Hatred for DRL's

JBeck · 26 Feb 2014 at 09:20

Dogbreath said:
I don't agree with your conclusion though, simply seeing things doesn't stop people making stupid maneuvers. I've had people look directly at me and then pull out of a junction.

Which gives more weight to your defence if something happens. The idiots have no excuse whatsoever, they look directly at you, with your lights on, and still pull out.

I personally run with my side lights on all the time, even though the car is bright yellow, just for that fact. If someone does something stupid they can't say 'I didn't see you'.

Matt82 · 26 Feb 2014 at 09:26

I saw a car lastnight, at about 9pm, driving about with only DRLs on.

Although the car was recession white, the road was poorly lit so the car didnt stand out that well against the parked cars. THe car did have DRLs which did make it visible and clear that it was moving.

If it saved one life that night, like Loreal, its worth it.

ubersonic · 26 Feb 2014 at 09:37

Simian said:
What's your opinions on Daylight Running Lights???

Don't like them myself, the are campaigns to ban them in the US/Canada and even here due to their safety issues. In fact IIRC Austria has either banned them or granted it's cars exemption to the EU rules on them?

To be honest though they are in no way shape or form anywhere near as bad as flashing cycle lights, why a vehicle light that does nothing to aid the vision of the user and turns them into a gigantic rolling distraction and a danger to themselves and others was made legal in the UK I will never understand.

MagicBoy · 26 Feb 2014 at 12:55

Scania said:
Even truck manufacturers are starting to fit them, nothing about bling, it's all about visibility (and believe me, often trucks seem invisible!!)

It's not a choice, EU rules dictated DRLs in order to pass type approval from early 2011 for cars/vans and autumn 2012 for trucks/buses.

Rilot · 26 Feb 2014 at 13:03

My issue with DRLs is that - with time - people will get so used to them that cars without them (who are not driving with headlamps on) will effectively become invisible.
It will be: Look left, look right, didn't see any lights, pull out, SMASH!

With the law regarding cars from 2011 onwards having DRLs in the EU, they should have made sidelight or dipped beams mandatory for all cars too.

MagicBoy · 26 Feb 2014 at 13:19

Rilot said:
With the law regarding cars from 2011 onwards having DRLs in the EU, they should have made sidelight or dipped beams mandatory for all cars too.

The UK implemented dim/dip in the late 80s which ran the dipped beam at reduced voltage if DRLs were not already fitted (ie Volvo/SAAB). Shortly after the EU stuck their oar in and took the Government to court IIRC, who lost.

NathWraith · 26 Feb 2014 at 13:20

because the DRLs on the fabia look like you have your fogs on all the time and make people want to kill you

ttaskmaster · 26 Feb 2014 at 13:34

Simian said:
Where does all the Hatred for Daylight Running Lights come from?

For car drivers, it is most likely twofold:

1/. Having lights on during clear daylight is often perceived by other drivers as an aggressive move. Whether this is your intention or not, you're reinforcing your presence and 'bigging yourself up', as it were, kinda like animals do to fend off predators. Drivers respond aggressively to this.

2/. So many drivers in the UK don't bother to ensure their lights are properly aligned, so even 'dipped beam' dazzles oncoming vehicles and at night can properly blind them. HID kits and the like just make it worse!!

Generally, drivers tend to under-estimate the speed of a vehicle approaching them with headlights on.

There's also the fact that it makes motorcycles harder to see and robs them of the visibility they create by having their lights on. To a driver pulling out from a side road, the bike's headlight will look something like this:

Yes, having DRLs may save the life of one car driver... but subtract from that the lives of three bikers... and often whoever SMIDSYs/pulls out on them. My bike weighs 42 stone - Unless your side window is rocket-proof, if you pull out on that bike you'll probably be as much a meat waggon write-off as I will!!

Read more here: http://www.dadrl.org.uk/DRLstudies.html

NathWraith · 26 Feb 2014 at 13:44

good post man, better put than I could have.

panthro · 26 Feb 2014 at 14:56

The_Abyss said:
Within 3 years most new cars will deliver with full LED headlights. Deal with it.

That will not happen. Conventional bulb headlight units are the cheaper.

TheVoice · 26 Feb 2014 at 15:07

panthro said:
That will not happen. Conventional bulb headlight units are the cheaper.

