Can I do a rolleyes at this?
I'll say it again, they do not have an existing system other than management oversight.
They can think what they like, I'll be gone if they start giving me any extra grief over it.
Employer is requiring biometric data for clocking on, can I refuse?
- Thread starter Dano
- Start date
Can I do a rolleyes at this?
I'll say it again, they do not have an existing system other than management oversight.
They can think what they like, I'll be gone if they start giving me any extra grief over it.
Associate
- Joined
- 11 Jun 2004
- Posts
- 1,332
- Location
- Aotearoa
My first project in my current roll was to deploy a similar system here. It only stores hash information and is secured at a remote location... all employees were then given the option of using biometric data or electronic tags. It was a fairly even 50/50 split to start with, although 12 months later around 80% of staff now use the finger scanners.
From a management point of view, I have nearly nothing to do with the finger scanners whereas I'm issuing/reissuing/replacing tags at least once a week.
From a management point of view, I have nearly nothing to do with the finger scanners whereas I'm issuing/reissuing/replacing tags at least once a week.
Don
- Joined
- 20 Oct 2002
- Posts
- 17,162
- Location
- In a house
While this may be true, managment, and particulary IT bods (like me) love a system that is install and forget.
Card loss becomes the "password reset" of the card based system. Also, as stated before, people cant usually turn up and say "I didnt sign in, as I didnt have my pass, I was here on the dot at 8am, I promise"
If they have lost their pass, they have 9 others hopefully
If they have lost their pass, they have 9 others hopefully
Well no because your print is different on each finger, unless they record them all.
I can see that the answer is as you thought at the start; submit or walk.
Slightly OT, I think that this will be how ID cards get made compulsory ie make things so difficult for non compliance personel and get the others to all say "what's the problem? if you have nothing to hide.. safeguards are in place." etc. The choice will eventually become: accept the card or walk; walk meaning no job, no NHS, no benefits etc ..... beginning of the real big brother scenario. Just a thought.
Slightly OT, I think that this will be how ID cards get made compulsory ie make things so difficult for non compliance personel and get the others to all say "what's the problem? if you have nothing to hide.. safeguards are in place." etc. The choice will eventually become: accept the card or walk; walk meaning no job, no NHS, no benefits etc ..... beginning of the real big brother scenario. Just a thought.
Putting the OP comments on one side for a moment...
Finger print scanning as a method of clocking in makes a lot of sense. as a lot of peaple have said so far its going to be cheaper than swipe cards or key pad entry. We use a proximity card with photo ID on it...they are a pain to set up and if you lose the card its a hastle to get another one made and we actually get charged for a replacement card...
If for some reason the database loses your fingerprint ID you just need to scan it in again..no cards to get made up and nothing to get lost when your down the pub after work...(never happened to me) which in turn can result in security issues itself.
Not sticking up for biometrics here...I hate them, I work in IT dept and our biometric scanners on the laptops are always failing...but as a method of clocking on it has its benefits over traditional swipe cards.
Finger print scanning as a method of clocking in makes a lot of sense. as a lot of peaple have said so far its going to be cheaper than swipe cards or key pad entry. We use a proximity card with photo ID on it...they are a pain to set up and if you lose the card its a hastle to get another one made and we actually get charged for a replacement card...
If for some reason the database loses your fingerprint ID you just need to scan it in again..no cards to get made up and nothing to get lost when your down the pub after work...(never happened to me) which in turn can result in security issues itself.
Not sticking up for biometrics here...I hate them, I work in IT dept and our biometric scanners on the laptops are always failing...but as a method of clocking on it has its benefits over traditional swipe cards.
They usaully scan more than one finger incase you can't get a clean scan on entry. Burns, cuts, dirt all get in the way so having more than one finger scanned is standard.
There's a world of difference between an employer doing it and the state doing it. The employer doesn't have a monopoly of force for a start, nor do you have to work for said employer. You don't have the same options when the state is involved.
Don
- Joined
- 20 Oct 2002
- Posts
- 17,162
- Location
- In a house
lol, yes, i know that. What i mean is, you dont have to buy a new one! to replace it!
Soldato
- Joined
- 30 May 2007
- Posts
- 5,017
- Location
- Glasgow, Scotland
Bejenkies... everyone seems so pernickety about things now a days...! For all it is 
Ask the employer perhaps? See what they say about refusal to comply with new policies?
