Energy Prices (Strictly NO referrals!)

SDK^ said:
So what are you suggesting Shell, the other energy companies and the regulators should do, that isn't already being done?
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It is hard to ultimately counter systematic greed in society.

We need a good old fashioned French Revolution to get things started.

That is where we are headed, as income equality grows deeper and deeper.

Eventually everyone will have enough.
 
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Jono8 said:
Hence why included the whole of Europe and the USA as an example....?

If it was just the UK, that is over £1000 per household...
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Right but since it is not. If you took profit being locked to 2021 level + inflation (to allow for growth) and then took the 5% of that then you would be left with £663 million or whatever I posted which per household in UK would be £177 reduction annually then.
 
bigmike20vt said:
i actually wish that would happen to me.... i imagine i could sue them for a fair amount............ on top of that the wife hates our front door and has been badgering me to replace for years.

in all seriousness that is disgraceful and illegal. how do they get away with it?
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What happens if they bash down your back door? :D
 
I get the hate for the big oil corps. People are struggling and than media let us all know about record profits.

But we can't have it both ways. Can't sell off our national resources then randomly pick a sector out of favour to tax. Imagine you have your own business and you have no idea when the tax man is going to raid your profits.

If we wanted windfalls we should have kept it public. But you have to ride the bad times then.


I totally get it. But can't just cash grab when it suits.
 
413x said:
I get the hate for the big oil corps. People are struggling and than media let us all know about record profits.

But we can't have it both ways. Can't sell off our national resources then randomly pick a sector out of favour to tax. Imagine you have your own business and you have no idea when the tax man is going to raid your profits.

If we wanted windfalls we should have kept it public. But you have to ride the bad times then.


I totally get it. But can't just cash grab when it suits.
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Fair enough but there are really only 3 ways forward from this position.

1) Just take whatever shafting is coming in your direction from private companies
2) Continue with the potentially faulty but also clearly somewhat workable windfall system, plenty of places do and have for some time including ourselves
3) Recognise privatisation was a mistake and nationalise

Personally I'm very much in favour of 3 but I get many aren't. I think in many cases it's for the same knee jerk reaction that much of the west has been brainwashed into.. essentially leftism = bad despite the fact capitalism has hardly been a cake walk for most.
 
i generally dont even consider myself left............. (or right) i swing both ways depending on the topic......

but despite that i think privatising essential services is an absolutely terrible decision, esp the privatisation we have, which to me seems like if things are profitable................. share holders make bank

if things go to crap........... then the government bail them out anyway (ultimately with our money)....

so its all stick for us with naff all carrot.

Then there is the water......... one of the great excuses for privatising that was that the infrastructure was crumbling and if privatised it would be modernised........... years later the infrastructure is still crumbling, and we are pumping record amounts of raw sewage into the wild. (and our bills are high as well)
 
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matt100 said:
Fair enough but there are really only 3 ways forward from this position.

1) Just take whatever shafting is coming in your direction from private companies
2) Continue with the potentially faulty but also clearly somewhat workable windfall system, plenty of places do and have for some time including ourselves
3) Recognise privatisation was a mistake and nationalise

Personally I'm very much in favour of 3 but I get many aren't. I think in many cases it's for the same knee jerk reaction that much of the west has been brainwashed into.. essentially leftism = bad despite the fact capitalism has hardly been a cake walk for most.
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Its frightening really. Especially with AI and the inroads it's making. Big corps are getting too powerful. And the US promotes it. I get the feeling even the US Democrats are getting wary of the power of a very few corps.


I agree its getting to the point where the system has gone from making life broadly better to going the other way. Too much wealth in too few hands.

But needs to change broadly. Not a few spot cases.

I expect, knowing politics, by the time the penny drops it will be too late.
Covid, environment, population, economy... Government react too late every time. You can literally see the earth dying environmentally. Putin has probably been the biggest push to accelerate green adoption in the last decade. Because, as always, it all comes down to money. The current push for reneables is only because of the cost of fossil fuels.


This reactive approach is why I think we are doomed. The environment is the big one. It's going to make covid, war, recessions look like a 100 piece jigsaw puzzle.

And you can guarantee the politicians will pull out some sort of "how we're we to know" excuse.
 
bigmike20vt said:
i generally dont even consider myself left............. (or right) i swing both ways depending on the topic......

but despite that i think privatising essential services is an absolutely terrible decision, esp the privatisation we have, which to me seems like if things are profitable................. share holders make bank

if things go to crap........... then the government bail them out anyway (ultimately with our money)....

so its all stick for us with naff all carrot.

