EV general discussion

[b0rn2sk8]

I’m not sure where you are getting your numbers but the current price cap is around 26p/kwh and fixes are available at around 25p. That’s the most you’ll pay at home.

I know just one person who has an EV but isn’t on an EV tariff. Their usage is so low, it just doesn’t make sense to be on one. Everyone else (10’s of people) are all on some form of an EV tariff. They all do the vast majority of charging at home, to the point their public charging costs are almost irrelevant.

I get you have a bee in your bonnet about a van/MPV being given family car of the year but I’m not seeing the big issue. Most people don’t consider a Ford focus to be a ‘family’ car anymore. Mid-sized hatch backs don’t have a monopoly on ‘family’ cars.

Pretty much everything with 6 seats or more is over £40k, the PV5 is competitively priced with similar vehicles.

It’s also a big boxy vehicle with a lot of utility and space. ICE equivalents are not going to be hitting anything close to 15p/mile as your comparison point. You’re probably looking at MPG in the high-20’s in reality as an average, especially if it is used on the school run/around town. 28mpg in diesel land is like 27p/mile at the moment.

 

[Alexrose1uk]

For reference an MG.4 long range can be had in special offer for ~£22k.

If a Focus at £21k is a good family option, then an MG4 with 250 summer and 200 winter range is even better. It would save well ~£1000 -£1500 per year on fuel costs.

We really have reached price parity. Even used you end up with much more car for your money considering the first year or two depreciation on EVs. By year 3 on the depreciation curve starts to actually favour EV, and that’s before any fuel savings.

I would actually normally agree, however the reason the MG4 is that cheap is because of its horrendous reliability record! There is a reason Robert Llewelyn and Which? both put out reports about the suss safety features!
My one was so bad it scared the inspectors.

The actual RRP for the MG4 was meant to be considerably higher, and has dropped down because of market pressure and the lack of trust. I'd much rather recommend a Hyundai Insta/BYD Dolphin, than an MG4, where you're absolutely rolling the dice!

 

[ICDP]

A lot of enthusiast do, but once you start moving towards family cars, you have to consider that the average family car driver will not be as clued up, and is far more likely to be driven by the mum etc. Looking at the average consumer, most of them just cannot be relied upon to manage charging cycles etc, they just want to plug in and have done. That's a very real reality.

And the reason special offers get brought up on cars is because they regularly do, I got several K off mine, you just have to be in the right place at the right time, and the more common/more available the vehicle, the more likely discounts are to get pushed.

To quote google:
"Brand-new Ford Focus models typically see discounts of £3,000 to £6,000 off RRP. While exact 2026 Focus base models start around £28,500 , aggressive broker deals and dealer contributions regularly drop the price closer to the £21,000 to £23,000 mark for new or unregistered entry-level and ST-Line variants. [1, 2, 3, 4]

Typical New Focus Deals

• Entry / Titanium Trims: RRPs start at £29,575 , but broker platforms frequently discount these to £21,000 – £23,000 depending on stock.
• ST-Line / Active Trims: Sportier and mid-range trims typically list for £30,000+, but dealer discounts and factory deposit contributions bring the cash price down to £24,000 – £25,000. [1, 2, 3, 4]

How to Achieve a £21,000 Price Point

1. Pre-Registered Models: Nearly-new cars with less than 500 miles on the clock are one of the best ways to hit this target without sacrificing new-car condition . [1]
2. Online Brokers: Using platforms like Carwow or UK Car Discount allows you to source vehicles from dealerships nationwide that need to meet quarterly targets, often resulting in massive RRP markdowns. [1, 2, 3]
3. Ford Privilege / Advantage: If you are an employee of Ford, a supplier company, or have a direct family member who is, you can access the Ford Privilege Scheme, which allows significant manufacturer savings (sometimes up to £6,000 off). [1, 2]"

It's very possible to get a deal, if you're in the right place, at the right time, and after the right car.

But that special offer stuff applies to all cars, not just ICE. On carwow they have thousands of pounds off new EVs. If the MG.4 is not your cup of tea, how about a Cupra Born? I have one and it is a great EV, apart from a few rattles it has had no major issues at 3 years old.

EV Deals | Save Up To £7,340

Explore hundreds of EV deals with savings of up to £7,340. Take advantage of the government electric car grant and exclusive offers from EV manufacturers.

www.carwow.co.uk

 

[Alexrose1uk]

I’m not sure where you are getting your numbers but the current price cap is around 26p/kwh and fixes are available at around 25p. That’s the most you’ll pay at home.

