Explain this!

Goksly · 16 Apr 2006 at 16:02

Tommy B said:
Why exactly should consumers be expected to spend £400 on a 7900GTX or a 1900XTX when Direct X 10 cards are round the corner?

Am I missing something?

Cant explain why someone would want to spend £400 on a GTX. Thats just crazy!

TLJester1 · 16 Apr 2006 at 16:16

Exsomnis said:
Naw the Crysis video from a while back with volumetric clouds, soft shadows, advanced flora, advanced physics, and motion blur was supposedly showcasing DirectX 10. It's the main reason Crysis is so hyped, and rightly so, because I know I can't wait for it.

Will it be playable at E3 and do you have any firm release date yet?
Cevat Yerli: It will definitely be playable at E3 and we're shooting for winter 2006 right now. We don't have to wait until Vista ships either.

Bernd Diemer Everything you've seen has been running on DX9 and normal hardware you can get in the shops right now. It's all normal spec and doesn't even use a dual processor or anything like that, we don't have any special graphical hardware inside these boxes. However, with DX10 and a dual core CPU, you're going to see something very special indeed. When we compare Far Cry to Crysis we're talking about two to three levels better in terms of generations, but if you compare DX 9 to DX10 it's at least a generation better, so there's a tangible difference, visually as well as from the intensity.

from : http://www.computerandvideogames.co...erviews/interviews_story.php?id=137279&page=4

Darkwave · 16 Apr 2006 at 16:23

TLJester1 said:
Will it be playable at E3 and do you have any firm release date yet?
Cevat Yerli: It will definitely be playable at E3 and we're shooting for winter 2006 right now. We don't have to wait until Vista ships either.

Bernd Diemer Everything you've seen has been running on DX9 and normal hardware you can get in the shops right now. It's all normal spec and doesn't even use a dual processor or anything like that, we don't have any special graphical hardware inside these boxes. However, with DX10 and a dual core CPU, you're going to see something very special indeed. When we compare Far Cry to Crysis we're talking about two to three levels better in terms of generations, but if you compare DX 9 to DX10 it's at least a generation better, so there's a tangible difference, visually as well as from the intensity.

from : http://www.computerandvideogames.co...erviews/interviews_story.php?id=137279&page=4

That's why I said supposedly, I wasn't entirely sure if it was totally rendered in DirectX 10 or not. It's a good thing I was wrong, because if those sneak peaks for Crysis were done on DirectX 9.0c hardware, imagine how much better the game is going to look, and how faster it is going to run, on DirectX 10 hardware.

Truth be told, I will not be stuck on DirectX 9.0c hardware when that game, and other games utilising DirectX 10, come out.

Shader Model 3.0 was a totally unimportant feature until recently (and still is to many people, including myself), but I have a feeling that DirectX 10 is going to be a blast from the get-go.

superpc · 16 Apr 2006 at 16:43

I would never spend £400 on a Card anyway! Look how quickly they come down in price too! Best to wait till prices fall.

TLJester1 · 16 Apr 2006 at 16:51

Do you know what DX/Shader Model Unreal Engine 3 uses, and Cell Factor? In fact any other good games on the horizon that you can think of!

Darkwave · 16 Apr 2006 at 17:32

TLJester1 said:
Do you know what DX/Shader Model Unreal Engine 3 uses, and Cell Factor? In fact any other good games on the horizon that you can think of!

Are you mad because I said something negative about Shader Model 3.0? Please don't take it the wrong way, because we're all entitled to our opinion, and I was simply stating mine. To me SM 3.0 is not essential, nor a big deal, but DirectX 10 sounds very impressive from what I've heard so far, especially its use in the Vista GUI.

If you think otherwise, more power to you.

TLJester1 · 16 Apr 2006 at 17:48

Exsomnis said:
Are you mad because I said something negative about Shader Model 3.0? Please don't take it the wrong way, because we're all entitled to our opinion, and I was simply stating mine. To me SM 3.0 is not essential, nor a big deal, but DirectX 10 sounds very impressive from what I've heard so far, especially its use in the Vista GUI.

If you think otherwise, more power to you.

HEY HEY - calm down !!!!
Hopefully i am not mad

There is no hidden message in that question. I just dont know what tech the new engines are using. If i buy a card I just want to know that the engine that powers the most games i want to play will perform best on it ie Doom3 engine powers several games etc. Also want to know that the cards tech will last long enough. Seems that the only engine to use DX10 SM4 is the Crysis one, which - as i didnt really enjoy Far Cry - I dont care too much about.

Darkwave · 16 Apr 2006 at 17:50

TLJester1 said:
HEY HEY - calm down !!!!
Hopefully i am not mad
There is no hidden message in that question. I just dont know what tech the new engines are using. If i buy a card I just want to know that the engine that powers the most games i want to play will perform best on it ie Doom3 engine powers several games etc. Also want to know that the cards tech will last long enough. Seems that the only engine to use DX10 SM4 is the Crysis one, which - as i didnt really enjoy Far Cry - I dont care too much about.