Ask the employer perhaps? See what they say about refusal to comply with new policies?
Permabanned
- Joined
- 5 Apr 2006
- Posts
- 7,704
New Company Policies
>
> EFFECTIVE Monday 11th of May, 2009 ........New Office Policy Dress Code:
>
> 1) You are advised to come to work dressed according to your salary.
>
> 2) If we see you wearing Prada shoes and carrying a Gucci bag, we will
> assume you are doing well financially and therefore do not need a raise.
>
> 3) If you dress poorly, you need to learn to manage your money better,
> so that you may buy nicer clothes, and therefore you do not need a
> raise.
>
> 4) If you dress just right, you are right where you need to be and
> therefore you do not need a raise.
>
>
> Sick Days:
> We will no longer accept a doctor's note statement as proof of sickness.
> If you are able to go to the doctor, you are able to come to work.
>
> Personal Days:
>
> Each employee will receive 104 Personal days a year..
> They are called Saturdays & Sundays.
>
> Bereavement Leave:
>
> This is no excuse for missing work. There is nothing you can do for dead
> friends, relatives or co-workers. Every effort should be made to have
> non-employees attend the funeral arrangements in your place. In rare
> cases where employee involvement is necessary, the funeral should be
> scheduled in the late afternoon. We will be glad to allow you to work
> through your lunch hour and subsequently leave one hour early.
>
> Bathroom Breaks:
>
> Entirely too much time is being spent in the toilet. There is now a
> strict three-minute time limit in the stalls. At the end of
> three-minutes, an alarm will sound, the toilet paper roll will retract,
> the stall door will open, and a picture will be taken..
>
>
> After your second offence, your picture will be posted on the company
> bulletin board under the "Chronic Offenders" category. Anyone caught
> smiling in the picture will be sectioned under the company's mental
> health policy.
>
> Lunch Break:
>
> * Skinny People get 30 minutes for lunch, as they need to eat more, so
> that they can look healthy.
> * Normal Size People get 15 minutes for lunch to get a balanced meal to
> maintain their average figure.
> * Chubby People get 5 minutes for lunch, because that's all the time
> needed to drink a Slim-Fast.
> Thank you for your loyalty to our company. We are here to provide a
> positive employment experience.. Therefore, all questions, comments,
> concerns, complaints, frustrations, irritations, aggravations,
> insinuations, allegations, accusations, contemplations, consternation
> and input should be directed elsewhere.
>
> The Management
> Pass this on to all who are employed!
>
> EFFECTIVE Monday 11th of May, 2009 ........New Office Policy Dress Code:
>
> 1) You are advised to come to work dressed according to your salary.
>
> 2) If we see you wearing Prada shoes and carrying a Gucci bag, we will
> assume you are doing well financially and therefore do not need a raise.
>
> 3) If you dress poorly, you need to learn to manage your money better,
> so that you may buy nicer clothes, and therefore you do not need a
> raise.
>
> 4) If you dress just right, you are right where you need to be and
> therefore you do not need a raise.
>
>
> Sick Days:
> We will no longer accept a doctor's note statement as proof of sickness.
> If you are able to go to the doctor, you are able to come to work.
>
> Personal Days:
>
> Each employee will receive 104 Personal days a year..
> They are called Saturdays & Sundays.
>
> Bereavement Leave:
>
> This is no excuse for missing work. There is nothing you can do for dead
> friends, relatives or co-workers. Every effort should be made to have
> non-employees attend the funeral arrangements in your place. In rare
> cases where employee involvement is necessary, the funeral should be
> scheduled in the late afternoon. We will be glad to allow you to work
> through your lunch hour and subsequently leave one hour early.
>
> Bathroom Breaks:
>
> Entirely too much time is being spent in the toilet. There is now a
> strict three-minute time limit in the stalls. At the end of
> three-minutes, an alarm will sound, the toilet paper roll will retract,
> the stall door will open, and a picture will be taken..
>
>
> After your second offence, your picture will be posted on the company
> bulletin board under the "Chronic Offenders" category. Anyone caught
> smiling in the picture will be sectioned under the company's mental
> health policy.
>
> Lunch Break:
>
> * Skinny People get 30 minutes for lunch, as they need to eat more, so
> that they can look healthy.
> * Normal Size People get 15 minutes for lunch to get a balanced meal to
> maintain their average figure.