Agreed. Considering neither HIDs nor rear LEDs are standard fit on most ranges, it'll be at least a decade before LED headlights are common on anything other than high-end vehicles.

ubersonic · 26 Feb 2014 at 15:40

All the street lights round here were changed to LEDs recently, the residents are all campaigning to get them removed as it's apparently far too bright at night

platypus · 26 Feb 2014 at 16:43

Dr Who said:
I get why bikes have their lights on as they are harder to see, cars though, not so much.

"oh you cannot see my huge white Mercedes in broad daylight so I bought one with lights permanently on"

Is this not part of the problem with mandatory DRLs? They simply add to the wash of light, so make it harder for motorcyclists/cyclists' front lights to be picked out?

Edit: much more eloquently put by ttaskmaster above.

86JR · 26 Feb 2014 at 16:53

I think the larger issue here is why does the UK let the EU dictate what we can and can't do in our country. Can anyone give me any benefits of being in the EU? Because it seems we are just a dumping ground for people that brussels don't want and a testing ground for draconian laws.

ttaskmaster · 26 Feb 2014 at 17:12

86JR said:
Can anyone give me any benefits of being in the EU?

This, apparently: http://www.euromove.org.uk/index.php?id=15296
Note that I haven't actually bothered to even skim-read this myself. I am mainly posting purely for comedic effect and on the off chance that you find it interesting!!

NathWraith · 26 Feb 2014 at 17:21

panthro said:
That will not happen. Conventional bulb headlight units are the cheaper.

This was proved to me today when I drove past a 63 plate A5 sport back (the 4 door one), amusingly in "recession white", it had reflector headlights.

I would have the A5 sport back down as a premium car, which saddens me really seeing marques cutting corners.

I'm gonna make an educated guess that it was a 2.0TDi but I never saw the rear.

[TW]Fox · 26 Feb 2014 at 17:35

The 3 Series and 1 Series range up to and including 335i M Sport and 125i M Sport also have reflector lenses rather than projectors.

Projectors have been around for 25 years, it's amazing to see premium manufacturers still deliberately cheapening the front end look of cars by using reflectors.

panthro · 26 Feb 2014 at 17:47

Yep it is a shame, but I think it's more a case of ensuring the cheapest option meets the minimum requirements and saying "if you want it you pay for it".

JBeck · 26 Feb 2014 at 17:57

ttaskmaster said:
For car drivers, it is most likely twofold:

1/. Having lights on during clear daylight is often perceived by other drivers as an aggressive move. Whether this is your intention or not, you're reinforcing your presence and 'bigging yourself up', as it were, kinda like animals do to fend off predators. Drivers respond aggressively to this.

2/. So many drivers in the UK don't bother to ensure their lights are properly aligned, so even 'dipped beam' dazzles oncoming vehicles and at night can properly blind them. HID kits and the like just make it worse!!

Generally, drivers tend to under-estimate the speed of a vehicle approaching them with headlights on.

There's also the fact that it makes motorcycles harder to see and robs them of the visibility they create by having their lights on. To a driver pulling out from a side road, the bike's headlight will look something like this:

Yes, having DRLs may save the life of one car driver... but subtract from that the lives of three bikers... and often whoever SMIDSYs/pulls out on them. My bike weighs 42 stone - Unless your side window is rocket-proof, if you pull out on that bike you'll probably be as much a meat waggon write-off as I will!!

Read more here: http://www.dadrl.org.uk/DRLstudies.html

But what you are saying refers to headlights being on, how can sidelights or DRL's be classed as an 'aggressive move'? Same for alignment, this only refers to main headlights, I don't ever see anyone driving with their main headlights on in the day time.

On the biker argument, how do you know the car only has one driver in it? What about the three kids and the wife? Should I not drive with any lights on then to try and start a trend for other car drivers to follow, so they don't pull out on any bikers? I suppose while I'm doing that it's ok for a lorry to pull out on me, perhaps because he didn't see me as easy as he would if I had had my lights on?

Not so black and white, is it.

[TW]Fox · 26 Feb 2014 at 18:08

86JR said:
I think the larger issue here is why does the UK let the EU dictate what we can and can't do in our country. Can anyone give me any benefits of being in the EU?

There are lots - mobile phones for example. Numerous EU laws have made mobile phone call charges far cheaper than ever before.