I wasn't getting mad, I thought you were. lol.

Ah well, at least neither of us is mad.

I'm not sure what engines and shader models upcoming titles will use, but I assume they'll all support SM2 and SM3 since, as you said, Crysis at least will be able to run on current hardware without problems.

TLJester1 · 16 Apr 2006 at 17:56

Exsomnis said:
I wasn't getting mad, I thought you were. lol. Ah well, at least neither of us is mad.

I'm not sure what engines and shader models upcoming titles will use, but I assume they'll all support SM2 and SM3 since, as you said, Crysis at least will be able to run on current hardware without problems.

So aside from Crysis there is nothing on the horizon to use DX10/SM4 ?
I assume that everything else IS using SM3 though ?
Are there any other engines that I havent considerd ?

Darkwave · 16 Apr 2006 at 18:00

TLJester1 said:
So aside from Crysis there is nothing on the horizon to use DX10/SM4 ?
I assume that everything else IS using SM3 though ?
Are there any other engines that I havent considerd ?

Isn't Project Offset to apparently going to make great use of next-gen shaders etc? I can't remember exactly. I've been stuck out of the loop the last few months with waiting for and playing Oblivion.

TLJester1 · 16 Apr 2006 at 19:10

Found some info on Projet Offset (as I had never heard of it).
Seems to be SM3, but maybe with a bit of a speed boost from SM4...
http://www.atomicmpc.com/article.asp?SCID=15&CIID=36291&p=1

Darkwave · 16 Apr 2006 at 19:18

TLJester1 said:
Found some info on Projet Offset (as I had never heard of it).
Seems to be SM3, but maybe with a bit of a speed boost from SM4...
http://www.atomicmpc.com/article.asp?SCID=15&CIID=36291&p=1

Ready, set, drool!

http://uk.media.pc.ign.com/media/752/752218/vids_1.html

Tommy B · 16 Apr 2006 at 19:39

Oh what the hell I'll just grab an X1900XTX now and upgrade at xmas.

Actually is it worth the extra X if I'm running at 1280x1024?

And will there defo be no more cards out before Nov?

man_from_uncle · 16 Apr 2006 at 19:41

It's not really ever worth the extra 'X'. I've not heard of an 1900XT that couldn't get to XTX speeds (though further overclocking headroom may vary). From what i've seen there is a very small gap between them, much smaller than the gap between the 7800gt and the 7800gtx for example.

Darkwave · 16 Apr 2006 at 20:10

man_from_uncle said:
It's not really ever worth the extra 'X'.

This man speaks the truth. You'd be paying almost £50 for that extra 25MHz core and a printed "X" on a box, I don't know about you but I wouldn't personally consider that value. I'm sure most XTs clock that high just fine.

Tommy B · 16 Apr 2006 at 20:55

Exsomnis said:
This man speaks the truth. You'd be paying almost £50 for that extra 25MHz core and a printed "X" on a box, I don't know about you but I wouldn't personally consider that value. I'm sure most XTs clock that high just fine.

You are both right. Which X1900XT should I buy then?

Is it OK to rule out the 7900GTX?

Darkwave · 16 Apr 2006 at 21:00

Tommy B said:
You are both right. Which X1900XT should I buy then?

If you feel like saving just under £20 then go for the PowerColor model, but I always strongly reccommend Sapphire products for no specific reason. They just tend to be more reliable and clock better, but that's just my experience.

Tommy B said:
Is it OK to rule out the 7900GTX?

It's your money, I wouldn't rule anything out. You should check out some benchmarks and compare costs, that'll make it a lot easier to decide.

It should be noted that the 7900GTX costs quite a fortune though.

gary996 · 16 Apr 2006 at 21:09

imho i think the CPU companies need to catch up with the GPU companies. Its all a big bottleneck at the moment. Game manufacturers need to implement dual core to its full advantage. Where an X2 running a 2.4 is twice as fast as a single core running at 2.4. As it stands at the mment its not. I hope conroe is going to do something about this but untill then I sit and watch. As for me I'm not upgrading until the new cards and procs come out.

TLJester1 · 16 Apr 2006 at 21:36

gary996 said:
As for me I'm not upgrading until the new cards and procs come out.

looking at your spec, do you have anything left to upgrade ? !!!

Tommy B · 16 Apr 2006 at 23:11

I think I'll grab a Sapphire X1900XT. My Radeon 9700 Pro was by them and it was excellent. A few questions though:

1) Are the prices of the current cards likely to fall over the next few months?

2) Will ATI and Nvidia wait for DX10 now, or could they release another set of cards before next November?

3) When the DX10 cards come out, won't there be a mass exodus? Doesn't that mean that selling off the X1900XT will be very hard?

4) Was upgrading from the 7800GTX to the X1900XT at a net cost of £100 worth it? To be fair, a relative offered to pay the £100 but still, it could have gone elsewhere