Soldato
- Joined
- 19 Oct 2002
- Posts
- 17,706
- Location
- Shakespeare’s County
Like the Honda E and Mini-E then?
EV general discussion
- Thread starter Ricochet J
- Start date
Soldato
- Joined
- 23 May 2006
- Posts
- 7,964
i dont use twitter and dont want to click on GBNews link so sorry if i am getting it wrong however.
will this be new cars only or some form of incentive for all EV cars? if it is the former then that is a little annoying as there are already huge incentives for lots of people on new cars.
i would rather have an incentive for ALL EV drivers......... and the obvious easy one is............. zero Car tax for EVs, which is about to be removed.
seems a bit silly to take away with one hand a perk which encourages all onto EVs whilst adding a perk which will benefit only those wealthy enough to buy a new car.
Last edited:
It is very much along those lines but with an answer to the comments about range that scuppered the Honda and original Mini by offering it with a 52kWh and being more keenly priced than the Honda as well.
Plus, to my eyes, it looks like a pretty neat design. Between concept and production the Honda E went a bit flacid and the new Mini isn't a good look.
Its to give a boost to the industry so why would they incentivise cars that are already out there? Those are on the books already, job done.
Soldato
- Joined
- 23 May 2006
- Posts
- 7,964
perhaps however that is quite short term thinking imo (which goverment are experts at!) however 2nd hand sales are still part of the eco system, a healthy 2nd hand market surely is key for a healthy new car market...... and besides (just looking at the image like i said not read the link) but it claims the aim is to get people out of diesel or petrol cars.
a person moving from an old banger diesel to an EV is still "job done" on that metric regardless of if new or 2nd hand.
Last edited:
I completely agree, although it was always on the cards (the tax).
Its a subsidised loan scheme that is being put forward. To this know nothing luddite that sounds like a fantastically daft idea to get more "working people" on the hook for a car that they don't need.
The second hand market is already well stocked with heavily depreciated cars, that part of the problem is already solving itself. What they are aiming for is for more of the cars being added to the UKs motor pool to have a battery instead of a fuel tank. That will ultimately lead to wider second hand availability anyway through good old supply and demand.
Lets be straight and call it out for what it is, a token gesture (or suggestion of at this stage) to allow them to power on with 2030 / ZEV mandate while telling the industry that they are helping.
I would not trust any article that comes for Farage's GB News at all, not even fit to be a food wrapper. Reeves stated nothing today about EV's and that's not really her role and it is down to the transport minister for such announcement.
The Honda e was expensive and sacrificed range for tech. A real shame they didn't revise it with a more "basic" model as it still looks great and it could've competed with the R5 nicely.
The Mini has more performance but it's expensive, 3dr (even if the rear seats in the R5 aren't the roomiest) and I'm personally not keen on only having the single centre display.
Soldato
- Joined
- 19 Oct 2002
- Posts
- 17,706
- Location
- Shakespeare’s County
I can keep going with other cars, i just see people getting a big too much R5 Turbo nostalgia for a FWD Scrabble wagon (albeit lightweight) The Megane looks great. the e-208, Cupra Born, Fiat 500e. Dont get me wrong its a great looking car the R5 but its not breaking a wall of non SUV EVs
Soldato
- Joined
- 23 May 2006
- Posts
- 7,964
as a past fiat coupe owner i dont mind FWD cars... and as for the R5 not being especially revolutionary.... perhaps not...... personally i am all about the eye candy with that car...... so long as all the other boxes ticked are "good enough" which for a 2nd car for me they seem to be then i am really optimistic for it.
on top of that the massive thing for it which makes it way better than the mini and esp the honda E is its price!.
on top of that the massive thing for it which makes it way better than the mini and esp the honda E is its price!.
Soldato
- Joined
- 19 Oct 2002
- Posts
- 17,706
- Location
- Shakespeare’s County
Yeah but you actually bought an IPACE so not sure it squares off the comments from the 'this is the first EV im interested in' crowd...
I think she's got to do something favouring EU(uk?) built products versus chinese, otherwise she's shipping money out to china ie. catchup with what usa/eu already did;
how much of the new BYD uk infrastructure is because UK is the weakest link (until they have eu manufacturing)
....
I thought the R5 turbo ev was 4wd (6r4 style)
Soldato
- Joined
- 23 May 2006
- Posts
- 7,964
looks are subjective, its what grabbed me with the R5 but discounting that, if i had to guess i think price has to play a large part....... combined with the fact that not everyone wants an SUV. the R5 is a small(ish) car which still has a fairly usable range.
yes there was already some very good smallish usable cars out there such as the ID3 etc, but they were a lot more expensive (and still not as small).....and whilst you could buy a 2nd hand ID3 for less than a new R5, some people like buying brand new (I dont get that logic myself) ... I would hope there will be some incredibly tempting lease deals on it as well.
Also (slight stereotype sexist comment) I think the R5 in its bright colours may appeal to women a lot more than cars like the ID3...
bottom line it does not really matter why, I just hope it sells well....
