- 29 Mar 2003
- Posts
- 58,018
- Location
- Blurton
Well I slowed down immediately to 40 and they were all gone by the time I came out of the tunnel.
If the rider knows the area there are many places he could lose them with illegal moves.
you can but insurance is not needed for recreational flying, your drone isn't going to fall out of the sky on it;s own.
that's why remaining VLOS is critical, a bird can easily kick your 250g drone out of the sky
even a Pidgeon or magpie can take out your drone, if you see a bird circling near your drone you need to go straight up, birds have to fly circles like planes to gain altitude.
soon nesting season btw, the birds will get aggressive, so be careful where you fly from say feb
it doesn't seam to work.
if you look on youtube you will find plenty of drone videos where they obviously didn;t keep VLOS.
they are flying over motorways and A roads which as far as i'm aware is strictly forbidden as it counts as flying over a crowd.
it doesn;t matter if they are in vehicles or not.
I have a mini 4 pro with operator ID, flyer ID but how often would I ever fly where I would attract police attention anyway?
the whole drone ID thing probably came about because of those idiot auditors on youtube bothering police stations etc all the time.
Last edited:
I guess it is for my own peace of mind, I am a home owner and my profession requires me to have a clean record in the society. Drone is a lot more advance than when I first started but It can still fail and when it fails it can cause problem especially now we can fly over buildings and people legally (sub 250 class). If my 250g fall from 400ft and hit a Ferrari I would love to be able to show my insurance and may be some how cover some of the cost of repair, or worse if it fall on someones head (chances are slim but again just for peace of mind).
Nothing will stop people breaking the law if they choose to do so, at least some population of drone flyer will have a path to follow with the right information. If you fly without an operator ID it makes it a lot easier for police to deal with if they are caught.
chatgpt says it wouldn't do much damage
I think throwing a stone at someone would do more damage than a drone dropping on them.
if the drone was drving along a motorway at 40mph and hits an oncoming car doing 70mph it's probably a whole different story.
same for planes, they can puncture the paper thin sheet metal on the wings etc
but just dropping out of the sky seems it wouldn't do much/
Last edited:
Just bought myself and second hand tern GSD S00 to get the boys too and from nursery and its brilliant. They absolutely love it and its so easy and nice to get around it in. Its a shame cargo bikes and ebikes aren't used more for transport in this country and that we don't spend more on infrastructure for active travel. Its so nice being out and about when the weather is nice. Even when the weather is crap its fine if you dress for it.
I commuted to work on an giant hybrid which cost a little under £400 when it was new; more recently I picked up a second hand hybrid to replace it which cost me £65 but needed some work and still needs a bit of tlc.
The slightly tatty second hand bike has got hydraulic disc brakes which weren't common when I got my previous bike but they were on my must have list when I was looking for a replacement after getting fed of buying new wheels because the rim brakes wear them down.
I hope you and your children enjoy your e-bike for years but that bike costs almost £6k new which is why there aren't many of them around, its difficult to see why they cost so much from a manufacturing point when you could buy a motorbike or second hand car for less. Indeed that would have more than covered the cost of all the second hand cars my dad had when I was a child and probably the petrol he used driving us all over the country as well.
Cycling is a great way to get around but I wouldn't dream of chaining up a £6k bike outside a supermarket while I did my shopping; having cycled many thousands of miles the weather does make you think twice about going out at times unless you have to, nobody likes frozen fingers, water dripping down their neck, picking themself off the floor after hitting black ice or being a hot sweaty mess because you got the layers wrong or the weather changed.
The infrastructure does indeed suck, I've taken my bike on solo camping holidays via train in the past then the ******* removed the ability to book a bike space online. Most of my local cycle lanes are either white lines painted on very busy roads full or pot holes and litter or unlit offroad tracks where the tarmac is being pushed up by tree roots. This isn't at all good compared to some of the vids you see online of other countries where they will have bike carriages on the front of their trams and secure bike parking at their train stations for thousands of bikes not the half dozen uncovered spaces you get at stations here.
But its still better than standing at bus stops and can be a good mood lifter despite the trials and tribulations.
you can always get it insured against theft and vandalism and you normally have to buy a gold secure or diamond secure rated lock for it, I also wouldn't just lock it up anywhere such as in a park or a bike rack in middle of nowhere I would lock it up outside the place I am going to such as supermarket or shop etc (my most expensive bike is around £2100)
in my experience with trains it depends on the train, modern northern trains around where I live are quite good for bicycles as long as there arent too many people with bicycles in them and have good facilities for parking them, older northern trains not so much. Transpennine express lets you whatsapp them to book a cycle reservation
@NetMan honestly, I wouldn't be buying it if it was £6k either. I paid a little over £2k to get it with some accessories and then to add 2 child seats that will last them until they are another 1-1.5 years older.
The thing is, yes its expensive but so is buying a car that is useful. Even if I bought this thing brand new and paid £6.5k all in, I would have a very cheap to run vehicle with almost zero maintenance. A car that would be big enough for me and my kids that cost £6.5k would be a piece of ****, cost me probably over a thousand pounds a year to keep/fuel/insure/repair etc along with the faff of having a car that barely gets used. I also don't like the idea of using cars when there are just as good if not better alternatives.
If people considered them second car replacements and were willing to do a little bit of adaptation I think they could take off. I won't be taking my children on 10 mile trips on it but I will be taking them all over my local area. I won't have to worry about parking costs. I won't have to worry about finding parking.
Theres a lot to recommend them IMO.
The thing is, yes its expensive but so is buying a car that is useful. Even if I bought this thing brand new and paid £6.5k all in, I would have a very cheap to run vehicle with almost zero maintenance. A car that would be big enough for me and my kids that cost £6.5k would be a piece of ****, cost me probably over a thousand pounds a year to keep/fuel/insure/repair etc along with the faff of having a car that barely gets used. I also don't like the idea of using cars when there are just as good if not better alternatives.
If people considered them second car replacements and were willing to do a little bit of adaptation I think they could take off. I won't be taking my children on 10 mile trips on it but I will be taking them all over my local area. I won't have to worry about parking costs. I won't have to worry about finding parking.
Theres a lot to recommend them IMO.
There are a few locks that will stand up to an angle grinder for a bit but they aren't exactly cheap and the thing you've got it chained to also needs to be able to withstand an angle grinder...
The other problem is if they can't get the lock off they will just wait for you to come back and try and take it off you when its unlocked:
thetrainline.com removed cycle bookings ages ago and forced you to go to a station to reserve a bike space, it looks like they have added the option back now which is great so I might go camping again if it ever stop raining.
But those trains still only have 2 spaces which isn't great and useless if a group wanted to do it.