Then there is the water......... one of the great excuses for privatising that was that the infrastructure was crumbling and if privatised it would be modernised........... years later the infrastructure is still crumbling, and we are pumping record amounts of raw sewage into the wild. (and our bills are high as well)
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Indeed. Essential utilities and transport should all be nationalised and not run for profit. As you say, they can seldom lose as they either take us all to the cleaners, or get bailed out by our tax money anyway if they fail.

If we had competent leadership to direct our tax to run them properly it would most likely work.
 
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Jono8 said:
Indeed. Essential utilities and transport should all be nationalised and not run for profit. As you say, they can seldom lose as they either take us all to the cleaners, or get bailed out by our tax money anyway if they fail.

If we had competent leadership to direct our tax to run them properly it would most likely work.
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Yeah, the counter argument is that with little accountability public sector services are badly managed and inefficient. Then again, we've seen how well private companies have done managing the East Coast Main Line train franchise, Trans-Pennine Express, etc. so.....
 
Karl said:
I'm looking at this octopus tracker, but I'm finding it pretty impenetrable as to whether I'll be any better off if I switch to it. I get that prices change on the tracker, but how do I tell whether I'll be better off if I go from:

Gas:
Unit Rate 10.43p/kWh
Standing Charge 26.84p/day
Estimated Annual Usage 11446 kWh

Electric:
Unit Rate 33.70p/kWh
Standing Charge 51p/day
Estimated Annual Usage 4476.2 kWh


to tracker?

I can see the tracker standing charges are the same, and the rates I'm guessing at the moment are cheaper, but Octopus gets right to the final step with a direct debit of £248.84 a month. I'm currently paying £160 a month, and am massively in credit. I can't see any option to adjust that DD value before I check out either.
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DD isnt your bill, ignore it.

After you registered 1-2 months with them, get the DD amount adjusted to your actual usage. If £160 actually covers your costs now at higher unit rates then its going to cover it on a cheaper tracker, but the question is does the £160 actually cover your current bill?
 
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413x said:
I get the hate for the big oil corps. People are struggling and than media let us all know about record profits.

But we can't have it both ways. Can't sell off our national resources then randomly pick a sector out of favour to tax. Imagine you have your own business and you have no idea when the tax man is going to raid your profits.

If we wanted windfalls we should have kept it public. But you have to ride the bad times then.


I totally get it. But can't just cash grab when it suits.
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Tax is never assured, anyone doing business should realistically know and accept that.

Windfall profits, windfall tax in extraordinary times, its not just a random tax grab.

We shouldnt have sold off the resources in my opinion. But we cant turn back the clock.
 
Daft question...

I'm on British Gas's Standard Variable Tariff for both gas/electricity. Is there any reason that I shouldn't change to Octopus (flexibleOctopus tariff) given that the kWh and SC are lower? I thought I'd read somewhere that if you move, you lose the Energy Bills Discount Scheme payment?
 
chrcoluk said:
DD isnt your bill, ignore it.

After you registered 1-2 months with them, get the DD amount adjusted to your actual usage. If £160 actually covers your costs now at higher unit rates then its going to cover it on a cheaper tracker, but the question is does the £160 actually cover your current bill?
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I've been with Octopus since Avro went under, so already a customer of theirs. It was more a question of changing from a legacy standard tariff to the tracker one. I've done it now, and at present, the rates are indeed a fair bit cheaper. Should knock about £25 a month off the bill if it stayed exactly there (which it won't) and the seasons didn't change (which they will) :D

The DD does cover my bill with allowance for a bit of erosion of my credit (I'm > £400 in credit).

I'll keep an eye on it now I've switched and see what happens.
 
British Gas can’t even get my bill right even with a smart meter. The bill is around £140 extra over 137 day period than what their online app is showing for usage. As far as I know the app includes standing charge and the 5% VAT. I have also had to estimate January usage (doubled it) as app only tracks usage upto January 17th.

I believed smart meters were to enable accurate billing, not with British Gas!

Oh and my smart meter remote display no longer works (well does but buttons stopped working so cannot cycle through options etc.) and constantly beeps (again cannot use buttons so cannot troubleshoot it) was installed in 2017 and doesn’t look I can get free replacement.

And don’t get me started on the direct debit estimates! We have considerably dropped elec usage from last year which has totally messed up DD estimates, means in credit, but means it’s in their bank not mine!
 
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I think the sudden changes in prices last year have totally messed things up. Like you, my DD estimates I feel are way out. They’ve hiked up with the price increases, but I’ve cut my usage markedly, so the 2 are fighting each other to find the new level going forward, which I think will need the full 12 months to settle.
 
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