> * Chubby People get 5 minutes for lunch, because that's all the time
> needed to drink a Slim-Fast.
> Thank you for your loyalty to our company. We are here to provide a
> positive employment experience.. Therefore, all questions, comments,
> concerns, complaints, frustrations, irritations, aggravations,
> insinuations, allegations, accusations, contemplations, consternation
> and input should be directed elsewhere.
>
> The Management
> Pass this on to all who are employed!
We do the same. Lose the first one? No problem. Lose the replacement? £10 fine. Not sure if there's a time limit on that because I've never lost one, but all the proximity cards have batteries in them and they do fail eventually (I had the honour of owning one of the oldest cards in the company for a while).
The company I work for has biometric data on me, we have to have our fingerprint scanned to get into our datacentre, I would have issues if it was used for more than this, but it isn't. It seems like you work for a petty company that where being 3 minutes late is an issue, OR managers doing what they do and inventing grand schemes to justify their job.
Seems harsh to require a fingerprint to sign in. I would have issues definitely.
Seems harsh to require a fingerprint to sign in. I would have issues definitely.
Should i be worried that i got down to Bathroom Breaks and realised its a joke.
Soldato
- Joined
- 13 Sep 2003
- Posts
- 8,550
- Location
- Glocestershire
If you'd already popped out to Oxfam for a new work wardrobe, then yes. Otherwise you might just get away with it, just don't go blabbing it on the internet.
Associate
- Joined
- 24 Jun 2007
- Posts
- 1,869
- Location
- Landan.
[obscure reference alert]
Close that ****in' thing would ya', those cookie things scare thashirroutame.
[/obscure reference]
You sound like a bit of a jobsworth. Furthermore, I think the only reason you created this thread is to have people say "Yeah, man, you tell those sucka's to shove the job right up their god damned asses" (perhaps maybe a little less American). That is, you wanted people to comment on how well principled you were by threatening to leave your job for the Orwellian cause.
The fact of the matter is, you're not. People have quite clearly explained that there is no way that this data can be used in a nefarious way - just to reiterate, the data stored will not be an image of your fingerprint, merely numerical data that in no way can be reverse engineered to give your original fingerprint. I forgot to add: I can't quite see why a company in India would be storing the data for you - why would you want a lookup transaction between wherever you're based to the other side of the world every time an employee clocks in? Smells like BS to me - no doubt scaremongering in the cafeteria or a plain ol' simple fallacy.
The fact of the matter is: it is simply the easiest and most effective system to use when designing a clocking in/out system. No cards have to be printed, the system itself is easy to use (i.e. swipe your finger - can't get much easier), there's no learning curve for employees etc.
You deserve the sack for being so awkward. Good luck in the new job.
Close that ****in' thing would ya', those cookie things scare thashirroutame.
[/obscure reference]
You sound like a bit of a jobsworth. Furthermore, I think the only reason you created this thread is to have people say "Yeah, man, you tell those sucka's to shove the job right up their god damned asses" (perhaps maybe a little less American). That is, you wanted people to comment on how well principled you were by threatening to leave your job for the Orwellian cause.
The fact of the matter is, you're not. People have quite clearly explained that there is no way that this data can be used in a nefarious way - just to reiterate, the data stored will not be an image of your fingerprint, merely numerical data that in no way can be reverse engineered to give your original fingerprint. I forgot to add: I can't quite see why a company in India would be storing the data for you - why would you want a lookup transaction between wherever you're based to the other side of the world every time an employee clocks in? Smells like BS to me - no doubt scaremongering in the cafeteria or a plain ol' simple fallacy.
The fact of the matter is: it is simply the easiest and most effective system to use when designing a clocking in/out system. No cards have to be printed, the system itself is easy to use (i.e. swipe your finger - can't get much easier), there's no learning curve for employees etc.
You deserve the sack for being so awkward. Good luck in the new job.
Last edited:
If your fingerprint is on a database it allows someone to easily frame you etc, eg government accesses private databases under new legislation, your fingerprint is on a murder weapon and then matches up against your profile. I simply wouldn't want my fingerprint on a database because of the mere possiblity that I may actually commit a crime in the future, nevermind getting wrongfully caught up in an investigation or being framed.
Well their current system of a manager doing it is really more effective, fingerprint readers can be easily fooled.
Last edited: