Expectations of child services

VincentHanna said:
Do you know something we don't? How do we know the mother wasn't dead/in prison etc?

Are there other articles that explain this or have you assumed?
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None of the various articles I have read on this have suggested anything other than a mother who simply didn't care that she hadn't heard anything about her 2 year old for days. Most semi-reasonable parents would be climbing up the walls if they didn't hear from their 2 year olds care giver for a few days. Let alone a few weeks.

I'm sure more information will come out about this as the tabloids dig into it.
 
Richie said:
Police can only force doors (without warrant) if they believe there is a threat to life, they believe a crime is being committed on the premises at the time or are "in close pursuit of a suspect who flees to a property" (or words to that effect)

If there was no genuine belief of threat to life, they cant force entry.
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Pretty sure there are other times as well.

They broke into a blokes house on my parents street when he went on holiday and turned half the streets water off.
They broke the door down so united utilities could turn the water back on.
 
I think society as become more individualistic, whereas in the past it was more community and family based.

In the short-term to stop this situation happening again is if a child is under social services observation and they can't get access to the child then they should have the legal right to enter the house.

In the long term I think we need to move back towards a community based solution. It would be interesting to see the number of people who have died alone in their house. I know it is something at the back of my mind as a concern.
 
To those saying about people dying alone in their homes, thats obviously sad but very hard to avoid. You can get panic alarms however if you need that sort of thing. Even then that won't save everyone. This is a much more tragic case of a child having so little support and love around them that they went for over a week before they were found. I can't can't imagine how horrible that little boys last few days must have been.
 
BowdonUK said:
I think society as become more individualistic, whereas in the past it was more community and family based.

In the short-term to stop this situation happening again is if a child is under social services observation and they can't get access to the child then they should have the legal right to enter the house.

In the long term I think we need to move back towards a community based solution. It would be interesting to see the number of people who have died alone in their house. I know it is something at the back of my mind as a concern.
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What are you personally doing to embody that idea?
 
slinxy said:
I think society is a lot more lonely at the moment..

If someone passes away and no one expecting them, then there's no one to sound the alarm.

My brother was living in a bedsit by himself, thank god he manage to get out into the street when he had his stoke else his remains could have been there for days or weeks, if no one was expecting to see him or receieve a call. and yes, I am partly to blame.

As a single person living on my own, If someone was to happen to me.. work may question where I was after a few days, my brother may pop round if I don't reply to enough of his calls/messages, the people that I see when I go jogging/gym/yoga may wonder where I am after a few weeks..

Another of brothers had to call the police to check up on his old friend as he didn't see him in the bookies nor the pub, thought he fell out with him for some reason and went round his house.. after a few days then he started to worry and sadly; Pat did pass away alone in his sleep.

But sadly there's some people that don't have the life structure or support network to check up on them.
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Thankfully that worked out ok for your brother, one of my neighbours had a similar thing when he fell down the stairs, in that case the neighbour next to him was in and heard the noise and called the police who as there was a specific reason to fear entered.
At the other end of the spectrum I found out a while back that a guy I'd played online with a lot had died and apparently the only contacts they had were for some of his other online friends who he'd used to chat to on the phone. That really saddened me as I think everyone who knew him online assumed he'd got loads of local friends/family as he was so sociable and ready to organise stuff for the various groups he was involved in.

robj20 said:
Pretty sure there are other times as well.

They broke into a blokes house on my parents street when he went on holiday and turned half the streets water off.
They broke the door down so united utilities could turn the water back on.
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Utilities are one of the few times when IIRC they don't need a warrant as it can affect the safety and wellbeing of others.


Basically for the police to actually force entry without a warrant they need a very good (relatively limited number of) legal reasons where they have the specific power, and it's almost always going to be "immediate danger to the public" in some way or other.
 
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Heartbreaking.

When I was having my young kids at weekends as a single Dad, over 10 years ago now, I went through a phase of being incredibly scared that I wouldn't wake up, and that they would be left alone, scared. I had to have counseling for it, it was that upsetting. For a while my parents had to stay over to reassure me.

And it's what has happened to this kid. Absolutely horrible.

Don't know what the answer is unfortunately, there probably isn't one.
 
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robj20 said:
Pretty sure there are other times as well.

They broke into a blokes house on my parents street when he went on holiday and turned half the streets water off.
They broke the door down so united utilities could turn the water back on.
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I'd imagine that could come under threat to life TBH... All I am saying is that the police have very limited powers as to when they are able to force entry to a private residence and one of them isn't becuase someone hasnt answered the door for a few days (without other evidence like smells of death coming from the property etc)

fez said:
To those saying about people dying alone in their homes, thats obviously sad but very hard to avoid. You can get panic alarms however if you need that sort of thing. Even then that won't save everyone.
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Could happen less as time goes on what with the rise of smart device usage (watches/fitness bands) which can monitor heart rhythms. For now, they will alert emergency services and named contacts if the device thinks you have fallen or been involved in a vehicle crash. Not too much to extend that to alerting the same people when it fails to feel a heartbeat (with certain problems to over come like when people take the watch off)
 
dlockers said:
You suggested moving towards a community feel is a good idea. Do you do anything in your life to move towards that ideal?
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I think my life is unique to most peoples because of my background I've always been life limited so I'm aware that I sometimes need help. So I will go out of my way to help others.

When one of my friends brother died through being murdered I was the only one to make contact with him.

I've noticed when situations occur that aren't regular experiences people seem to become uncomfortable and tend to avoid engaging. It is easier for them to just avoid the situation (I've experienced a similar reaction in how people react in person to my disabilities).

At the moment I'm 13 months bedbound because of covid damage so my ability to help others is limited. But I try to do the best to spread awareness of mortality and to plan for it, even if it might be to late for me.

I'm not the ending my own life type. But I have seen people online in my situation that are heading that way. So I try to give them comfort and hope that there will be a solution soon.

I think if I can't get out of the house then at least making contact and sending a message is the least I can do.
 
Read about this earlier, such a horrible story; that poor kid :(

It sounded like the social work actually did quite a lot, contacting the police multiple times, getting keys from landlord etc. Sadly just took too long.

I want to know where the mother was, and why she wasn't doing mothering things, like at least contacting her child over Christmas??
 
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I've not read the specific story, because I prefer not to, but the whole structure of children's services up and down the country is totally broken. I have a lot of dealings with them and speak to a wide array of parents. Chronically underfunded, and it's a horrible job. Children of all types (bad parenting, disabilities, health issues etc) are being totally let down.

Ultimately unless we plough a lot more money into it, I can't see how it's going to change - and over recent years the government has been very reluctant to give more direct funding to councils.
 
Heard this on the radio coming home from work. Just absolutely awful.
I remember my kids being two like it was yesterday. The thought.....well, I don't want to think about it.
 
danlightbulb said:
Heartbreaking.

When I was having my young kids at weekends as a single Dad, over 10 years ago now, I went through a phase of being incredibly scared that I wouldn't wake up, and that they would be left alone, scared. I had to have counseling for it, it was that upsetting. For a while my parents had to stay over to reassure me.

And it's what has happened to this kid. Absolutely horrible.

Don't know what the answer is unfortunately, there probably isn't one.
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This story really got to me to me today. I havent cried in years but I did thinking about this poor kids last days on my drive home to see my son this evening. Like you, I've had similar dreams recently where something has happened to me and my toddler has been left to fend for himself and its heartbreaking and really knocks the confidence.

Regardless of how it came to pass, it's tragic and I can't imagine how awful that poor boys last days were.

/Salsa
 
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