https://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/average-speed-cameras-installed-notorious-15328278
Surprised it has taken this long, frankly.
Surprised it has taken this long, frankly.
Evo Triangle: Your fun is up.
- Thread starter Housey
- Start date
It is a good road, great sections but it’s just a good road and not something you can’t find elsewhere. It has some sections where you have good visibility and can therefore join up some of the sections but for me the straight sections are for slowing down not carrying big speed but too many drive it flat out everywhere and that’s just daft.
Ive driven to it many times but just to have a place to drive to rather than seeking the event of the place,
Ive driven to it many times but just to have a place to drive to rather than seeking the event of the place,
Yes.
Then there is the real world....
Last week for the first time in a long time, I sat on the M40 coming North in the inside lane at a fixed 70mph on cruise control for perhaps 30 miles. Outside of a few lorries I caught, not a single vehicle bar 1 car who was driving like me (I assume this was you?) EVERYTHING passed me in my line of site. Some of them by a few MPH, some of them by significant speed differentials but I was, lorries and 1 other motorist aside, the slowest car in my local vicinity. I watched cars come up behind me, also in the inside lane and pull out to overtake, bar the 1 who sat with me for most of the 30 miles. No one died, speed did not kill anyone and everyone got on with going from A to B without impacting anyone else.
Now if you think and arbitrary legal limit is there to stop deaths then you are obviously going to support sticking to limits, as I do in many road situations and I think if you break the law and get caught then pay your dues and don't moan about it. However, if you think most of the time speed has no impact on life, but bad driving does, then you might understand why many people think a car carrying 15mph-20mph speed on a relatively clear motorway isn't a problem to anyone, if the drivers are driving with due car an attention. Saying "if they had due care and attention they would be doing the speed limit" also misses the point too just in case that was a come back...
I am all for more testing. I know what I was like at 19, which is why I was banned for reckless driving I guess. Special type on nutter with zero fear, like most 19 year olds and I too thought I was the greatest as I was sprinting from 16 so had a bit of fast car off track experience and was a 'race driver init'. Now at 51 self preservation becomes much more important as I have a much better understanding of what wrong looks like and how it can impact the lives of others. I still on occasions 'push on' but would like to think it is far more measured than most and I would argue I do know how to drive at speed, having done the training and having lots of experience of fast cars in the last 20 years. It is why on the OCUK meet in built up areas (or any others of course) I don't speed and only keep the taps open where I know I can stop before I get to something I cant see...for example.
Laws have to accommodate the lowest common denominator but having speed cameras on every road is something that would add little to safety. Fact is in a few years time we will all have black boxes and our movements will be monitored at every turn anyway. The world is to PC to allow people to have a bit of fun any more 'just in case'. When I was a kid and it snowed, we used to head to the local supermarket car parks well after everyone had gone home and have some fun hand braking our cars, spinning around and generally acting like eejits. The police on many occasions came into the car park, had a chat and told us to keep our eyes open and keep the noise down, but to have fun and keep the speeds sensible. That would not happen today, the world has changed.
Irrelevant
So your inference is that my speedo in my brand new Mercedes is possibly 7mph out at 70mph. You think it is therefore most likely that everyone else, in my story above, was doing 70mph and it was me that was measuring it incorrectly? Or ALL of their speedos were miles out?
Some comments on that mindset...
1: My speedo is 1.5mph to 2mph out at 70mph, I measured it with a GPS device, 2 in fact.
2: When in 50mph roadworks I often set it to 50mph and travel at common speed to most cars/lorries around me. Sometimes, being the rebel I am, I set it to 52mph so I can gently and discreetly make a little more progress...I estimate about 2mph more of progress using maths and science.
3: What does the average UK motorist use to measure their speed?
4: Do you honestly think that they allow for a 7mph difference because their speedo is likely 7mph wrong at 70mph or do you think they look at their speedo and use that measure, you know, speed?
I know the point you are trying to make, but in my over 30 years of driving I have never had a speedo 7mph out, not once. I can't think of one more than 3mph out come to think of it.
People use their speedo to measure speed, not GPS devices in the vast amount of cases and most of the cars were travelling significantly faster than 2mph past me, many I would argue were 15mph-40mph faster. I have zero issue with that, I am usually the one going significantly faster.
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Yes but that is not likely is it?
Straw men everywhere but lets focus on the reality. All of the people passing me were going faster and 99% of them were using a speedo to measure their speed so knew they are going faster. I have no issue with that because I too live in the real world and know what 'motorway speed' means.
Ah yes, as I suspected, you’re one of ‘them’.
It was obvious the point he wanted to make from his first post in this thread. He forgets or chooses to ignore this is a motoring forum, so probably frequented by many people who know how accurate speedometers are or how they tend to over read. I said it was irrelevant because it was in the context of my post. He then goes on to tell me all about it, to tell me to test it (when I told him I had, twice) and to make a snide comment about my brand new (winner) Mercedes which was mentioned as a reference to how my speedometer was likely to be a goodun not a seasoned one with the vagaries of time (digital though they are), when I suspect he was thinking it was me bragging about my 300 quid a month lease car.
