Solar tax lol.
If it's fair that everyone pays then the existing standing charge works fine.
Energy Prices (Strictly NO referrals!)
- Thread starter DXP55
- Start date
If it's fair that everyone pays then the existing standing charge works fine.
Soldato
But what about the off-grid tax!?
I'd disagree with a solar tax, a bit like car duty, the most fair way to do it would be to add it onto the price of pertol/diesel and do away with the tax, i.e. the more you use, the more you pay.
I cant really think of a more fair way to do it.
I do appreciate it's more complicated though, as you say, those who can afford to self generate electricity would benefit disproportionatly.
But back to the standing charge, I for example have no debt, and no solar but I think I'm going to cough up for a panel and battery array some time this year.
Living on my own, the standing charge actually punishes me as it's huge portion of my bill, about 30% IIRC as I have LED everything inc OLED TVs and monitors, PC's that hardly use anything when idle etc.
The largest portion of my electric bill, after the standing charge is down to me boiling the kettle 3 times in a morning for coffee (and yes I only put the bare minimum of water in the kettle, up to the minimum line on my kettle is approx 1.5/2 cups of water).
After that would be microwave, fridge and freezer, but they are basicaly fixed unavaoidable electric costs. And router, I suppose, but that hardly uses anything to speak of.
My cooker is gas, so that helps, but my weekly elecRtic consumption is about £12 to £15 quid (inc standing charge).
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Soldato
The existing standing charge is not proportionate between rich and poor.
There are things within the standing charge that should be paid proportionately according to wealth/income.
I would say these things probably shouldn't be in the energy bill at all actually, they should be paid from general taxation then everyone contributes proportionate to income.
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Soldato
We still pay the same unit rate as you would, we just wouldnt import as much. So we shouldnt need to pay a tax as we are less reliant on the grid.
BUT….we also pay the 5% vat, so again i dont get why we should pay more, for using less. Makes no sense at all.
Soldato
But what about people on benefits? they don't pay anything then.
You can't win by trying to make everyone pay for things.
You can't win by trying to make everyone pay for things.
Soldato
So what in the standing charge should wealthy people pay more towards???
Im not wealthy in the slightest, but saved up for my solar system, so why should i pay tax for using less energy from the grid
Soldato
Let's say that vulnerable customer support (aka social tariffs) was added onto the unit rate. As you have solar and import far less than everyone else, you wouldn't be paying your fair share towards supporting vulnerable customers. I.e as a more wealthy person who can afford solar, you'd manage to avoid paying to support social tariffs for example.
The same argument applies to other types of cost that get included in the unit rate.
You shouldn't be paying for the energy generated, obviously, but you should still be contributing to the societal aspects which get loaded (currently) into the unit rate.
Soldato
I would be paying my fare share, based on my import and reliance on the grid. And i am far from wealthy
Soldato
By your logic if someone isn't using the NHS they shouldn't pay for it then?
You're argument really supports keeping the standing charge, it does everything you want it to. The last thing you want to be doing is discouraging uptake of renewables.
Soldato
In some ways yes i agree……as a non parent i also shouldnt pay for schools, but i do.
I also pay tax on the energy i use, and pay for all the other things that within my SC and import costs. Paying for solar and using less energy from the grid, is a benefit to everyone, not just me…..now you want to tax me for it, sheeesh.
Next you will be telling i should pay more for fuel. As i work from home and use the car less than others…..but i still pay my share out of PAYE for the up keep of the roads.
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Soldato
All I'm saying is that people with solar shouldn't avoid the societal costs that everyone should take a proportionate share in.
Problem with standing charge is it's not proportionate to income/wealth. So it tends to impact poorer people more, same as car tax does.
You could argue that people with solar are already paying a tax of sorts, as in when they sell excess power back to the grid, they get a really crappy price per unit compared to what it costs to buy a unit from the power company.
But then I also think all utility companies should be re-nationalised and not-for-proft...
...But someone has to make sure the senior management of private utility companies are kept in big fat bonuses and hefty pensions... even when they catastrophicaly fail to do the job properly!
But then I also think all utility companies should be re-nationalised and not-for-proft...
...But someone has to make sure the senior management of private utility companies are kept in big fat bonuses and hefty pensions... even when they catastrophicaly fail to do the job properly!
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Soldato
Frankly whilst I earlier lold In now getting angry with your selfishness and short sightedness
We need to transition to green
Dans idea, lets impose a tax that makes that less likely.
You REALLY should think before you post whatever the latest thing that benefits your personally and screw everyone else that pops into your mind.
Soldato
Utter nonsense, if it goes on unit rate, i will pay proportionately based on what i use…..which is how it should be.
And lower income people will pay less based on their use and being able to negate the standing charge.
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Soldato
Dont get shirty with me. As usual, you arent understanding or comprehending what I am trying to say, probably because of your usual biases towards me.
My suggestions are the EXACT OPPOSITE from selfishness. They are to make the system fairer, not less fair.
As usual you just dismiss my views thinking its all because I will benefit from it.
Soldato
Probably because your talking nonsense……
Soldato
Are you all being deliberately thick or what?
If there is a charge included in the unit rate of energy, and you are on solar so hardly use any energy, then you won't be paying towards that charge.
If that charge is there to be RE-DISTRIBUTIVE, like for example a social tariff contribution or green tax, then you won't be paying it.
If the standing charge is a fixed amount for everyone equally, then you can be rich or poor and still pay the same amount. Your house can be massive or small and you still pay the same amount. If elements of that standing charge are designed to be RE-DISTRIBUTIVE, then poorer people will be paying a larger proportion of those costs compared to richer people. THE EXACT OPPOSITE FROM HOW TAXES WORK IN THIS COUNTRY.
It is not me who is being selfish here - it is all of you.
If there is a charge included in the unit rate of energy, and you are on solar so hardly use any energy, then you won't be paying towards that charge.
If that charge is there to be RE-DISTRIBUTIVE, like for example a social tariff contribution or green tax, then you won't be paying it.
If the standing charge is a fixed amount for everyone equally, then you can be rich or poor and still pay the same amount. Your house can be massive or small and you still pay the same amount. If elements of that standing charge are designed to be RE-DISTRIBUTIVE, then poorer people will be paying a larger proportion of those costs compared to richer people. THE EXACT OPPOSITE FROM HOW TAXES WORK IN THIS COUNTRY.
It is not me who is being selfish here - it is all of you.