Discussion in 'Motors' started by Marc2180, Aug 31, 2019.
Cheap 22kWh Renault Zoe?
It looks a little on the small side - we use the b class because it's fairly large inside.
put yourself on the eveazy wait list , and try the logistics (the practicalities of the charging issues, range might get to you) of electric for several months
... and check out the id3 in a year.
Undoubtedly it will, but it's wholly inadequate for most to consider an EV at the moment.
Got this from tilsun
To be honest I think there are plenty of people who could consider an EV but simply don't want to and will put barriers up for themselves rather than simply saying "I don't like them and I don't one".
The biggest realistic barrier that remains imo, is cost of entry - a good EV is still expensive to buy and relies on you having charge at home capability, which typically means a house with a driveway.
For me, being realistic, if they made a Model 3 estate, I'd be sorted and I drive 20,000+ miles per year. I wouldn't need to rely on a charging network at all for my day to day mileage, it would literally only be one off trips of over 300 miles in one hit and I can't remember the last time I did that.
So whilst there is enough of a technical barrier still to 'most people', I don't think it's as big a majority as many assume.
This isn't a good deal. Works out to be £302.73 per month
From my experience so far doing trips the length of the country, I've learned a couple of things:
Stopping to charge is not a big deal, 15 to 30 minutes in a 5 hour journey is nothing, bad traffic has cost me upwards of 2 hours on the same route. At 120kW if I take a leak then go buy some lunch, a coffee & a cake; the car will always be ready to go before I've finished the coffee.
50kW is actually quite fast *if* you are driving an efficient car. In one of my stops I was forced to share a supercharger "pair" and only got 60kW, this made my stop 30 minutes rather than 15, the horror! It's surprising how fast you can accumulate range on even 50kW. More would certainly be better though and I'd value fast charging above battery capacity, in fact a lot of people are saying the old Ioniq (28kWh and 65kW charging) is better for long trips than the new one (38kWh but only 40kW charging).
The Tesla network has plenty of chargers, they're only needed on motorways really and there's enough everywhere I go. If you don't have a Tesla, these are your options for 50kW charging on CHAdeMO:
And on CCS:
As you can see, the infrastructure just isn't there.
I'd like to see more 100+kW chargers in the country though, ideally 350kW. Though the E-Golf this thread is for will not be able to take advantage of these:
And Tesla's network that I find to be ample:
I agree with that you are saying, the locations are there but the volumes of chargers isn’t. Most of those locations have just a single charger, even on the motorway. That’s a pretty big risk for being occupied in perk times or just broken. If you make it to a charger with low SOC it there is only one and it’s in use you’ll be waiting awhile.
A lot of the time they are in less than convenient places. Even just a mile or two off the main road adds a lot of time.
The 50kw chargers aren’t really 50kw either, you’ll be lucky to get more than 44kw over a significant period of the charge cycle on something like a leaf/Kona/e-golf.
That’s why the Tesla network is a completely different conversation. Most locations have 8+ stalls so there are always people coming and going. The chances of a line are low. They are also seriously fast if you have a model 3 due to the efficiency. The other networks need to be replicating this. For town/city/hotel/car parks locations they are much better off sticking in 7kw ac chargers and only a few rapids.
Does anyone watch Hubnut on YT? He tried to do 800 miles in three days in an I Pace, and the charging situation was exactly as awful as I expected it to be.
Not surprised, you really need to plan what you are doing on the non Tesla network, particularly if you need to use Ecotricity (which are notoriously unreliable and often broken). You may need to factor in alternative chargers if there is only one. You’ll need to work out where to charge and for how long yourself.
the iPace also isn’t great long distance, it’s a thirsty beast and you’ll be lucky to get more than 200 miles out of it on a motorway. It also changes slow, you’ll get 70-90 on a decent charger but most of the time you’ll be stuck at 45-50. But because it drinks electrons the miles gained per time on the charger (which is the important part) is dire compared to something like a Kona or Nero. They would embarrass an iPace on a road trip even though they charge slower and have 1/3 less battery capacity, they have about 20-40% more range!