So then, my R8 V10 Plus, have I mention that today?
So then, my R8 V10 Plus, have I mention that today?
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Old man you
No need to apologise, but credit to you for doing so. Many could learn from that.
Thing is there are too many fast cars in the hands of terrible drivers with little or no experience trying to learn their cars on roads full of others. We have all been there of course, in my day it was less of problem as most the cars were horse drawn, the posh ones steam powered and the roads were far less cluttered. Day 1 of passing my test I took my Mini 1000 to is maximum speed on the A38 near Lichfield, somewhere around the massive heights of 85mph indicated (so probably around 30mph real world) and then nearly missed my braking as I came into an island due to an incredible lack of talent. None of us are immune but today all cars seem to have 110mph + top speeds so getting into danger far more quickly on MUCH busier roads is easy.
The Evo Triangle can be enjoyed at legal speeds in some cars but 70mph-90mph is the sweet spot for the best bits I think, so I am told.... I can understand how that would be a problem for those living around there and I say that as a petrolhead. Having said that there is enjoyment to be had on the right roads, with good visibility and few if any other cars on them. The North Cost 500 will be next to suffer I fear, though that has become a bit more lucrative so it might cause a stink if they camera it.
I am sorry to say having a fast car on UK roads is becoming less and less appealing these days. As someone who started driving in the 'olden days' I have seen a massive change in road conditions. When it snowed we used to go to a local car park at the back of a Safeway and skid our cars around. When it was closed and everyone had gone of course. The Police used to come watch and allow it to go on if we kept sensible. This isn't apocryphal, but can you imagine that happening today? I was pulled many times and let off in the past, even carrying 110mph on the M5 (for I believed and so did the Police officer at the time good reason) back in the 90's. Ask a normal bobby and many have been nicked by a camera, some often and most have disdain for them. But that is modern motoring and it will only get worse.
Road trips with friends are where I take most pleasure from driving these days. Long distances, often into Europe (ideally with some Autobahns) and then a track at the end. The driving is important and great fun, but not the be all and end all of the trip. Often the track stuff takes second place to the beers in the evening and laughs. Sorry boys and girls, you are pretty much ****** moving forward. The king is dead and not going to longer live!
The Evo Triangle can be enjoyed at legal speeds in some cars but 70mph-90mph is the sweet spot for the best bits I think, so I am told.... I can understand how that would be a problem for those living around there and I say that as a petrolhead. Having said that there is enjoyment to be had on the right roads, with good visibility and few if any other cars on them. The North Cost 500 will be next to suffer I fear, though that has become a bit more lucrative so it might cause a stink if they camera it.
I am sorry to say having a fast car on UK roads is becoming less and less appealing these days. As someone who started driving in the 'olden days' I have seen a massive change in road conditions. When it snowed we used to go to a local car park at the back of a Safeway and skid our cars around. When it was closed and everyone had gone of course. The Police used to come watch and allow it to go on if we kept sensible. This isn't apocryphal, but can you imagine that happening today? I was pulled many times and let off in the past, even carrying 110mph on the M5 (for I believed and so did the Police officer at the time good reason) back in the 90's. Ask a normal bobby and many have been nicked by a camera, some often and most have disdain for them. But that is modern motoring and it will only get worse.
Road trips with friends are where I take most pleasure from driving these days. Long distances, often into Europe (ideally with some Autobahns) and then a track at the end. The driving is important and great fun, but not the be all and end all of the trip. Often the track stuff takes second place to the beers in the evening and laughs. Sorry boys and girls, you are pretty much ****** moving forward. The king is dead and not going to longer live!
Drivers, much like different opinions that don't fit other small minorities, have no place in current society sadly. Having said that, you only need to look at some of the YouTube videos of car meets in Essex and other such places to see why perhaps. One can only take so much Burberry.
The A50 between Stoke and Uttoxeter, no not yet.
Not really. I started driving in the mid 80's, I have seen a massive change in motoring.
I've covered the differences but there is now an aggression towards the motorist in some circles, bike riders for example. I never put a cyclist at risk, I never pass close, I give them space without question, never get annoyed at them on their bike but on several occasions I have had issues with angry cyclists doing when they were 100% in the wrong. For example, driving out my house down my local lane to come over a hill at maybe 30mph to see a load of them blocking the road drinking form their bottles. "It's Sunday mate, you should expect it" was their mindset. To add I did not put them at risk, I stopped all I wanted was to get past and that they maybe don't block the road because at a legal 60mph they would have lost and right as they are in their own head, car > bike when it comes to protection.
I have also had the odd clash with speed camera people in my local village, not through doing anything wrong I hasten to add, just because in their words once "well it sounded fast and you are the type we are here for".
I could go on...
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Agreed and too your point, some of the worst driving I have ever seen has been so called elite in their supercars and not all little rich kids either, somethings old farts like me that should know better.
To add I also think context is a good point as well. I have read it here in the past....
"That speed is silly, this one is more sensible" when both are way over a limit. I can break the law because I deem X acceptable but not your Y