Literally from looking at tariffs this last few weeks, and yesterday. As an example, I just went on Eon, a fairly middle of the road, to look at thier variable tariff, and the standard day rate is 30.53p per Kwh, so no, unfortunately your figures are off.

 

[Alexrose1uk]

But that special offer stuff applies to all cars, not just ICE. On carwow they have £6k off a new MG.4 long range. Making it £22,500.

If you want one with a longer range, the 77kWh version can be had for ~£26k, £6,500 off RRP.

It does to a degree, and again I'm discounting the MG4 because of it's safety record.
But some cars, based on volume, like the Ford Focus, do regularly get large dealer discounts, so it's not unreasonable to say that.

 

[ICDP]

It does to a degree, and again I'm discounting the MG4 because of it's safety record.
But some cars, based on volume, like the Ford Focus, do regularly get large dealer discounts, so it's not unreasonable to say that.

Apologies I edited my post to give a wider range of EVs offers given your perfectly reasonable aversion to the MG.4.

EV Deals | Save Up To £7,340

Explore hundreds of EV deals with savings of up to £7,340. Take advantage of the government electric car grant and exclusive offers from EV manufacturers.

www.carwow.co.uk

 

[ICDP]

It does to a degree, and again I'm discounting the MG4 because of it's safety record.
But some cars, based on volume, like the Ford Focus, do regularly get large dealer discounts, so it's not unreasonable to say that.

Apologies I edited my post to give a wider range of EVs offers given your perfectly reasonable aversion to the MG.4.

EV Deals | Save Up To £7,340

Explore hundreds of EV deals with savings of up to £7,340. Take advantage of the government electric car grant and exclusive offers from EV manufacturers.

www.carwow.co.uk

 

[Alexrose1uk]

Apologies I edited my post to give a wider range of EVs offers given your perfectly reasonable aversion to the MG.4.

EV Deals | Save Up To £7,340

Explore hundreds of EV deals with savings of up to £7,340. Take advantage of the government electric car grant and exclusive offers from EV manufacturers.

www.carwow.co.uk

And to be honest that also perfectly aligns with my point there are much better, more realistic family choices than a 34-40K PV5

 

[ICDP]

And to be honest that also perfectly aligns with my point there are much better, more realistic family choices than a 34-40K PV5

It’s a bit of a wide brush, some families need that kind of space and even if it is “only” giving 2.5 mi/kWh in winter, that’s still the equivalent of 80mpg.

I wouldn’t get hung up on anything these “professional” reviews sites publish.

 

[Alexrose1uk]

It’s a bit of a wide brush, some families need that kind of space and even if it is “only” giving 2.5 mi/kWh in winter, that’s still the equivalent of 80mpg.

I wouldn’t get hung up on anything these “professional” reviews sites publish.

I guess not, I just find it quite egregious. The walk I've just done through a large car park in a not particularly poor area highlights that a 35-40k, relatively meh efficiency minivan is definately not what the average family have or are going for haha

Good reviewers take this stuff onboard when giving thier recommendations!

 

[b0rn2sk8]

My figures are not ‘off’ they are literally the numbers for my postcode today.

You also quoted 33p which is 10% higher than the number you quoted in your second post. 30p is a day rate on an EV tariff but your point is typical motorists are not on EVs tariffs so that rate is irrelevant. I’m also not sure that assertion is accurate, it’s certainly not my lived experience.

The region with the highest price cap is Merseyside/north wales at 27.6p. Everyone else is below 26.5p and the lowest is the East Midlands at 25.1.

The average is 26.1 according to Ofgem:

Changes to energy price cap between 1 July and 30 September 2026

Changes to the maximum amount energy suppliers can charge people on default tariffs for each unit of energy and the daily standing charge from 1 July to 30 September 2026.

www.ofgem.gov.uk

I think your numbers are off

 

[b0rn2sk8]

I guess not, I just find it quite egregious. The walk I've just done through a large car park in a not particularly poor area highlights that a 35-40k, relatively meh efficiency minivan is definately not what the average family have or are going for haha

Good reviewers take this stuff onboard when giving thier recommendations!

If it was the prize for the most average car, it wouldn’t be called ‘family car of the year’, it wouldn’t be called ‘the most average car of the year’.

This argument is no different to all the caravan people who get uppity on Facebook when the caravan club names a Porcshe SUV as tow car of the year.

It’s not about what is representative, it’s about the best of the new cars launched that year.

 

[Alexrose1uk]

My figures are not ‘off’ they are literally the numbers for my postcode today.