Embarrass is probably not a fair word as it’s been engineered for a completely different set of attributes. Updates are frequent for I-PACE as stuff is understood, I’m just hoping the charging protocols are fixed between CCS and it to allow frequency, reliable 80kW+ charging.
dipped into video - interesting ... so ipace dash doesn't appear to tell you effective charging Kwh rate/history,
but maybe jaguar app he referenced, would tell you remotely when there is an issue, +charge rate.
. ... trip-advisor is needed for peoples' reviews of individual charger reliability/service.
[tesla have had waiting for charger issues/remedial-action in the usa https://electrek.co/2019/05/24/tesla-limiting-supercharger-busy/ , so not necessarily immune in the UK when Tesla population grows.]
If you read the article or subsequent articles you can override it by moving the charge slider to 100% on the big screen.
likewise charging to 100% isn’t particularly time efficient. Far better off moving to the next one at a lower SOC.
The Golf is only a touch bigger than the Zoe. The boot is actually a bit smaller.
I was quite surprised when I went to look at one. I had it in my head that the Golf was the same size as the Leaf. But it's actually a lot smaller. Made me rethink, as the Zoe is available from Evezy for £289/month including insurance, maintenance, etc. and is in many ways the better car (longer range, battery cooling, heat pump and digital dash as standard).
There's no shortage of charging sites. But the network is far from adequate.
The first problem is that not all of the chargers work all of the time. Some networks *cough* Ecotricity *cough* are quite dire at times. Reliability needs to improve, as does the way that downtime is reported to users.
Second, while there's plenty of capacity on the network for the current UK EV fleet, turning up at a charger to find someone else got there 5 minutes before you does happen. And it means a potentially long wait. Real-time availability data would really improve things, but it needs to be part of the car's satnav to be really useful.
Third, the apps. Again, it's not uncommon to arrive at a charger and find that it's working, and isn't being used, but you can't connect to it because the app is playing up. Usually, this can be solved with a quick phone call. But it shouldn't be necessary. Card payments need to be implemented ASAP.
Most of the time, the above isn't an issue. But I've had a few interesting journeys caused by issues with chargers and also (early on) with my own inexperience of using the network. There's still a lot of work to be done to make the experience user friendly; reliability needs to get better, more chargers need to be installed (maybe using Tesla-style major charging hubs), real-time charger availability needs to be added to EV SatNavs, and card payment needs to be rolled out.
New cheaper deal on the e-Golf.
48 months, 10k miles per year. 3 months up front + £195 processing fee = £943.50 up front then £249.50 per month for 47 months. Works out to be £263.96 per month on average.
https://www.jetvehiclefinance.co.uk/Search/12243/VOLKSWAGEN/267/GOLF/99kW e-Golf 35kWh 5dr Auto/Vehicle/74573/Business/false/ContractType/Contract Hire
Wife's current lease is up shortly and moving to EV seems like a plan as she does around a 50-90 mile commute a day so could save some fuel costs, and can re-charge overnight.
That deal seems to be the best i can find at the moment, just sent a query in to see if they can offer it, and what the lead time is (ideally need it by mid-Dec)
VW dealers still seem to have stock available for delivery, if you want to call a few.
I'd also be wary of taking out a car for 48 months, since they deal above works out at ~£12.6k, but you can get a similar price for 24 months, meaning no added costs like tires, MOTs and extra servicing of required. PCH on 24-36 months usually works out best when there are good deals floating around, and by 2021 they will be a huge shift in available EV's competing with each other.
Cheers for that, have leased for a while (non EV) but always gone for 36 months (seemed the sweet spot ref deposits) - but take your point ref the EV market shifting so will likely be looking at 36 months unless something compelling comes across.
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