Last edited:
The Renault 5 EV is a front wheel drive, 120-150bhp regular small hatchback
The Alpine A290 is a front wheel drive, 220bhp variant of the Renault 5
The Renault 5 Turbo 3E EV is a rear wheel drive 500bhp halo car, that'll probably cost well over £100,000 and be sold in ridiculously limited numbers
Soldato
- Joined
- 19 Oct 2002
- Posts
- 17,706
- Location
- Shakespeare’s County
Love that succinct summary of a product offering. No garbled waffle there - nice one.
You say that, but this article only repeats what the FT is saying:
UK ministers plan to subsidise EV loans to drive sales
State could underwrite private sector loans to reduce monthly repayments and purchase costs
www.ft.com
Many such tales....
He's the head of a 'Energy and Climate Intelligence Unit' think tank as well.
The "EV sales are continuing to rise without issue" crowd are nearly as an egregious a bunch of liars as the "wind and solar energy are 'cheap'" crowd and both desperately need to be quickly brought to task before they cause a even bigger issues.
He's the head of a 'Energy and Climate Intelligence Unit' think tank as well.
The "EV sales are continuing to rise without issue" crowd are nearly as an egregious a bunch of liars as the "wind and solar energy are 'cheap'" crowd and both desperately need to be quickly brought to task before they cause a even bigger issues.
Last edited:
The fact remains true..You say that, but this article only repeats what the FT is saying:
UK ministers plan to subsidise EV loans to drive sales
State could underwrite private sector loans to reduce monthly repayments and purchase costs
Yet the entire article doesn't actually say they are doing it, just plans...
UK ministers are drawing up plans to subsidise electric car purchases by guaranteeing consumer loans, as they look at ways to drive up sales that remain stubbornly below official targets.
The government has opened private discussions with the auto finance sector to try to increase the availability of low-interest or interest-free loans to help boost the take-up of EVs, according to government and industry figures.
One option being discussed is for the state to underwrite private sector loans to reduce the monthly repayments to help bring EV purchase costs to levels closer to petrol or diesel vehicles, the people said.
The move would be welcomed by the car industry — which has struggled to sell EVs in volumes required by government targets — and would be tantamount to an admission that the consumer subsidies scrapped in 2022 were phased out too early.
Although EVs remain more expensive to buy outright than traditional engine-driven vehicles, more than 80 per cent of the new cars in the UK are bought using finance or lease deals according to the Finance & Leasing Association.
Carmakers have been urging ministers to introduce new demand-side measures to encourage consumers to buy more electric cars, as well as to accelerate the rollout of charging points.
Sales of EVs are growing in the UK, but remain far below official targets, and are concentrated in the company car sector, where generous tax incentives still exist.
Car manufacturers such as Volkswagen, Ford and Renault are under pressure to hit stretching targets for EV sales under the government’s “zero-emission vehicle mandate”, which requires a certain percentage of each carmakers’ annual sales to be zero-emission vehicles.
The percentage is set to rise from 28 per cent this year to 80 per cent in 2030, with companies facing fines of £15,000 for each missed vehicle.
Stellantis last year said the costs of complying with the scheme was partly behind its decision to close its Luton van factory, putting 1,100 jobs at risk, while Ford also blamed the mandate as it cut 800 UK roles last year in a wider European restructuring.
EVs accounted for 19.6 per cent of new cars sold in the UK last year, which was below the required 22 per cent target, according to figures from the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders.
Recommended
The government is currently consulting the auto industry on how to improve the “arrangements and flexibilities” in the scheme to try to give manufacturers more breathing space.
Ministers are unlikely to bring back cash incentives for EV purchases because of the direct cost to the Treasury. The previous plug-in car grant scheme, which paid out £5,000 for an EV, was reduced over time and eventually scrapped in 2022 by the Conservative government.
The potential intervention on EVs comes after Labour chancellor Rachel Reeves weighed into a Supreme Court case to prevent the motor finance sector having to pay out billions in compensation to consumers.
The rise of pay-monthly deals for car purchases has transformed the country’s auto finance sector. The most popular finance deal is called a “personal contract purchase”, which is a pay-monthly scheme that sees motorists finance the value a vehicle loses over three years rather than the total cost of the car.
The collapse in used prices for electric vehicles in the past two years means that EV repayments are typically higher than for petrol cars.
Adrian Dally, FLA’s motor finance director, said zero-interest loans would not fully equalise the cost between EVs and internal combustion vehicles, but he added: “If there was a way where the government could underwrite cheaper loans . . . that would be extremely helpful.”
The impact of the scheme on the public finances will depend on how the UK decides to structure any support. Ministers hope that a change in the government’s debt target to a new measure called “public sector net financial liabilities” — that counts more assets alongside public liabilities — could help the proposal.
A Department for Transport spokesperson declined to comment on the FT report but said 2024 was a “record year for switching to electric” with 382,000 EVs sold and nearly 20,000 public chargers added to the network.
“We’re investing over £2.3 billion to support industry and consumers make the switch.”