You also quoted 33p which is 10% higher than the number you quoted in your second post. 30p is a day rate on an EV tariff but your point is typical motorists are not on EVs tariffs so that rate is irrelevant. I’m also not sure that assertion is accurate, it’s certainly not my lived experience.

The region with the highest price cap is Merseyside/north wales at 27.6p. Everyone else is below 26.5p and the lowest is the East Midlands at 25.1.

The average is 26.1 according to Ofgem:

Changes to energy price cap between 1 July and 30 September 2026

Changes to the maximum amount energy suppliers can charge people on default tariffs for each unit of energy and the daily standing charge from 1 July to 30 September 2026.

www.ofgem.gov.uk

I think your numbers are off

Like I said I just quoted a middle of the road tariff, Eon at 30.53p per kwh standard variable tariff, from literally off thier site this evening. NOT an EV day tariff.
I've seen much higher around me when looking at replacement tariffs this last few weeks, so unfortunately Ill take that real world 30+p as quite realistic thanks. (I very much miss the days of sub 15p!)

I also made it quite clear I was ballparking 30+ plus ev charger uplift, with some wiggle room, so 33p was a catch all with just shy of 10% wiggle room.

Factor in a little average fast charger use each month at 65-95p per kwh and then an averaged 40p becomes very easy, but the exact figure doesnt really matter too much whether itd be 37.5 or 42.5p per kwh lol

 

[b0rn2sk8]

Like I said I just quoted a middle of the road tariff, Eon at 30.53p per kwh standard variable tariff, from literally off thier site this evening. Ive seen much higher around me when looking at replacement tariffs this last few weeks, so unfortunately Ill take that real world 30+p as quite realistic thanks.

I also made it quite clear I was ballparking 30+ plus ev charger uplift, with some wiggle room, so 33p was a catch all with just shy of 10% wiggle room.

That isn’t a middle of the road tariff. It’s the day rate on their EV tariff.

I just checked Eon for a postcode in the north wales area which is the most expensive region.

The most expensive tariff is the price cap at 27.6p

They offer a 12 or 24 month fix for 23.1p.

30p isn’t realistic, sorry, it just isn’t.

You also can’t go making the point that people don’t care about time of use and then quote day rates for time of use tariffs and then uplift them further for the fun of it and claim it’s representative while also claiming off peak rates are not representative. It’s a complete contradiction.

 

[Alexrose1uk]

If it was the prize for the most average car, it wouldn’t be called ‘family car of the year’, it wouldn’t be called ‘the most average car of the year’.

This argument is no different to all the caravan people who get uppity on Facebook when the caravan club names a Porcshe SUV as tow car of the year.

It’s not about what is representative, it’s about the best of the new cars launched that year.

This is where I fundamentally think we are coming at this from very different viewpoints. Without pricing for the target market you end up with the 60k Range Rover or the 250k Hummer as the best family car. They're bigger, they've got more capabilities etc etc, but fundamentally they're not the best if theyre impractical or priced out of reach.

The family car should be the best rounded vehicle that an average UK family should buy, not the best vehicle with no limits.

 

[Alexrose1uk]

That isn’t a middle of the road tariff. It’s the day rate on their EV tariff.

I just checked Eon for a postcode in the north wales area which is the most expensive region.

The most expensive tariff is the price cap at 27.6p

They offer a 12 or 24 month fix for 23.1p.

30p isn’t realistic, sorry, it just isn’t.

You also can’t go making the point that people don’t care about time of use and then quote day rates for time of use tariffs and then uplift them further for the fun of it and claim it’s representative while also claiming off peak rates are not representative. It’s a complete contradiction.

Sorry dude, this highlights you are out of touch.
Next flex, Eon's variable tariff, on the MK10 postcode, not an ev tariff. Standard rate 30.53p.

 

[Kenai]

The family car should be the best rounded vehicle that an average UK family should buy

Which Auto Express think is the PV5

 

[tom_e]

They must not like you, that's the unit cost across a few different MK10 postcodes.

Even their peak EV tariff prices don't break 28p.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

Sorry dude, this highlights you are out of touch.
Next flex, Eon's variable tariff, on the MK10 postcode, not an ev tariff. Standard rate 30.53p.

See above.

Every price I have quoted, I have generated today in the moments before posting them. I already stated that this and where I have got them from, I'm not sure how I can be more 'in touch' with this point.

I have no idea where you are getting your prices.

 

[Jonnycoupe]

Who’s this Alex guy? Where you popped up from? Playing catch up on word count?